Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - OFF SEASON EDITION

[bdpecore]

If CP3 is out, the guys I'm looking at next are CJ McCollum and Kemba. I really want someone who can run the 2 man game with Giannis.

I think getting a Jrue Holiday and JJ Redick package would be ideal. They fill our two biggest weaknesses; playmaking and shooting. Im just not sure what it would take to land both if we didn’t include Middleton. Is Brook a fit playing next to Zion and Ingram? If so, something along the lines of Brook, DDV, Hill, Ilyasova and future 1st (top 3 protected) for Holiday and Redick.

Trade 2: Bledsoe and Wilson for Beverley, Shamet and Zizic

Trade 3: R. Lopez and #24 for Bjelica

Sign C. Diallo

PG: Holiday, Beverley, Mason
SG: Redick, Shamet
SF: Middleton, Matthews
PF: Giannis, Bjelica, Thanasis
C: Zizic, Diallo

[LuessiT]

Want CP3 or Conley will probably end up with DJ Augustine or Schroeder.

I'd love Augustin off the bench. Would be very handy running pick n roll. I believe he is a very good shooter off the dribble.

Without having Schroeder's stats in front of me, I believe he has had a good year. Is this an outlier or a result of being used differently? I'm intrigued by him, but not as plan A.

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I barely watched OKC so I'm only going by advanced stats but the CP3/Schröder/SGA lineup has the highest net rating of any 3 man lineups. That's remarkable and indicates that he doesn't necessarily need the ball to contribute.

His advanced PnR stats are pretty mediocre.

[LuessiT]

If CP3 is out, the guys I'm looking at next are CJ McCollum and Kemba. I really want someone who can run the 2 man game with Giannis.

I think getting a Jrue Holiday and JJ Redick package would be ideal. They fill our two biggest weaknesses; playmaking and shooting. Im just not sure what it would take to land both if we didn’t include Middleton. Is Brook a fit playing next to Zion and Ingram? If so, something along the lines of Brook, DDV, Hill, Ilyasova and future 1st (top 3 protected) for Holiday and Redick.

Trade 2: Bledsoe for Beverley and Zizic

Trade 3: R. Lopez and #24 for Bjelica

Sign Jae Crowder (MLE) and C. Diallo

PG: Holiday, Beverley, Mason
SG: Redick, Matthews
SF: Middleton, Crowder
PF: Giannis, Bjelica, Thanasis
C: Zizic, Diallo, Wilson

Jrue doesn't really run the PnR well. I really want our most basic half court sets to look like this:

High PnR with Giannis as the screener:

If go under -> pull up
If go over -> pull up/drive
If they switch -> depending what quality of player we can get either we isolate the big or we start with Giannis top of the key. I haven't got any stats on this but from the eye test every time the wall forms with a guard as the primary defender Giannis gets where ever he wants.

For that we need someone who can run the PnR at a high level. That means pull up from 3, squeeze in passes to the roll man, find the open man , get to the rim on occasion (if Giannis pops) and ideally has some sort of in between game (midrange, floater). It doesn't necessarily have to be a real PG.
CP3 can do all of that (except get to the rim maybe). This is Kemba's bread and butter so he'd be ideal if we could somehow get him. CJ can do everything except maybe pass at a high enough level. Beal can do all of that (though I'm very sure he's impossible to get for us). Monte Morris and White's advanced stats are very promising in terms of PnR efficiency. Redick has a very high efficiency (on a miniscule frequency) so he might actually be an option as a pseudo PG. Hield's stats are promising. Dragic should also be on our radar.

But Holiday is not a PnR player. He's in the 36th percentile. He's a good player, but not the right one for what I envision.

[pifhluk23]

It only took 3 years for everyone to realize Bledsoe is not a good PG and neither is Giannis...

[Baddy Chuck]

Early morning 4 team extravaganza:

George/Beverly/Zubac to Milwaukee
Paul/Middleton/Brook Lopez to LAC
Harrell (S&T)/Shamet/McGruder/#24/#27 to OKC
Bledsoe to NY

[Fotis St]

Whats with all this DDV hype? Where does it come from? It ain't his shooting, it aint his pick n roll plays, what is it? Is it fun to watch a short guard dunk? OK.

Bayless was better than DDV has ever been, at least I remembers him shooting the 3 at 40%.

What's Donte? He is 23+ and you are acting like he is 19. He wasn't even a starter at Villanova... how do you suggest to be a starter on a Championship team with Giannis demanding guards hitting the 3 at 40%clip?

He's #49 in RPM and his advanced stats with Giannis on the floor are nuts. He contributed in a lot more ways than just shooting.

You are saying, Real Plus Minus based on team perfomance metric, is the factor to be high about someone ?

Christian Wood is #16
Mychal Mulder is #18 (1st time I read his name) , GSW
Daniel Theis is #25 (Boston)

So its clearly a flawed metric to rely on...
Giannis demands to build around shooting and off the dribble shooting. This RPM says almost nothing to me. Its OK though, if some GMs look RPM than he has value in a trade

[Fotis St]

Early morning 4 team extravaganza:

George/Beverly/Zubac to Milwaukee
Paul/Middleton/Brook Lopez to LAC
Harrell (S&T)/Shamet/McGruder/#24/#27 to OKC
Bledsoe to NY

Nice trade idea, ... really fresh ... the more I look at it , the more Iike it ... Paul George is like a Middleton that dunks too... (sometimes)

[machu46]

Early morning 4 team extravaganza:

George/Beverly/Zubac to Milwaukee
Paul/Middleton/Brook Lopez to LAC
Harrell (S&T)/Shamet/McGruder/#24/#27 to OKC
Bledsoe to NY

I like it; think it makes reasonable sense for all parties. I'm not really convinced LAC want to move George after one year but I think you could make a pretty reasonable argument this trade improves the team.

[Fotis St]

I wonder if Utah trades both Bogdanovic and Ingles + picks for Khris..

Maybe include a swap of Bledsoe and Gobert into the deal

[German Athens]

Jrue doesn't really run the PnR well. I really want our most basic half court sets to look like this:

High PnR with Giannis as the screener:

If go under -> pull up
If go over -> pull up/drive
If they switch -> depending what quality of player we can get either we isolate the big or we start with Giannis top of the key. I haven't got any stats on this but from the eye test every time the wall forms with a guard as the primary defender Giannis gets where ever he wants.

For that we need someone who can run the PnR at a high level. That means pull up from 3, squeeze in passes to the roll man, find the open man , get to the rim on occasion (if Giannis pops) and ideally has some sort of in between game (midrange, floater). It doesn't necessarily have to be a real PG.
CP3 can do all of that (except get to the rim maybe). This is Kemba's bread and butter so he'd be ideal if we could somehow get him. CJ can do everything except maybe pass at a high enough level. Beal can do all of that (though I'm very sure he's impossible to get for us). Monte Morris and White's advanced stats are very promising in terms of PnR efficiency. Redick has a very high efficiency (on a miniscule frequency) so he might actually be an option as a pseudo PG. Hield's stats are promising. Dragic should also be on our radar.

But Holiday is not a PnR player. He's in the 36th percentile. He's a good player, but not the right one for what I envision.

Agreed. I would love to have guys who can run the pick and roll and be a threat from all three levels. That’s why White is such a high target for me. I wonder if Malik Beasley would be attainable, too. His numbers in Minnesota, granted a very small sample, are quite encouraging.

[ShootingtheJ]

Early morning 4 team extravaganza:

George/Beverly/Zubac to Milwaukee
Paul/Middleton/Brook Lopez to LAC
Harrell (S&T)/Shamet/McGruder/#24/#27 to OKC
Bledsoe to NY

An outgoing S&T can't be included with other outgoing salary. Can this deal be made in separate deals and still be legal?

Either way, we get significantly worse offensively in this deal. I love Beverly, but he's not a real PG. Zubic doesn't fit next to Giannis. We give up the most talent but lose a pick.

[LuessiT]

Early morning 4 team extravaganza:

George/Beverly/Zubac to Milwaukee
Paul/Middleton/Brook Lopez to LAC
Harrell (S&T)/Shamet/McGruder/#24/#27 to OKC
Bledsoe to NY

An outgoing S&T can't be included with other outgoing salary.

It can be though. What you're referring to is actually a well-spreaded myth.

[Baddy Chuck]

Early morning 4 team extravaganza:

George/Beverly/Zubac to Milwaukee
Paul/Middleton/Brook Lopez to LAC
Harrell (S&T)/Shamet/McGruder/#24/#27 to OKC
Bledsoe to NY

An outgoing S&T can't be included with other outgoing salary.

It can be though. What you're referring to is actually a well-spreaded myth.

Either way I'm fairly sure OKC would have enough cap to absorb Harrell? Trade checker worked without his salary but I didn't dive into it much.

Overall I wasn't sure what I thought of the deal to be fair. I'm not sure how George feels about staying in Milwaukee long term and there would certainly need to be follow up deals to round out the roster. In an ideal world I think adding a dynamic player like George to Giannis outweighs a lot of the "team" aspect and those holes could be covered up in other ways. Probably leave out the Bledsoe to NY part and use that somewhere else, play Giannis at center a lot more and use the MLE on a wing. Beverly and Zubac fill holes and where we lose talent in a 2 for 1 starter kinda way, Paul George alone has the potential to vastly outperform that combination.

[SirChurros]

If you guys think Midds sucks in the playoffs, let me tell you about Paul George...

[BucksRule18]

Some great suggestions in this thread. Unfortunately, it's hard to pinpoint what exactly went wrong this year (vs. last) and what changes can get us over the hump. Coming off the Toronto loss last year, the focus was to improve Giannis's FT and perimeter shooting and surround him with a couple of 3 PT shooters to combat the walling off tactic. After being on pace to win 70 games well into the 2019-2020 season, and looking unbeatable in a 7-game series against any team, the bubble collapse leaves a lot of questions that can't be resolved with a few personnel changes.

- One major issue is that Bud has complete control over this team (a la Pop with the Spurs). When the team is dominating during the regular season, no one questions his tactics, minutes restrictions for the starters, etc. However, when opposing teams and coaches game plan for our style of play in the playoffs and Bud can't adjust, everyone is running around like chickens with their heads cut off. For all their talent, both Giannis and Middleton do not deviate from the game plan set by the coach. Players like Kobe or Lebron would tell the coach to stuff it and make their own adjustments. Someone like Paul George will likely go with the game plan set by Bud with similar end results.

- How much did the pandemic play into team mentality? Some teams like Miami and Denver seemed to have gelled together during this time, while other teams like the Bucks and Clippers took their foot off the breaks. It also didn't help that Bud approached the last 7 games of the regular season as preseason games. If the pandemic never happened, could we have won this year? I would say no, but we would've likely made the finals.

- How can Giannis get out of his own head? He's only 25, but at some point he has to thrive in pressure situations. His FT percentage and perimeter shooting should improve in these situations and not drop off a cliff. If he can't improve this part of his game, we are not winning a championship. All superstars play their best in do or die situations. This is what they live for.

- I agree with others that we should not sign any has beens (even on the cheap) because they were good 5 years ago. They automatically get more playing time than the youngsters but typically don't move the needle in the playoffs. Not sure how to make this work financially, but there is no need to pay players like Ersan and Rolo $7M and $5M, respectively for riding the bench in the playoffs. Who cares if our bench is deep and we win games in the regular season. I'd much rather overpay for a semi star still in their prime than sign older players on the cheap to ride the bench when it really matters.

[leroyjw10]

Early morning 4 team extravaganza:

George/Beverly/Zubac to Milwaukee
Paul/Middleton/Brook Lopez to LAC
Harrell (S&T)/Shamet/McGruder/#24/#27 to OKC
Bledsoe to NY

I think this actually makes the Bucks worse. PG is only slightly better than Mids. Bledsoe is slightly better than Bev. Lopez is definitely better than Zubac. Plus, we give up a draft pick. We should definitely keep the draft pick, should maybe actually receive a draft pick instead.

[jakecronus8]

There’s a handful of guys that I think I’d disown the Bucks if they acquired. Beverly is one. One of the biggest douche bags in the game.

[BucksRule18]

There’s a handful of guys that I think I’d disown the Bucks if they acquired. Beverly is one. One of the biggest douche bags in the game.

Yeah, I tend to agree. There are a very few players in each league that I just can't cheer for even if playing for my team (e.g. Jeffrey Leonard with the Brewers).

[Bucksfan28]

If BKN can't get Jrue, how about Bled/DJ for Dinwiddie/Prince. Then try to get one of Moore or Joe Harris, and then Giles.

Hill/Dinwiddie
DDV/Moore(or Harris)
Mids/Wes/Prince
Giannis/Prince/Ersan
Brook/Giles

Admittedly not as fun as the more grand trade ideas for an all-star.

EDIT: Alternatively, see if you can get Bev/Shamet with Bled as the central outgoing player. Sign Moore & Giles.

Bev/Hill
Shamet/DDV
Mids/Moore/Wes
Giannis/Ersan/Giles
Brook/Giles

EDIT #2: I saw earlier that the Bucks could potentially have the MLE and BAE? If that's true and the market humbles Jerami Grant, then maybe you can snag him w/ the MLE and Moore on the BAE. So for the first scenario swap out Giles:

Hill/Dinwiddie
DDV/Moore/Wes
Mids/Prince/Wes
Giannis/Grant/Ersan
Brook/Grant/Robin

Gives us some nice versatility at the 2-4 positions for those Giannis at C lineups.

[DingleJerry]

I see NO mentioned a lot. Is thee really any indication they're going to do anything but chase the 8 seed? Sure seems to me like they'll continue to do exactly that instead of a teardown.