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Dragan Bender Development thread

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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#41 » by crkone » Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:55 pm

Ennis was worse than Frank Mason.

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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#42 » by drone3 » Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:49 pm

Bender Splendor!
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#43 » by Pachinko_ » Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:50 pm

Fender Bender!
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#44 » by drone3 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 12:53 am

Pachinko_ wrote:Fender Bender!
Lol!!
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#45 » by humanrefutation » Sun Oct 13, 2019 2:07 am

My questions about Bender have been about two things - his resilience and his fit.

He seemed to develop a ton of confidence issues in Phoenix. Crappy situation, but sometimes basketball is just basketball and he would be useless on the court at times.

As for fit - I don't trust him to help out in the post at all. He doesn't have the frame to do anything down there. He's worse than Mirotic in that regard. So where would he play? As a 4 with Center Giannis? As a 4 with another big man at the 5, which would make us a little slow defensively?
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#46 » by LuessiT » Sun Oct 13, 2019 2:45 am

humanrefutation wrote:My questions about Bender have been about two things - his resilience and his fit.

He seemed to develop a ton of confidence issues in Phoenix. Crappy situation, but sometimes basketball is just basketball and he would be useless on the court at times.

As for fit - I don't trust him to help out in the post at all. He doesn't have the frame to do anything down there. He's worse than Mirotic in that regard. So where would he play? As a 4 with Center Giannis? As a 4 with another big man at the 5, which would make us a little slow defensively?


There are only a handful of bigs that can hurt you in the post these days and there is maybe one who plays with the second unit regularly (Okafor). And you simply don't play him versus those. I think him not being able to guard some players in the post is a non-issue. A bigger issue is going up strong for the rebound.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#47 » by drone3 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 2:56 am

LuessiT wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:My questions about Bender have been about two things - his resilience and his fit.

He seemed to develop a ton of confidence issues in Phoenix. Crappy situation, but sometimes basketball is just basketball and he would be useless on the court at times.

As for fit - I don't trust him to help out in the post at all. He doesn't have the frame to do anything down there. He's worse than Mirotic in that regard. So where would he play? As a 4 with Center Giannis? As a 4 with another big man at the 5, which would make us a little slow defensively?


There are only a handful of bigs that can hurt you in the post these days and there is maybe one who plays with the second unit regularly (Okafor). And you simply don't play him versus those. I think him not being able to guard some players in the post is a non-issue. A bigger issue is going up strong for the rebound.
Bud will find a place for him, it may be an alternating 4/5 with Gianiss or Ersan.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#48 » by humanrefutation » Sun Oct 13, 2019 3:38 am

LuessiT wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:My questions about Bender have been about two things - his resilience and his fit.

He seemed to develop a ton of confidence issues in Phoenix. Crappy situation, but sometimes basketball is just basketball and he would be useless on the court at times.

As for fit - I don't trust him to help out in the post at all. He doesn't have the frame to do anything down there. He's worse than Mirotic in that regard. So where would he play? As a 4 with Center Giannis? As a 4 with another big man at the 5, which would make us a little slow defensively?


There are only a handful of bigs that can hurt you in the post these days and there is maybe one who plays with the second unit regularly (Okafor). And you simply don't play him versus those. I think him not being able to guard some players in the post is a non-issue. A bigger issue is going up strong for the rebound.


Truthfully, I can't see him being useful against most of the big men in the league. I'm not just talking about playing him against Horford and Embiid. I wouldn't trust him against Javale McGee. He can't rebound. He doesn't really box out. He can't play defense. He can't block a shot. He's a 7'1 guy and he has to hide on the perimeter.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#49 » by LuessiT » Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:08 am

humanrefutation wrote:
LuessiT wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:My questions about Bender have been about two things - his resilience and his fit.

He seemed to develop a ton of confidence issues in Phoenix. Crappy situation, but sometimes basketball is just basketball and he would be useless on the court at times.

As for fit - I don't trust him to help out in the post at all. He doesn't have the frame to do anything down there. He's worse than Mirotic in that regard. So where would he play? As a 4 with Center Giannis? As a 4 with another big man at the 5, which would make us a little slow defensively?


There are only a handful of bigs that can hurt you in the post these days and there is maybe one who plays with the second unit regularly (Okafor). And you simply don't play him versus those. I think him not being able to guard some players in the post is a non-issue. A bigger issue is going up strong for the rebound.


Truthfully, I can't see him being useful against most of the big men in the league. I'm not just talking about playing him against Horford and Embiid. I wouldn't trust him against Javale McGee. He can't rebound. He doesn't really box out. He can't play defense. He can't block a shot. He's a 7'1 guy and he has to hide on the perimeter.


Eh he can block some shots and he can play some defense. Sure he isn't particularly good at either yet but you make him sound like he's worthless on the defensive end. He's not.

He had 7 blocks in this game e.g.:



He's a bad rebounder. He's pretty soft which magnifies the problem. But it's not like he can't grab a board if his life depended on it. He's averaged 8 rebounds per 36 last season. On the other hand he's got great feet and actually can contain smaller players on the wing. Neither of the Lopezzes (that should be a thing) can do that.

I mean I'm expecting him to be a slight net negative player through his first season with some occasional sparks. But that from you're 15th roster spot with potential in year 2 is a pretty solid get.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#50 » by Triple 7 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 5:33 am

The word from Suns fans is that he would have a solid game like this every once in a while and then just disappear for long stretches. Consistency is going to be the key for him to get minutes during the season.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#51 » by bucksfansince88 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 5:40 am

humanrefutation wrote:
LuessiT wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:My questions about Bender have been about two things - his resilience and his fit.

He seemed to develop a ton of confidence issues in Phoenix. Crappy situation, but sometimes basketball is just basketball and he would be useless on the court at times.

As for fit - I don't trust him to help out in the post at all. He doesn't have the frame to do anything down there. He's worse than Mirotic in that regard. So where would he play? As a 4 with Center Giannis? As a 4 with another big man at the 5, which would make us a little slow defensively?


There are only a handful of bigs that can hurt you in the post these days and there is maybe one who plays with the second unit regularly (Okafor). And you simply don't play him versus those. I think him not being able to guard some players in the post is a non-issue. A bigger issue is going up strong for the rebound.


Truthfully, I can't see him being useful against most of the big men in the league. I'm not just talking about playing him against Horford and Embiid. I wouldn't trust him against Javale McGee. He can't rebound. He doesn't really box out. He can't play defense. He can't block a shot. He's a 7'1 guy and he has to hide on the perimeter.


He’s averaging 2 blocks per game thru the preseason so far and 5rbs in only 17mpg
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#52 » by Ayt » Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:45 am

I like him as a developmental guy, but it will be very hard to get minutes over the Lopez bros at center. Giannis and Ersan will also play some center. We also haven't seen how DJ looks this year.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#53 » by humanrefutation » Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:52 am

bucksfansince88 wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
LuessiT wrote:
There are only a handful of bigs that can hurt you in the post these days and there is maybe one who plays with the second unit regularly (Okafor). And you simply don't play him versus those. I think him not being able to guard some players in the post is a non-issue. A bigger issue is going up strong for the rebound.


Truthfully, I can't see him being useful against most of the big men in the league. I'm not just talking about playing him against Horford and Embiid. I wouldn't trust him against Javale McGee. He can't rebound. He doesn't really box out. He can't play defense. He can't block a shot. He's a 7'1 guy and he has to hide on the perimeter.


He’s averaging 2 blocks per game thru the preseason so far and 5rbs in only 17mpg


Take a peek at his career numbers. They're bad on both counts for a 7'1 guy.

I mean, yes, fine, he's a developmental player. You can do a lot worse for a guy at the end of the bench. I'm not opposed to having him.

But I'm not counting on him to have a meaningful impact on our performance this season.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#54 » by Ruzious » Sun Oct 13, 2019 1:12 pm

humanrefutation wrote:
bucksfansince88 wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
Truthfully, I can't see him being useful against most of the big men in the league. I'm not just talking about playing him against Horford and Embiid. I wouldn't trust him against Javale McGee. He can't rebound. He doesn't really box out. He can't play defense. He can't block a shot. He's a 7'1 guy and he has to hide on the perimeter.


He’s averaging 2 blocks per game thru the preseason so far and 5rbs in only 17mpg


Take a peek at his career numbers. They're bad on both counts for a 7'1 guy.

I mean, yes, fine, he's a developmental player. You can do a lot worse for a guy at the end of the bench. I'm not opposed to having him.

But I'm not counting on him to have a meaningful impact on our performance this season.

Well yeah, his numbers were awful his 1st 3 years, but he did improve and he's 21, and he was the 4th pick in the 2016 draft for a reason. It's certainly possible that - as he goes from a very poor organization to a very good one with one of the best coaches in the NBA - that the light is going on for him. And if he keeps this up, the Bucks should probably look to trade Brooks' bro.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#55 » by HaroldinGMinor » Sun Oct 13, 2019 3:06 pm

Bender's career numbers need to be taken with a grain of salt. If they were good, he would still be on the Suns.

I think he could have a role as a shooter. A 7 foot guy that can jack threes is valuable even if he doesn't rebound.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#56 » by Shaffty » Sun Oct 13, 2019 3:25 pm

Knock off the personal attacks - MD
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#57 » by 4xBuck » Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:45 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:
SupremeHustle wrote:Bender essentially is a late first-round pick for the Bucks. He'll probably be as good as anyone that the Bucks would have picked at 30.


I'd say Bender would fit more on the undrafted free agent scale, since you can pick up superior guys like Brook Lopez in the second round typically.


What?
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#58 » by LuessiT » Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:52 pm

humanrefutation wrote:Take a peek at his career numbers. They're bad on both counts for a 7'1 guy.

I mean, yes, fine, he's a developmental player. You can do a lot worse for a guy at the end of the bench. I'm not opposed to having him.

But I'm not counting on him to have a meaningful impact on our performance this season.


I'm with you on this. These are healthy expectations. I'd be more excited if we had 3 years of team control over him.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#59 » by truly » Sun Oct 13, 2019 8:01 pm

4xBuck wrote:
paulpressey25 wrote:
SupremeHustle wrote:Bender essentially is a late first-round pick for the Bucks. He'll probably be as good as anyone that the Bucks would have picked at 30.


I'd say Bender would fit more on the undrafted free agent scale, since you can pick up superior guys like Brook Lopez in the second round typically.


What?


PP's judgement is compromised when it comes to Lopez.Move along.
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Re: Dragan Bender Development thread 

Post#60 » by TroyD92 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 8:05 pm

Benders skills are definitely intriguing. I really can’t stand these ultra soft bigs like Henson/Bender, but if he’s giving good effort I can’t complain too much.
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Kidd would have curb stomped him.

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