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Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#421 » by harlem_ball » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:07 pm

twix2500 wrote:
Kobewade11 wrote:
twix2500 wrote:f
They are not competing with each other. They play two different roles. You need players who can excell in limited roles because there are players who take on bigger roles. Even if Duncan was a good ball handler he will get very little opportunity to do so. The Heat do not run a freelance scheme.

If Duncan doesn't workout they need to find another player who plays off the ball stretch. Some should completely understand this even thou i know its more about what you want for Herro individually. Herro is in the best role for him and the team. He has more liberty in his current role. Put him in the starting spot for Duncan he is restricted by the role he would play.

Look at Tucker excelling here and how Crowder excell here but struggle elsewhere. Its because of the role. Dragic struggle in Phoenix because of the role they put him. Roles matter.

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Herro is going to be the starting shooting guard on this team, and its not about what I want for him individually, I root for this team not any particular individual. And you always want to get your five best out there..that's just basketball. Duncan is merely keeping the seat warm for this season. If you think otherwise, I don't know what to tell you.
When he does other players on the roster and roles will change. As it currently constructed this the best role. Eventually has nothing to do with some of you whining about it happening now. There is no benefit. It doesn't make the team better.

Duncan and Tucker role is to allow Bam and Butler to be the best version of themselves. Whats the point of putting Herro in there to make Butler and Bam less of players. Its silly. Its just personal desire that some want the title for him.

And no you do not want the five best players out at the same time. You want the best unit out.

Herro being 20 pt scorer off the bench doesn't mean he will be a 20 pt scorer with the starting lineup. There are limited amount of shots in a game. You want to put the ball in the hands of the best player throughout the game. Herro is getting the ball in areas of the game that allows him to get those shots. Or why would you want Herro to be in the starting lineup get 20 but want Butler and or Bam to get less. It makes no sense.

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I'm going to agree with this wholeheartedly. Duncan opens the lanes for Butler and Bam. Tucker, Lowry and Duncan keep things open.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#422 » by twix2500 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:09 pm

Structurely the team is built very well. The only issue this team has is a few player need to be better at their roles that they are well equipped to be. Duncan and Lowry need to improve. Bam, Butler and Herro are being used correctly and its being reflected in their production. One beef is Bam needs to be better utilized in the 4th.

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#423 » by Kobewade11 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:19 pm

twix2500 wrote:When he does other players on the roster and roles will change. As it currently constructed this the best role. Eventually has nothing to do with some of you whining about it happening now. There is no benefit. It doesn't make the team better.

Duncan and Tucker role is to allow Bam and Butler to be the best version of themselves. Whats the point of putting Herro in there to make Butler and Bam less of players. Its silly. Its just personal desire that some want the title for him.

And no you do not want the five best players out at the same time. You want the best unit out.

Herro being 20 pt scorer off the bench doesn't mean he will be a 20 pt scorer with the starting lineup. There are limited amount of shots in a game. You want to put the ball in the hands of the best player throughout the game. Herro is getting the ball in areas of the game that allows him to get those shots. Or why would you want Herro to be in the starting lineup get 20 but want Butler and or Bam to get less. It makes no sense.

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Lets agree to disagree and end this exchange Snickers
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#424 » by twix2500 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:24 pm

Kobewade11 wrote:
twix2500 wrote:When he does other players on the roster and roles will change. As it currently constructed this the best role. Eventually has nothing to do with some of you whining about it happening now. There is no benefit. It doesn't make the team better.

Duncan and Tucker role is to allow Bam and Butler to be the best version of themselves. Whats the point of putting Herro in there to make Butler and Bam less of players. Its silly. Its just personal desire that some want the title for him.

And no you do not want the five best players out at the same time. You want the best unit out.

Herro being 20 pt scorer off the bench doesn't mean he will be a 20 pt scorer with the starting lineup. There are limited amount of shots in a game. You want to put the ball in the hands of the best player throughout the game. Herro is getting the ball in areas of the game that allows him to get those shots. Or why would you want Herro to be in the starting lineup get 20 but want Butler and or Bam to get less. It makes no sense.

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Lets agree to disagree and end this exchange Snickers


Herro is getting 18 shots a game. I do not get what the complaint is about. He is in position to get 18 shots the most on the roster.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#425 » by twix2500 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:28 pm

IMO the best move the Heat could make to help Herro is to find a point guard to play with Herro and one other pressure aka go-to- player with him off the bench. Ideally Herro can potentially be a 22 pts scorer on 15 shots. Lets see if Dipo can be that guy to pair with Herro off the bench.

Butler is being used ideally. He is a 25 pt scorer on 16 shots. That is where we want Butler at. Do not mess that dynamic. Lowry and Robinson improve that should boost Butler assist which would make him an undeniable MVP contender and the team would be top three.

There are small moves if available that can potentially make Herro and Bam 22 pt scorers on 15 shots. Heat needs to get this team were Herro, Bam and Butler are scoring 20 a game. Lowry 15 and Duncan 15
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#426 » by harlem_ball » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:48 pm

twix2500 wrote:Structurely the team is built very well. The only issue this team has is a few player need to be better at their roles that they are well equipped to be. Duncan and Lowry need to improve. Bam, Butler and Herro are being used correctly and its being reflected in their production. One beef is Bam needs to be better utilized in the 4th.

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I agree Duncan needs to get his act together. Very down. Bam also needs to improve. The way he is getting destroyed by big players cannot be covered up. There needs to a strategic shift to help him there or he just needs to flat out play smarter.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#427 » by twix2500 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:53 pm

harlem_ball wrote:
twix2500 wrote:Structurely the team is built very well. The only issue this team has is a few player need to be better at their roles that they are well equipped to be. Duncan and Lowry need to improve. Bam, Butler and Herro are being used correctly and its being reflected in their production. One beef is Bam needs to be better utilized in the 4th.

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I agree Duncan needs to get his act together. Very down. Bam also needs to improve. The way he is getting destroyed by big players cannot be covered up. There needs to a strategic shift to help him there or he just needs to flat out play smarter.


Where I am pin pointing is the fourth quarter. That is where Bam needs to improve. Taking out the Brooklyn game, Bam is averaging around 2 shots a game in the fourth.

How players fit together and system makes a big difference. Look at the difference between Lowry and Dragic. I kept telling people how the Heat needed to get a point guard. Lowry is not playing well but simply a better fit right now is making a huge difference in Bam and Bulter game.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#428 » by Hallstar » Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:06 am

twix2500 wrote:
Kobewade11 wrote:
twix2500 wrote:f
They are not competing with each other. They play two different roles. You need players who can excell in limited roles because there are players who take on bigger roles. Even if Duncan was a good ball handler he will get very little opportunity to do so. The Heat do not run a freelance scheme.

If Duncan doesn't workout they need to find another player who plays off the ball stretch. Some should completely understand this even thou i know its more about what you want for Herro individually. Herro is in the best role for him and the team. He has more liberty in his current role. Put him in the starting spot for Duncan he is restricted by the role he would play.

Look at Tucker excelling here and how Crowder excell here but struggle elsewhere. Its because of the role. Dragic struggle in Phoenix because of the role they put him. Roles matter.

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Herro is going to be the starting shooting guard on this team, and its not about what I want for him individually, I root for this team not any particular individual. And you always want to get your five best out there..that's just basketball. Duncan is merely keeping the seat warm for this season. If you think otherwise, I don't know what to tell you.
When he does other players on the roster and roles will change. As it currently constructed this the best role. Eventually has nothing to do with some of you whining about it happening now. There is no benefit. It doesn't make the team better.

Duncan and Tucker role is to allow Bam and Butler to be the best version of themselves. Whats the point of putting Herro in there to make Butler and Bam less of players. Its silly. Its just personal desire that some want the title for him.

And no you do not want the five best players out at the same time. You want the best unit out.

Herro being 20 pt scorer off the bench doesn't mean he will be a 20 pt scorer with the starting lineup. There are limited amount of shots in a game. You want to put the ball in the hands of the best player throughout the game. Herro is getting the ball in areas of the game that allows him to get those shots. Or why would you want Herro to be in the starting lineup get 20 but want Butler and or Bam to get less. It makes no sense.

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There's a team in our conference that intends to start KD, Harden and Kyrie. They aren't feared because Kyrie is coming off the bench. They're feared because from tipoff you'll be forced to play pick your poison. Bam and Butler aren't the offensive forces that you're making them out to be. Hell, Bam hardly even looks to score unless he's put in a position where it's blatant.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#429 » by twix2500 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:11 am

Hallstar wrote:
twix2500 wrote:
Kobewade11 wrote:
Herro is going to be the starting shooting guard on this team, and its not about what I want for him individually, I root for this team not any particular individual. And you always want to get your five best out there..that's just basketball. Duncan is merely keeping the seat warm for this season. If you think otherwise, I don't know what to tell you.
When he does other players on the roster and roles will change. As it currently constructed this the best role. Eventually has nothing to do with some of you whining about it happening now. There is no benefit. It doesn't make the team better.

Duncan and Tucker role is to allow Bam and Butler to be the best version of themselves. Whats the point of putting Herro in there to make Butler and Bam less of players. Its silly. Its just personal desire that some want the title for him.

And no you do not want the five best players out at the same time. You want the best unit out.

Herro being 20 pt scorer off the bench doesn't mean he will be a 20 pt scorer with the starting lineup. There are limited amount of shots in a game. You want to put the ball in the hands of the best player throughout the game. Herro is getting the ball in areas of the game that allows him to get those shots. Or why would you want Herro to be in the starting lineup get 20 but want Butler and or Bam to get less. It makes no sense.

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There's a team in our conference that intends to start KD, Harden and Kyrie. Bam and Butler aren't the offensive forces that you're making them out to be. Hell, Bam hardly even looks to score unless he's put in a position where it's blatant.


Yes and they are a very flawed team. The weakness of Brooklyn is that they are badly constructed. The fact that Brooklyn big 3 is a lot more elite than the Heat, the Heat needs to combat that by being a better constructed and coached team. Matching up big 3 vs 3 the Heat loses. Matching up which team is better constructed the Heat can win that battle.

We watch 76ers who had an extremely talented roster with Embiid, Horford, Harris, Simmons it failed because they were not a good fit together.

I said this when the Heat got Butler. In order for them to win a chip with Butler as the lead they must build a very well constructed team like the Spurs when they beat the Heat's Big Three. None of their big four (at that time) was as good as the Heats Big Three. But they were constructed so dam well as a team they were better than the Heat.

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#430 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:48 am

twix2500 wrote:
harlem_ball wrote:
twix2500 wrote:Structurely the team is built very well. The only issue this team has is a few player need to be better at their roles that they are well equipped to be. Duncan and Lowry need to improve. Bam, Butler and Herro are being used correctly and its being reflected in their production. One beef is Bam needs to be better utilized in the 4th.

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I agree Duncan needs to get his act together. Very down. Bam also needs to improve. The way he is getting destroyed by big players cannot be covered up. There needs to a strategic shift to help him there or he just needs to flat out play smarter.


Where I am pin pointing is the fourth quarter. That is where Bam needs to improve. Taking out the Brooklyn game, Bam is averaging around 2 shots a game in the fourth.

How players fit together and system makes a big difference. Look at the difference between Lowry and Dragic. I kept telling people how the Heat needed to get a point guard. Lowry is not playing well but simply a better fit right now is making a huge difference in Bam and Bulter game.


Thankfully Lowry impacts the game everywhere so he’s not a complete waste at this point with his scoring ability looking cooked right now.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#431 » by wadenation305 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 6:36 am

Kobewade11 wrote:
wadenation305 wrote:So about how many more games is everyone willing to wait before we have the "should we swap Herro for Duncan in the starting line-up" talk? When ever we make the switch it def would have to be after Dipo is back to bolster the bench. Maybe Duncan gets out of his funk playing against teams opposing benches.

Duncan is who he is, I don't think he's in a funk. If we're being honest Herro should have come into the season as the starter but "politics" will keep him on the bench, at least for this season (unless Duncan gets hurt).


I don't know, for the past 2 years people knew exactly who we was and he still sunk that shot more often then not. While I def do not expect him to be a 20 ppg scorer, his 3 point shooting really has been abysmal beyond the norm. I'm hoping it's a funk.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#432 » by wadenation305 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 6:47 am

Butler is getting buckets, but Lowry so far while he is making a HUGE difference just actually being a PG and playing hard defense. He hasn't really been putting up points. Bam has at times, but he's not a natural scorer and he doesn't have that take over "Hey give me the Damn ball and Imma get this bucket" mentally yet at this point, but is really amazing at D. At this point I can almost trust Herro getting buckets night in night out against anyone, even when his 3 pt shot is not falling. But it really does make an already weak bench weaker.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#433 » by harlem_ball » Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:06 am

If you wanted to do the big frontcourt, more frontcourt (lol) oriented team you could to the Bam, Turner, Butler, Herro, Lowry thing.

Bam is not Duncan thats the problem with the "Spurs-like + 3point splash bro thing" system the Heat seem to be doing.

(what?)

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Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#434 » by puppa bear » Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:07 am

Read on Twitter

This pretty much sums up our inability to finish a half at the moment.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#435 » by puppa bear » Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:25 am

3ammy3uck3ts wrote:That Adam Borai guy listed the Pacers, Kings, Raptors, Spurs, Pistons, and Magic as potential trade partners for us. He didn’t flat out say it but he made it pretty clear in the comments. Just don’t see how anything is possible if we can’t trade Duncan

Assuming it’s a deal for a SF/PF for Robinson, it is a pretty mixed list. There’s clear upgrade targets on some of them (Barnes, Turner, Grant) but then some teams that wouldn’t have much use for Robinson.

I can’t see us having the assets to do much in the trade department, unless Robinson turns it around - but then why trade him?
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#436 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:26 pm

puppa bear wrote:
3ammy3uck3ts wrote:That Adam Borai guy listed the Pacers, Kings, Raptors, Spurs, Pistons, and Magic as potential trade partners for us. He didn’t flat out say it but he made it pretty clear in the comments. Just don’t see how anything is possible if we can’t trade Duncan

Assuming it’s a deal for a SF/PF for Robinson, it is a pretty mixed list. There’s clear upgrade targets on some of them (Barnes, Turner, Grant) but then some teams that wouldn’t have much use for Robinson.

I can’t see us having the assets to do much in the trade department, unless Robinson turns it around - but then why trade him?


I don’t even think he’s eligible to be traded, I wish we could get that cleared up. I think his value is high and everyone knows it’s just a slump. We would have to throw in at least a 1st and a young guy if they like any of ours to get something done though.

Barnes
Grant
Turner
Buddy

I would love any of those but that’s probably my list in order.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#437 » by Hallstar » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:32 pm

He's not eligible until the offseason
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#438 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:45 pm

Hallstar wrote:He's not eligible until the offseason


That’s what I figured. Don’t know what these “insiders” are trying to hint at then.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#439 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:46 pm

puppa bear wrote:
Read on Twitter

This pretty much sums up our inability to finish a half at the moment.


Pistons let you jump out to a 30 point lead and then come storming back in the 4th lol!
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 1 

Post#440 » by greg4012 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:56 pm

Kobewade11 wrote:
twix2500 wrote:When he does other players on the roster and roles will change. As it currently constructed this the best role. Eventually has nothing to do with some of you whining about it happening now. There is no benefit. It doesn't make the team better.

Duncan and Tucker role is to allow Bam and Butler to be the best version of themselves. Whats the point of putting Herro in there to make Butler and Bam less of players. Its silly. Its just personal desire that some want the title for him.

And no you do not want the five best players out at the same time. You want the best unit out.

Herro being 20 pt scorer off the bench doesn't mean he will be a 20 pt scorer with the starting lineup. There are limited amount of shots in a game. You want to put the ball in the hands of the best player throughout the game. Herro is getting the ball in areas of the game that allows him to get those shots. Or why would you want Herro to be in the starting lineup get 20 but want Butler and or Bam to get less. It makes no sense.

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Lets agree to disagree and end this exchange Snickers


Until its brought up again in a day or 2 by the next poster...

"Hey guys...I just had an epiphany! Tyler Herro should be starting because he's better than Duncan. This disrespect cannot stand. The team will implode if this doesn't happen immediately. Inconceivable!"

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