OT: Gilbert Arenas

[Newz]

I don't want to see a guy from an average team be an all-star just because he's efficient.

Can you explain how 13/9 on unbelievable shooting percentages with almost no turn overs is just being 'efficient'. It is more than just efficiency... The guy is just pretty damn good.

His stat line is unbelievable and he has the Raptors four games over .500.

[europa]

I don't want to see a guy from an average team be an all-star just because he's efficient.

If you're talking about Calderon, the Raptors are a good team and he's more than just efficient. The guy has a ridiculous A/TO ratio, averages nearly 9 assists a game, shoots 54% from the floor which is sick for a PG and has outstanding PG instincts in my opinion. The one negative is he's truly awful defensively but I think that's offset by the way he can run an offense and what he brings to the table offensively. He's pretty darn good.

[Neapolitan Buck]

Calderon is a middle of the pack point guard. He's fun to watch because he makes good decisions on offense, but he doesn't do anything more to help his team win than half the point guards in the league. He definitely doesn't play defense. The Raps have 1 legitimate all-star and a solid supporting cast. If Calderon was another legit all-star, you'd think they'd have some breathing room on .500. They don't.

Do you really believe Calderon doesn't improve the Raptors? I agree he does not play defense, but the Raps' offense benefits a lot from Calderon's play. He passes very well, he does not turn the ball over, he is very disciplinated. He doesn't shoot a lot, but he does it extremely well. I know numbers aren't much important, but he has 52 % from the field, 44 % from 3-pt, 92% FTs, 5.5 ast/turn ( ). I'm not saying that he should be an all-star, but he could be, and he surely deserved considerarion. To me he is a better player than Joe Johnson, that is making the trip.

[Neapolitan Buck]

Calderon is pretty darn good. He was deserving of an All-Star nod this year in my opinion. I would've taken him over Johnson without a doubt although I do think the Hawks deserved to have someone on the team given the season they're having. So it was a tough call but instead of Johnson I would've gone with Josh Smith.

Agreed. Josh Smith, Jose and Turkoglu should at least have been considerated.

[blkout]

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If you're talking about Calderon, the Raptors are a good team and he's more than just efficient. The guy has a ridiculous A/TO ratio, averages nearly 9 assists a game, shoots 54% from the floor which is sick for a PG and has outstanding PG instincts in my opinion. The one negative is he's truly awful defensively but I think that's offset by the way he can run an offense and what he brings to the table offensively. He's pretty darn good.

If he's more than just efficient you'd be able to list more than one (assists) stat that proves it. All the others are efficiency stats. And the Raptors are "good" in the East, but in the scheme of things they are average.

[bucks59]

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Hey Gilbert... I do care that he shoots 13% higher than you from the field and isn't the most selfish player in basketball. And a PG rarely turning over the ball is a great quality to have, someone should remind that idiot of that... Maybe he'd cut down his 4.88 TOs per game.

Not all of this is directed at you Luke, I just quoted you on this but the rest of this post just answers other people's comments. I just wasnt sure how to quote multiple people in the same post. It doesnt seem fair to use his stats from this year given that he played in only 8 games and was still not fully recovered from off season surgery. For his career, hes averaging 43% shooting, with 23 points, 5.5 assists, 4.2 rebounds, 1.8 steals and 3.35 turnovers. Granted thats not great in terms of field goal percentage and turnovers, but those are career numbers and they are still better. Calderon this year is averaging 13 ponts, 54% shooting, 3.2 rebounds, 8.8 assists, 1.1 steals and 1.5 turnovers. Even comparing the career average numbers of Arenas to Calderon's best year, Arenas's numbers are comparable, if not better. Granted he is not as efficient of a passer, but he is a more prolific scorer, and puts up decent steal and rebounding numbers.

As for the argument that "Arenas hurts his team", well that is also false. This year, Arenas + Wiz were 3-5 but that was an injured Arenas. Since his absence, they are 21-22. Last year, with Arenas, they 39 - 35. Without him, they were 2-6 and lost all four games against the Cavs. Granted, they just had a ton of injuries last year overall, but he has shown that he doesnt hurt the Wizards.

Now for the argument that Arenas and Redd are the same player, that is also just wrong. Arenas is a better scorer even if he shoots a worse percentage. He averages more rebounds, steals, assists, points and has been out of the first round while actually being a key component of the team. He also is just substantially more clutch than Redd. For as much crap that Arenas gets, and a lot of it he deserves, he has made a ton of game winning shots.

Overal, I do agree with Arenas that Roy and Calderon shouldnt be all stars. Calderon is a great young player, but he is not there yet. Sure, he has a great assist to turnover ratio, and shoots very well, but he only averages 13 points a game, and less than 10 assists a game. Some people said his numbers are Nash like, but that definitely is not true. Nash averages 4 more points, and two more assists and his team is winning substantially more games. Sure he is efficient, but the All Star game is also about entertainment, and Calderon doesnt provide that. And if you take Calderon away from the Raptors and replace him with a different point guard, lets say TJ Ford, they do just as well, as last year proves. Calderon isnt a game changer. He is just incredibly efficient. His comment about Kevin Ollie is true. The guy has been among the NBA's best in assist to turnover ratio. Granted the rest of his stats are not nearly as good, but if efficiency is the most important thing, why not put Ollie in the All Star game? Now I dont necessarily agree with Arenas that it would take 20 years for Calderon to get there, but he definitely is not there yet.

Roy has been great, and is a great young player as well. But an All Star? Im not sure. How is he more deserving than Baron Davis or Manu Ginobili or Deron Williams? All three players, at the time of the all star votes, were about the same in terms of team records. Davis is averaging more assists, more steals, more rebounds, and more points. Sure, a lower shooting percentage and more turnovers. But stats wise, everything favors Davis. Additionally, it is just as amazing that the Warriors are in the playoffs, after beating the Mavs, as the Trailblazers being in contention.

Deron is averaging the same amount of points, almost twice as many assists and shooting a better percentage.

Ginobili's stats are probably worse, but his team is substantially better.

I personally also have no problem with Arenas discussing trades and other NBA players. It is kind of nice to see what players think of trades and what their reactions are. The NBA is not like any other profession. Sure, you're collegues might get annoyed that you are calling them out in whatever profession you are apart of, but at the same time, you are not (I am assuming) an entertainer. Millions of people dont pay to watch you do your job. You dont get paid over $10 million dollars to do what you do (again, I am assuming). That is different with Arenas. His whole existance is to entertain and his thoughts are entertaining, at least to some people. And you are not forced to read them. If you dont like them, ignore them.

Also, who cares if he called out Kwame. Its not like other NBA people havent done that, if not indirectly. Popovich said that there should be a committe to veto terrible trades. Avery Johnson said, "Merry Christmas L.A". How are those comments any different from what Arenas did? Sure he was more direct, but the point was the exactly the same. Everyone and their mother has ripped that trade.

[Newz]

Bucks59... I disagree and don't think Arenas is a very good player. He is extremely talented though, I don't think anyone can disagree that he has talented.

And I was unaware that there was anyone else alive besides Gilbert Arenas that doesn't think Brandon Roy should be an all-star, I honestly just don't know what to say if you don't think Roy has earned a spot in the game. I would have seriously considered voting for Roy as a legitimate starter over Melo, he is one of the premier players in the league.

[bucks59]

Bucks59... I disagree and don't think Arenas is a very good player. He is extremely talented though, I don't think anyone can disagree that he has talented.

And I was unaware that there was anyone else alive besides Gilbert Arenas that doesn't think Brandon Roy should be an all-star, I honestly just don't know what to say if you don't think Roy has earned a spot in the game. I would have seriously considered voting for Roy as a legitimate starter over Melo, he is one of the premier players in the league.

I dont know if he is a great player yet, its too early to deciede, I just dont think he is terrible.

As for Brandon Roy, I respectfully disagree. He has been great, and he is young, but when you look at team records and stats, how can you say that Roy obviously deserves a spot? Davis is better in almost every category. Williams is better or the same in every category. Both of them had teams doing just as well if not better at the time of the voting. Ginobili was also playing great the begining of the year, and while his stats are slightly worse, I think he also could be considered for that. Thats the problem with the West this year, but at the same time, I believe that three people deserved it over Roy. And if not Ginobili, then definitely Davis and Williams. I understand all of the love for Roy given how great Portland was playing, but the Warriors and the Jazz were playing just as good then, and are better now.

[WRau1]

I hate Agent 0 because he reminds me of Kanye West, they both believe there better than they are. I also don't like Jose because of his goofy sideburns. Brandon Roy is insanely good. I hate snow.

[europa]

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If he's more than just efficient you'd be able to list more than one (assists) stat that proves it. All the others are efficiency stats. And the Raptors are "good" in the East, but in the scheme of things they are average.

I think they're a good team but that's subjective. I also think he has strong PG skills which I agree is also subjective. What isn't subjective is his strong assist total, his strong assist/turnover ratio, his rather incredible FG% (for a PG) and the fact he's a starter on a team with a winning record and has now proven his value to that team as both a starter and backup the past two seasons. If Jose Calderon is only average, I shudder to think how bad most of the players on this Bucks team must be.

[REDDzone]

I think Arenas is just hilarious, he only says what he says to get a ride anyway, what's the big deal?

And Calderon schmalderon, sure he can swing the ball, but he aint even the best pg on his own team. Oh, and want to see a bad defender? This guy (IMO, very subjective) makes Mo look decent on that end.