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Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread

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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#481 » by Zasterror » Thu Jan 14, 2021 3:20 pm

The Harden overreaction from this fan base is laughable. This is the NBA. Players get disgruntled, players wants change of scenario, etc. There will be other players for the picking. We didn't lose anything.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#482 » by AirP. » Thu Jan 14, 2021 3:28 pm

HIF wrote:Perhaps you can get a job in the Miami FO. You talk such pessimistic BS. Can't you be happy with a team that tries hard, plays well and gives you excitement week in week out?


That's the expectation of a small market team with no real chance at a Championship unless all the stars align properly. I'm actually fine with a fun hard working team but this team has the ability to attract FA, has a great coach, has a 31 year old star, Miami should have been going all out to add another offensive star and with success and it's location been able to draw more talent in FA to Miami especially with Bam signed in Miami long term.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#483 » by Bishop45 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:21 pm

Zasterror wrote:The Harden overreaction from this fan base is laughable. This is the NBA. Players get disgruntled, players wants change of scenario, etc. There will be other players for the picking. We didn't lose anything.


I'm not tripping over it, but top 5 players don't land on the trade market every day. And for what he went for, we could have completed with.

If I were to believe Bron, Steph, KD might fall on the market at any moment, then it'd be different. But that's a rare thing
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#484 » by MiamiLoyal926 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:25 pm

AirP. wrote:
MiamiLoyal926 wrote:Did all of you who are upset about missing out on Harden see that it is being reported that Ben Simmons, Thybulle, and picks was offered by the sixers? The Rockets chose what they wanted to choose. If that was the cost for the Sixers, and it took 8 picks plus lavert and Allen to get Harden, then our cost would have been way to steep. Stop losing sleep over this one. Getting fleeced sucks, so be glad we didn’t and that we still have flexibility to find a better situation for us.


You think Brooklyn got fleeced? Personally I don't consider late 1st round picks really worth all that much, once you get in the 20s it's a crap shoot, some years you can find good players in the early 20s, some years not so much.

Looking at what Brooklyn gave up...
* Unprotected 1sts - 2022, 2024, 2026 - 2022 and 2024 probably will be late 1sts, 2026 has a chance of being decent to a great pick.
* Swap 1sts - 2021, 2023, 2025, 2027 - 2021 and 2023 probably no swap happens, maybe 2025 and 2027 could happen.
* Traded 2 good younger players in LeVert and Allen. KD wanted his buddy D.Jordan starting and now he has that. I'm not so sure Brooklyn was going to pay Allen to keep him this summer. LeVert is good but he is also a health risk, it's why he dropped in the draft and we've seen him miss a lot of time in the NBA.

So from my perspective the only real value Brooklyn gave up was 2 unprotected 1st round picks in 2024, 2026, swaps in 2025 and 2027, and 2 good young players in LeVert and Allen for 2 or more years of a MVP caliber players. Who knows how good those swaps will be, if Houston isn't good in 2025 or 2027 it may not hurt Brooklyn all that much to swap down.

Also, I think KD and Harden will be good into their mid maybe late 30s, Kryie probably isn't there much longer, could be gone this year, could be gone in the next 2 years.

I guess it all depends on what you think Brooklyn will look like in 4 years vs what Houston will look like in 4 years, I'd think Brooklyn (who just landed 2 top tier FA last year) will continue to be able to restock at least decent talent in FA.

Houston should have gotten Simmons from the 76ers, showcased him as the main guy for a year and then sold high on him in a year or 2.


My point is that they chose the Nets’ deal for a reason despite having what many would consider a better deal on the table from the sixers. What would it have taken from us to edge out those 2 deals? Likely something we all would consider as us being fleeced and resulting in a depletion of 6 years worth of asset gathering all in one hit!
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#485 » by BenoUdrihFTL » Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:56 pm

MiamiLoyal926 wrote:Did all of you who are upset about missing out on Harden see that it is being reported that Ben Simmons, Thybulle, and picks was offered by the sixers? The Rockets chose what they wanted to choose. If that was the cost for the Sixers, and it took 8 picks plus lavert and Allen to get Harden, then our cost would have been way to steep. Stop losing sleep over this one. Getting fleeced sucks, so be glad we didn’t and that we still have flexibility to find a better situation for us.

Yep just saw that in the wiretap headlines. We had no shot at Harden, so time to move on from something that was never gonna happen anyways

My major frustration yesterday was when HOU acquired Dipo. But now it's sounding like he still wants to get to Miami. So feelin a bit better about that as well lol
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#486 » by MettaWorldPanda » Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:58 pm

Oladipo has a great relationship with our current players and idolizes Dwyane Wade. We need to get him here ASAP and form a super explosive backcourt of Dipo and Herro. Bring Duncan off the bench.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#487 » by HIF » Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:02 pm

AirP. wrote:
HIF wrote:Perhaps you can get a job in the Miami FO. You talk such pessimistic BS. Can't you be happy with a team that tries hard, plays well and gives you excitement week in week out?


That's the expectation of a small market team with no real chance at a Championship unless all the stars align properly. I'm actually fine with a fun hard working team but this team has the ability to attract FA, has a great coach, has a 31 year old star, Miami should have been going all out to add another offensive star and with success and it's location been able to draw more talent in FA to Miami especially with Bam signed in Miami long term.


Guess you're going to have a long unhappy life with those expectations pal.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#488 » by Kobewade11 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:06 pm

MettaWorldPanda wrote:Oladipo has a great relationship with our current players and idolizes Dwyane Wade. We need to get him here ASAP and form a super explosive backcourt of Dipo and Herro. Bring Duncan off the bench.


Houston is probably in no rush to move him. Might be available at the deadline.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#489 » by HerroBalls » Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:57 pm

Lol so Houston apparently wanted

Herro
Duncan
Precious
Nunn
Kelly
Iggy
2 1sts
4 swaps



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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#490 » by shanedude » Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:57 pm

MettaWorldPanda wrote:Oladipo has a great relationship with our current players and idolizes Dwyane Wade. We need to get him here ASAP and form a super explosive backcourt of Dipo and Herro. Bring Duncan off the bench.


This is the way. Bringing Duncan off the bench might even help with contract negotiations.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#491 » by BFRESH44 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:01 pm

Would not surprise me to see Dipo and Tucker on this team by the March trade deadline. If not sooner.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#492 » by Bishop45 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:17 pm

MettaWorldPanda wrote:Oladipo has a great relationship with our current players and idolizes Dwyane Wade. We need to get him here ASAP and form a super explosive backcourt of Dipo and Herro. Bring Duncan off the bench.


Probably going to have to wait for offseason if we want a chance at him and keeping all the young guys
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#493 » by QUIZ » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:20 pm

Oladipo/Tucker/Daniel House

For

Kelly/Iggy/Nunn plus our 2025 first works.

It would be hard to match salaries for Oladipo alone without including both Iggy and Kelly since Meyers can't be traded yet. I think I can live with that package.

Herro/Goran/Vincent
Oladipo/Bradley/House
Jimmy/Duncan/Strus
Tucker/Okpala/Silva
Bam/Precious/Meyers
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#494 » by AirP. » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:21 pm

HIF wrote:
AirP. wrote:
HIF wrote:Perhaps you can get a job in the Miami FO. You talk such pessimistic BS. Can't you be happy with a team that tries hard, plays well and gives you excitement week in week out?


That's the expectation of a small market team with no real chance at a Championship unless all the stars align properly. I'm actually fine with a fun hard working team but this team has the ability to attract FA, has a great coach, has a 31 year old star, Miami should have been going all out to add another offensive star and with success and it's location been able to draw more talent in FA to Miami especially with Bam signed in Miami long term.


Guess you're going to have a long unhappy life with those expectations pal.

Not at all, I just kept hearing Miami is/was about Championships with Riley and with that have expectations that they'd make way more moves then they have since getting Butler. Most years I followed basketball I've not expected the team I'm following to win a championship, it's why when the ability to compete for a title is finally there for a team it just confuses me why the team doesn't go for it, championships don't happen all that often for most teams. Look at Toronto, they got rid of one of their top players who was very loyal and a fan favorite in a package to rent Kawhi and have a shot at a title, even had they not won it all, it was the type of move a franchise of any size should do if a championship is somewhat a priority for that franchise.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#495 » by QUIZ » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:22 pm

Bishop45 wrote:
MettaWorldPanda wrote:Oladipo has a great relationship with our current players and idolizes Dwyane Wade. We need to get him here ASAP and form a super explosive backcourt of Dipo and Herro. Bring Duncan off the bench.


Probably going to have to wait for offseason if we want a chance at him and keeping all the young guys

I think we could get him for a Goran type package. Meaning popo filler plus 2 picks. I think I'd draw the line at just the 2025 pick. Hopefully its far enough out that the Rockets value it a lot. Jimmy will be like 36 in 2025.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#496 » by oreon » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:22 pm

BFRESH44 wrote:Would not surprise me to see Dipo and Tucker on this team by the March trade deadline. If not sooner.


Dipo you can get for free, why waste assets on him. But Tucker for sure. He's not quite as athletic as Crowder but he can replace what Crowder did. We need a 4/3 that can defend KD, Giannis so that Bam doesn't have to. I'd give up Nunn for Tucker, I think Nunn is restricted this summer and he's not coming back. But maybe Heat are saving Nunn as another asset for Beal if Beal becomes available
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#497 » by AirP. » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:27 pm

MiamiLoyal926 wrote:
AirP. wrote:
MiamiLoyal926 wrote:Did all of you who are upset about missing out on Harden see that it is being reported that Ben Simmons, Thybulle, and picks was offered by the sixers? The Rockets chose what they wanted to choose. If that was the cost for the Sixers, and it took 8 picks plus lavert and Allen to get Harden, then our cost would have been way to steep. Stop losing sleep over this one. Getting fleeced sucks, so be glad we didn’t and that we still have flexibility to find a better situation for us.


You think Brooklyn got fleeced? Personally I don't consider late 1st round picks really worth all that much, once you get in the 20s it's a crap shoot, some years you can find good players in the early 20s, some years not so much.

Looking at what Brooklyn gave up...
* Unprotected 1sts - 2022, 2024, 2026 - 2022 and 2024 probably will be late 1sts, 2026 has a chance of being decent to a great pick.
* Swap 1sts - 2021, 2023, 2025, 2027 - 2021 and 2023 probably no swap happens, maybe 2025 and 2027 could happen.
* Traded 2 good younger players in LeVert and Allen. KD wanted his buddy D.Jordan starting and now he has that. I'm not so sure Brooklyn was going to pay Allen to keep him this summer. LeVert is good but he is also a health risk, it's why he dropped in the draft and we've seen him miss a lot of time in the NBA.

So from my perspective the only real value Brooklyn gave up was 2 unprotected 1st round picks in 2024, 2026, swaps in 2025 and 2027, and 2 good young players in LeVert and Allen for 2 or more years of a MVP caliber players. Who knows how good those swaps will be, if Houston isn't good in 2025 or 2027 it may not hurt Brooklyn all that much to swap down.

Also, I think KD and Harden will be good into their mid maybe late 30s, Kryie probably isn't there much longer, could be gone this year, could be gone in the next 2 years.

I guess it all depends on what you think Brooklyn will look like in 4 years vs what Houston will look like in 4 years, I'd think Brooklyn (who just landed 2 top tier FA last year) will continue to be able to restock at least decent talent in FA.

Houston should have gotten Simmons from the 76ers, showcased him as the main guy for a year and then sold high on him in a year or 2.


My point is that they chose the Nets’ deal for a reason despite having what many would consider a better deal on the table from the sixers. What would it have taken from us to edge out those 2 deals? Likely something we all would consider as us being fleeced and resulting in a depletion of 6 years worth of asset gathering all in one hit!

Sounds like it would have taken this below and I would have done that trade but I can see the argument of not doing it.
Bradley, Harden, Butler, Bam, Leonard with Dragic, Harkless, Strus, and KZ off the bench and of course, going out and signing some free agents like RHJ, Dedmon, G.Green and so on... fringe/roleplayers.

I value swaps VERY VERY LOW in certain situations like the one Miami and Houston would have been in, when it's a quality team vs a bad team. You can expect to be a good team for a long time with Bam in Miami long-term.

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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#498 » by oreon » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:36 pm

AirP. wrote:
MiamiLoyal926 wrote:
AirP. wrote:
You think Brooklyn got fleeced? Personally I don't consider late 1st round picks really worth all that much, once you get in the 20s it's a crap shoot, some years you can find good players in the early 20s, some years not so much.

Looking at what Brooklyn gave up...
* Unprotected 1sts - 2022, 2024, 2026 - 2022 and 2024 probably will be late 1sts, 2026 has a chance of being decent to a great pick.
* Swap 1sts - 2021, 2023, 2025, 2027 - 2021 and 2023 probably no swap happens, maybe 2025 and 2027 could happen.
* Traded 2 good younger players in LeVert and Allen. KD wanted his buddy D.Jordan starting and now he has that. I'm not so sure Brooklyn was going to pay Allen to keep him this summer. LeVert is good but he is also a health risk, it's why he dropped in the draft and we've seen him miss a lot of time in the NBA.

So from my perspective the only real value Brooklyn gave up was 2 unprotected 1st round picks in 2024, 2026, swaps in 2025 and 2027, and 2 good young players in LeVert and Allen for 2 or more years of a MVP caliber players. Who knows how good those swaps will be, if Houston isn't good in 2025 or 2027 it may not hurt Brooklyn all that much to swap down.

Also, I think KD and Harden will be good into their mid maybe late 30s, Kryie probably isn't there much longer, could be gone this year, could be gone in the next 2 years.

I guess it all depends on what you think Brooklyn will look like in 4 years vs what Houston will look like in 4 years, I'd think Brooklyn (who just landed 2 top tier FA last year) will continue to be able to restock at least decent talent in FA.

Houston should have gotten Simmons from the 76ers, showcased him as the main guy for a year and then sold high on him in a year or 2.


My point is that they chose the Nets’ deal for a reason despite having what many would consider a better deal on the table from the sixers. What would it have taken from us to edge out those 2 deals? Likely something we all would consider as us being fleeced and resulting in a depletion of 6 years worth of asset gathering all in one hit!

Sounds like it would have taken this below and I would have done that trade but I can see the argument of not doing it.
Bradley, Harden, Butler, Bam, Leonard with Dragic, Harkless, Strus, and KZ off the bench and of course, going out and signing some free agents like RHJ, Dedmon, G.Green and so on... fringe/roleplayers.

I value swaps VERY VERY LOW in certain situations like the one Miami and Houston would have been in, when it's a quality team vs a bad team. You can expect to be a good team for a long time with Bam in Miami long-term.

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Riley doesn't care about picks. I think the Heat might be holding out for Beal. Culture wise and age he's more of a fit than Harden. I would prefer that as well. I'd love to see a 3 team deal where we get Tucker and Beal for all of our assets (minus Robinson) if we can. A team of Bam, Tucker, Beal, Butler, Robinson would be the favs in the East.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#499 » by greg4012 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:50 pm

oreon wrote:
BFRESH44 wrote:Would not surprise me to see Dipo and Tucker on this team by the March trade deadline. If not sooner.


Dipo you can get for free, why waste assets on him. But Tucker for sure. He's not quite as athletic as Crowder but he can replace what Crowder did. We need a 4/3 that can defend KD, Giannis so that Bam doesn't have to. I'd give up Nunn for Tucker, I think Nunn is restricted this summer and he's not coming back. But maybe Heat are saving Nunn as another asset for Beal if Beal becomes available


The answer is to put ourselves in best position to compete NOW during Jimmy's peak window. Trading for Dipo gives us strength for this season. We were 2 wins away from a ship last year. This is our window. Next window will be a post-Jimmy one where Bam needs to recruit his friends as they become free agents.
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Re: Goodbye pre-season! 2020-2021 regular season thread 

Post#500 » by Bishop45 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:52 pm

QUIZ wrote:
Bishop45 wrote:
MettaWorldPanda wrote:Oladipo has a great relationship with our current players and idolizes Dwyane Wade. We need to get him here ASAP and form a super explosive backcourt of Dipo and Herro. Bring Duncan off the bench.


Probably going to have to wait for offseason if we want a chance at him and keeping all the young guys

I think we could get him for a Goran type package. Meaning popo filler plus 2 picks. I think I'd draw the line at just the 2025 pick. Hopefully its far enough out that the Rockets value it a lot. Jimmy will be like 36 in 2025.


Losing Goran would hurt, but I'd do it. What I take from Hou's package is that they really wanted out of the luxury tax, so it's possible
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