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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1161 » by LuessiT » Sun Feb 21, 2021 9:35 pm

trwi7 wrote:
BigO wrote:
trwi7 wrote:
It's actually a pretty good video. Basically tells us what we all know, that Lopez and Forbes suck and sink our defense and goes in depth why. The NetSuite promo 5 minutes in was by far the best part of the video though.



Any analysis that leaves out the coach as the number one problem is a bad analysis.


It didn't leave out Bud. Basically says the scheme is stupid but that Lopez and Forbes are ruining an already questionable scheme.


Any analysis that calls a defensive system that topped the league two times in a row (by a wide margin) stupid is flawed. We've got issues we need to fix, but I very much doubt that we'll just can the system.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1162 » by trwi7 » Sun Feb 21, 2021 9:55 pm

LuessiT wrote:
trwi7 wrote:
BigO wrote:

Any analysis that leaves out the coach as the number one problem is a bad analysis.


It didn't leave out Bud. Basically says the scheme is stupid but that Lopez and Forbes are ruining an already questionable scheme.


Any analysis that calls a defensive system that topped the league two times in a row (by a wide margin) stupid is flawed. We've got issues we need to fix, but I very much doubt that we'll just can the system.


Have you watched the last two years? It is flawed, because good teams can and do exploit it and we've refused to change it. That's a coaching and system flaw.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1163 » by DrWood » Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:28 pm

Bryn Forbes and a second for Demarcus Cousins?
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1164 » by emunney » Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:45 pm

We really deserved to get Josh Hart in the Jrue deal.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1165 » by blazza18 » Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:52 pm

Do we think Horst even asked for Hart?
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1166 » by crowhead76 » Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:25 pm

Image

Holiday - Rubio - Merrill - (2)Adams
DDV - Matthews - Forbes
Middleton - Nwaba - Pat - Nwora
Giannis - (BuyOut) - Thanasis
Reid - Portis - (2)Diakite
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1167 » by LuessiT » Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:54 pm

trwi7 wrote:
LuessiT wrote:
trwi7 wrote:
It didn't leave out Bud. Basically says the scheme is stupid but that Lopez and Forbes are ruining an already questionable scheme.


Any analysis that calls a defensive system that topped the league two times in a row (by a wide margin) stupid is flawed. We've got issues we need to fix, but I very much doubt that we'll just can the system.


Have you watched the last two years? It is flawed, because good teams can and do exploit it and we've refused to change it. That's a coaching and system flaw.


That's not what I said. I'm personally not in the slightest a fan of our defensive system. But if one wants to have an open discuss there should be an acknowledgement that it was successfully implemented. And no, it didn't just beat up on bad teams. The scheme can clearly work if correctly implemented and with the right personel. Also a lot of OPs examples are missed individual rotations rather than a scheme issue.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1168 » by djsunyc » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:11 am

LuessiT wrote:
trwi7 wrote:
LuessiT wrote:
Any analysis that calls a defensive system that topped the league two times in a row (by a wide margin) stupid is flawed. We've got issues we need to fix, but I very much doubt that we'll just can the system.


Have you watched the last two years? It is flawed, because good teams can and do exploit it and we've refused to change it. That's a coaching and system flaw.


That's not what I said. I'm personally not in the slightest a fan of our defensive system. But if one wants to have an open discuss there should be an acknowledgement that it was successfully implemented. And no, it didn't just beat up on bad teams. The scheme can clearly work if correctly implemented and with the right personel. Also a lot of OPs examples are missed individual rotations rather than a scheme issue.


the video does mention it - he's highlighting that people are hitting 3's at a much better clip and that brook lost a big step on defense.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1169 » by LuessiT » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:39 am

djsunyc wrote:
LuessiT wrote:
trwi7 wrote:
Have you watched the last two years? It is flawed, because good teams can and do exploit it and we've refused to change it. That's a coaching and system flaw.


That's not what I said. I'm personally not in the slightest a fan of our defensive system. But if one wants to have an open discuss there should be an acknowledgement that it was successfully implemented. And no, it didn't just beat up on bad teams. The scheme can clearly work if correctly implemented and with the right personel. Also a lot of OPs examples are missed individual rotations rather than a scheme issue.


the video does mention it - he's highlighting that people are hitting 3's at a much better clip and that brook lost a big step on defense.


I've seen the video. I'm not saying the video is bad, especially for the audience it's aimed at but it's not nearly enough to form a based opinion on wether our scheme is bad or good.

This isn't the right place to have an in depth conversations about defense so I'll keep it short. Assuming the scheme is to stay, what we need to work on either by coaching or change in personel is to increase the time before defense breakdowns:

Occasionally change up coverages. Fake that you're bringing help, play the passing lane and anticipate the pass.

Change the coverage depending on the shot clock. When the shot clock is down, play man to man. If the shot clock is so far down that there wouldn't be time for an extra pass after the kickout, revert to the scheme and close out hard.

Rim protectors should sometimes gamble and play the pass over the shot attempt. Teams adapt to our tendencies so adapt to theirs.

Identify situations when a player needs help and when not. Giannis in the post versus anyone? No help needed. Forbes switched onto a big in the post? Bring the double before the pass. Jrue versus anyone? He's fine, don't help.

And lastly identify who's causing our defense to break down and limit these breakdowns by coaching or change of personel. Brook should be gone. Forbes is actually much better defensively than the video suggests. I mean he's an absolutely awful individual defender but he's in the right position and makes the correct rotations a lot of the time.

If we play smart defenders and change our coverages occasionally we should be a lot better.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1170 » by giannis and 1 » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:56 am

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RiotPunch wrote:
giannis and 1 wrote:Middleton for Bogdan + Rondo + Reddish + 1st

This is really bad for us.


I think it was a meme. I hope...

What if we switch Reddish for Huerter or Collins?

This would be an offseason trade, btw.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1171 » by raferfenix » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:58 am

Thinking about Mark Cuban’s strategy of taking fliers on overpaid guys with the idea that worst case they are ‘salary slots’ that can be used in trades later on.

One potential acquisition towards these ends could be Eric Gordon.

Do we think Houston could entice us to take on that contract?

They control our 2022 first round pick if we wanted draft assets back, and we have been linked to PJ Tucker a few times now.

Rockets are talking up Eric Gordon’s performance amidst a chaotic season too. Here’s a report from a week ago from Jonathan Feigen:

“Eric has been very good coming off the bench, starting, whatever type of role he’s had he’s scored,” Silas said. “Eric’s been the one who has been here the whole time and thriving in our system and what he’s been doing.


Gordon’s average of 18.6 points per game prior to Thursday was the most of his five seasons with the Rockets and his average of 23.3 points per 36 minutes topped his 13-year career. He went into Thursday’s game having scored at least 20 points in five consecutive games, his second five-game streak this season.

“I’ve always been able to be effective as a starter and coming off the bench because my play can adapt to anybody and I can adapt to any style of play,” Gordon said. “I can shoot, I can drive, play D. I just got to continue to be aggressive. My first year here, I was all about sacrificing to win. Nothing has changed. That’s what I’m about.”

That also could make him a Sixth Man of the Year candidate again. He won the award in 2016-17, his first season with the Rockets and the first of his career he primarily came off the bench. He averaged 16.2 points per game that season, making 40.6 percent of his shots, 37.2 percent of his 3s.

Gordon is making 46.3 percent of his shots this season, 36.6 percent of his 3s. He is getting to the rim much more often than in any of his previous seasons with the Rockets, connecting on 64.3 percent of his 4.4 shots per game within five feet while taking more shots at the rim.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.houstonchronicle.com/texas-sports-nation/rockets/amp/Eric-Gordon-likely-reserve-role-sixth-man-Rockets-15942979.php
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1172 » by LuessiT » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:28 am

raferfenix wrote:Thinking about Mark Cuban’s strategy of taking fliers on overpaid guys with the idea that worst case they are ‘salary slots’ that can be used in trades later on.

One potential acquisition towards these ends could be Eric Gordon.

Do we think Houston could entice us to take on that contract?

They control our 2022 first round pick if we wanted draft assets back, and we have been linked to PJ Tucker a few times now.

Rockets are talking up Eric Gordon’s performance amidst a chaotic season too. Here’s a report from a week ago from Jonathan Feigen:

“Eric has been very good coming off the bench, starting, whatever type of role he’s had he’s scored,” Silas said. “Eric’s been the one who has been here the whole time and thriving in our system and what he’s been doing.


Gordon’s average of 18.6 points per game prior to Thursday was the most of his five seasons with the Rockets and his average of 23.3 points per 36 minutes topped his 13-year career. He went into Thursday’s game having scored at least 20 points in five consecutive games, his second five-game streak this season.

“I’ve always been able to be effective as a starter and coming off the bench because my play can adapt to anybody and I can adapt to any style of play,” Gordon said. “I can shoot, I can drive, play D. I just got to continue to be aggressive. My first year here, I was all about sacrificing to win. Nothing has changed. That’s what I’m about.”

That also could make him a Sixth Man of the Year candidate again. He won the award in 2016-17, his first season with the Rockets and the first of his career he primarily came off the bench. He averaged 16.2 points per game that season, making 40.6 percent of his shots, 37.2 percent of his 3s.

Gordon is making 46.3 percent of his shots this season, 36.6 percent of his 3s. He is getting to the rim much more often than in any of his previous seasons with the Rockets, connecting on 64.3 percent of his 4.4 shots per game within five feet while taking more shots at the rim.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.houstonchronicle.com/texas-sports-nation/rockets/amp/Eric-Gordon-likely-reserve-role-sixth-man-Rockets-15942979.php


I think Gordon is a very good, albeit overpaid player. Offensively his upside comes from not needing much space to get a shot of. How often did DJA have to pass up an open shot because the defender was just close enough? That won't happen with Gordon.

His 'upside' defensively in parenthesis because he's a mediocre to bad defender would be in a switching scheme as he's particularly strong for his size and position and can handle his own versus bigger players in the post.

Not sure we should be interested because matching while remaining under the hard cap is tough, but depending what else we could get around the league I could see us being interested in a swap with Lopez.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1173 » by LuessiT » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:30 am

giannis and 1 wrote:
LuessiT wrote:
RiotPunch wrote:This is really bad for us.


I think it was a meme. I hope...

What if we switch Reddish for Huerter or Collins?

This would be an offseason trade, btw.


Collins would be a pretty good piece, though I'm not sure if we're the right team to utilize him. He's also a RFA and a S&T would hardcap us so I can't see that in the offseason.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1174 » by paulpressey25 » Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:42 am

blazza18 wrote:Do we think Horst even asked for Hart?


Who needs him when you’ve got Bogdan.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1175 » by ShootingtheJ » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:13 am

blazza18 wrote:Do we think Horst even asked for Hart?


Yeah I'm sure the Pelicans were like " everybody wants Jrue, how could we minimize our return?"
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1176 » by blazza18 » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:19 am

ShootingtheJ wrote:
blazza18 wrote:Do we think Horst even asked for Hart?


Yeah I'm sure the Pelicans were like " everybody wants Jrue, how could we minimize our return?"


We gave them a bunch of picks they wanted and our guard rotation. Hart wouldn't have been that valuable where they balked at it.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1177 » by DrWood » Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:12 am

crowhead76 wrote:Image

Holiday - Rubio - Merrill - (2)Adams
DDV - Matthews - Forbes
Middleton - Nwaba - Pat - Nwora
Giannis - (BuyOut) - Thanasis
Reid - Portis - (2)Diakite

That's some serious rearranging of the deck chairs. I don't mind Rubio, though he's completely lost his shot this year, and I'd take a shot at naz reid developing.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1178 » by StickeeFingaz » Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:20 pm

KOC also reporting that the Bucks are still interested in acquiring PJ Tucker.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1179 » by tydett » Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:34 pm

StickeeFingaz wrote:KOC also reporting that the Bucks are still interested in acquiring PJ Tucker.


Woj about to tweet that the Bucks have acquired PJ Tucker for (insert return here), Alex Lasry tweets "Let's gooooo" at Tucker, Rockets will deny the trade ever happened, Bucks get hit with a tampering charge and lose their next 5 second round picks.
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Re: Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics 

Post#1180 » by emunney » Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:00 pm

Don't trade for PJ Tucker. The guy has been overrated based on his fit with Harden for years. He is NOT a similar fit with Giannis, and he's well over the hill. It's a bad idea. If you want a versatile defender with questionable shooting out of Houston, Nwaba is the guy.
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