PG Indy - Bucks Fade Away

[Ron Swanson]

Whelp, this is probably the first loss I think the "Lillard and Beas backcourt is almost single-handedly tanking the defense" crowd can point to and actually be right. But once again, we got outrebounded and Bobby gets played off the floor. Pacers don't seem to be a great matchup for us defensively regardless of the perimeter personnel, and maybe we need Crowder back to unlock that lineup, but Griff hasn't seemed to grasp that going small with Giannis at the 5 is probably the thing that needs to happen in closing lineups vs. them.

I don’t think he trusts our personal to do that and that makes these really spaced out teams like Indiana and Boston so tough for us to guard with Brook out there even though Brook is awesome 90 percent of the time

Which again, if Crowder is the important small-ball PF piece, that's at least defensible. I would like to see them try Khris at the 4 more often though. Hell, even Pat has proved useful as a small-ball PF at times cuz dude is hella strong and if you're goading Obi Toppen or Aaron Nesmith into post-ups vs. Pat, that's a win for the defense every single time.

[Siefer]

Dame had his worst game in a Bucks uniform, and the bench was absolutely atrocious. There were multiple stretches in this game with a lineup like Cam/Pat/Midds/Bobby/Giannis where the Pacers put 3 bodies on Giannis, and the other guys couldn't make something happen in the 4v2.

AB is on the money with the dials Horst can turn, I think. We're putting limited role-players in bad positions, and on nights where our top guys aren't just better than everything else, it can bite us in the ass. It's obnoxious that we're setting guys up for failure, but I just can't see a good option with the coaching at this point.

Cam is more Teague than Hill, Pat's mobility has fallen apart, and Bobby needs a specific setting and role to succeed. Trying to turn our limited resources (sorry Bobby) into a guard/wing defender is probably the best option available to us.

[jimmybones]

We are now 1-3 this year against Indiana, why hasn't he adjusted yet?

Yeah, he should have told Giannis to score 65 this time!

Griff drawing up his master game plan and it’s just Giannis face over Wilt’s in the 100 points picture.

I have this hilarious memory and inside joke with a friend of a clip of Scott Brooks "coaching" in a huddle the Thunder when they had Durant, Harden and Westbrook. He kept saying "guys, we're good" and me and my friend despite having no further context found it hilarious that an NBA coach had no insight whatsoever other than "give ball to good player, good player make shot."

It's sad but it does feel like we are in a spot where we will win games simply because our players are good but it sure does feel like fighting with one arm behind our backs.

[Ron Swanson]

Bucks vs. Indiana last season:

W 132-119
W 141-131
L 123-139
W 149-136

A lot of "Coach Grief" posts after this one, but....

[tydett]

Bucks vs. Indiana last season:

W 132-119
W 141-131
L 123-139
W 149-136

A lot of "Coach Grief" posts after this one, but....

While true,

132-119: Pacers get 57 points from 3s
141-131: Pacers get 39 points from 3s
123-139: Pacers get 66 points from 3s
149-136: Pacers get 42 points from 3s

128-119 in Vegas: Pacers get 21 points from 3s
122-113 last night: Pacers get 15 points from 3s

[PG Graveyard]

Bucks vs. Indiana last season:

W 132-119
W 141-131
L 123-139
W 149-136

A lot of "Coach Grief" posts after this one, but....

It’s always been McConnell.

[Ron Swanson]

Bucks vs. Indiana last season:

W 132-119
W 141-131
L 123-139
W 149-136

A lot of "Coach Grief" posts after this one, but....

While true,

132-119: Pacers get 57 points from 3s
141-131: Pacers get 39 points from 3s
123-139: Pacers get 66 points from 3s
149-136: Pacers get 42 points from 3s

128-119 in Vegas: Pacers get 21 points from 3s
122-113 last night: Pacers get 15 points from 3s

I mean, what does it matter where the shots are if they've consistently put up a +120-ORTG regardless of the coaching and defense employed? If anything that just reinforces the idea that they're a team we're simply going to have to outscore, and a 108 ORTG (last night) isn't gonna get that done. I still have major concerns about the defense but sometimes people need to hop off their agendas and give credit to the Pacers for being a great offensive team (statistically the best offense "ever") and Haliburton for being arguably the best offensive engine in the league not named Jokic.

[GoldenAntlers]

Speaking of Jae. How's that "8 weeks" looking?

[fan230]

Speaking of Jae. How's that "8 weeks" looking?

Waiting for his January return..

[rilamann]

Not the Dame we traded for tonight. He was horrible.

Indiana did nothing special. We just **** the bed on so many levels. Our bench lost us multiple big leads. Pat C in particular was awful.

The Pacers shot 5/35 from three and we lost. Unbelievable really.

My takeaway with Dame after watching him under a microscope on my team for over 30 games now, is that he's a guy who says he wants to win a championship, but doesn't have the commitment and the level of sacrifice that it takes from one of your stars to win a championship.

I had a sneaky suspension about Dame even before we even traded for him, based on how hell bent he was on going to Miami. He wasn't hell bent on going to Miami because he was serious about winning a championship.

He's still a great player and he has nights where looks like one of top players in the league. He's just a guy that you're not going to get a championship level of commitment & sacrifice from over the course of an 82 game season and playoffs.

Playing next to Giannis even makes it more glaring, at least to me. Giannis has bad games too, but Giannis could play 20 seasons and you will never be able question Giannis' commitment/desire/sacrifice ect.

With Dame it really just comes down to which standard you are holding him to.

If you're holding Dame to the level of a really good all star type of player he's been great.

If you're holding him to the standard of a true superstar, he hasn't been that.

I've been pretty positive all season and I am not one to overreact over a single regular season game. But the game last night deff gives me some doubts about this Bucks team going forward.

[randy84]

So Bucks were bad on offense, bad on defense, and have a bad bench. Hard to believe they lost this game.

[sidney lanier]

With Dame it really just comes down to which standard you are holding him to.

If you're holding Dame to the level of a really good all star type of player he's been great.

If you're holding him to the standard of a true superstar, he hasn't been that.

I've been pretty positive all season and I am not one to overreact over a single regular season game. But the game last night deff gives me some doubts about this Bucks team going forward.

His self-assessment was unusually candid in his postgame sound. He said (paraphrasing) that he was accustomed to a role in which he was the initiator and had the ball in his hand, and the transition to playing off the ball was a challenge for him in terms of getting in the flow and building a rhythm.

We're still in the test kitchen and far from ready to open the restaurant. The recipes with Giannis bringing the ball up are unlikely to make it to the final menu. Dame as initiator should be the house specialty, and I think eventually it will.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

its been so hard to post this year on the board.... theres just so many aspects of this team that i cant stand..... most of those aspects are things related to what teams do or dont do that **** with how proud you are to even call yourself a fan.....

as ive said previously weve certainly entered a time that will become more difficult and more difficult as time moves along. the idea we need to fast forward to the playoffs is comical to me. for as much fun as is practically possible it would be far better to live in denial for as long as possible imo.

Of the same mind. On the positive note, Dame, Beasley and an offensively healthy Middleton are providing spacing and shooting the Bucks have badly needed for years.

But on defense, we have no idea what we’re doing. And teams know our playbook, and guys waltz into the paint nightly, forcing Brook to take on constant 2 on 1’s, while Giannis sits off to the side. These problems go well beyond personnel.

considering how much this team claims to be trying to work on these issues defensively... it appears to me it may be the least iq and concerted effort of any team ive ever seen assembled with such historic talent. a team of all talk doesnt mean much to me

and the discombobulated clown show aspects of our offense continue on...... giannis and lopez pulling moronic 3s in meaningful moments..... dame chucking off balance **** himself .. the stupidity of so many times we simply "take turns".... the lack of organization offensively as we rely on sheer talent and sheer talent alone in many regards is just as bad on that side as well. in the playoffs it wont be talent alone that wins four straight series if the fundamentals arent in place. we cant hope for "historic performances" in order to counter the stupidity of how we often play.

dames numbers in the playoffs have been on the spectrum of great to historically awful as well. he fits right in in some regards no different than bled and jrue in that regard.

there is no sense in my mind that once we reach the playoffs its all just going to "work itself out". glad we see it the same way pp

[Chessboxer]

I get not being able to stop Haliburton. He’s a superstar offensive player. My issue is that he wasn’t the pacer that changed the game - it was McConnell.

We couldn’t stop McConnell. Maybe we shouldn’t press a dude high who doesn’t shoot outside 15 feet if we can’t recover. Go under every screen, play him soft on the perimeter - don’t allow him to waltz to the rim every time down.

We play high, get caught on the screen, and it allows a 2 on 1 going downhill from 20 feet and in. The lanes are huge.

To Griffs' credit, the Bucks adjusted and started doing that, however it was to late when the game was out of reach.

[pifhluk23]

Some of you guys have insane Dame takes. Jimmy Butler also takes the regular season off...

[nagawicka]

and guys waltz into the paint nightly, forcing Brook to take on constant 2 on 1’s, while Giannis sits off to the side. These problems go well beyond personnel.

Maybe there was a good reason Jrue insisted on covering Jimmy Butler.

[nagawicka]

Feels like Griff could have used Jrue and Bud could have used Dame lol.

Horst needs to trade 'em 1-for-1 right now.

[rilamann]

With Dame it really just comes down to which standard you are holding him to.

If you're holding Dame to the level of a really good all star type of player he's been great.

If you're holding him to the standard of a true superstar, he hasn't been that.

I've been pretty positive all season and I am not one to overreact over a single regular season game. But the game last night deff gives me some doubts about this Bucks team going forward.

His self-assessment was unusually candid in his postgame sound. He said (paraphrasing) that he was accustomed to a role in which he was the initiator and had the ball in his hand, and the transition to playing off the ball was a challenge for him in terms of getting in the flow and building a rhythm.

We're still in the test kitchen and far from ready to open the restaurant. The recipes with Giannis bringing the ball up are unlikely to make it to the final menu. Dame as initiator should be the house specialty, and I think eventually it will.

I will have to check out the Dame postgame sound.

I get that Dame needs time to adjust but we're approaching the midpoint of the season and there have been a few games (Like last night) where he just seems out of it. Giannis is a superstar and he has some bad games sometimes, but he almost never has games where he just seems out of it. We're only 33 games into the season and Dame has already had a few.

Again, I am not saying he's been bad, but I just don't think we are getting the level of consistency and commitment that you would expect from a superstar who claims to be hungry for a championship.

I've been saying for the past couple months that I would never bet against a team with Giannis & Dame.

If Dame has a couple more games like he had last night between now and mid-April, I might be changing my tune.

[msiris]

A good
coach would have the ball in Dames hands alot. At the end of last nights game Mids had it more than Dame.

[FrieAaron]

A good
coach would have the ball in Dames hands alot. At the end of last nights game Mids had it more than Dame.

This has happened a few times and I'm not sure it's sitting well with Dame.