Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - Crowder Out 8 Weeks

raferfenix · Post #141 » by **raferfenix** » Tue Oct 10, 2023 4:22 pm

Turk Nowitzki wrote:If you trust Shaffty's info and I'm remembering correctly, he said we had the best offer on the table for FVV at the deadline and Masai decided not to trade him. So we can probably thank Masai for us getting Dame in the end.

Yup. Also took note Shaffty said a FVV trade would have required Bobby.

Ron Swanson · Post #142 » by **Ron Swanson** » Tue Oct 10, 2023 4:22 pm

Turk Nowitzki wrote:
raferfenix wrote:
Ron Swanson wrote:Like it was gonna be some 4D Chess move to have *checks notes* Spencer Dinwiddie or Fred Van Vleet take the ball out of his hands for the betterment of the offense.

Am curious how close we really were to a non-Dame trade.

Shams sure made it seem like we wanted FVV at the deadline. Less sure that I believe Bojan was a serious target.

Lot of Bradley Beal smoke this offseason too.

If you trust Shaffty's info and I'm remembering correctly, he said we had the best offer on the table for FVV at the deadline and Masai decided not to trade him. So we can probably thank Masai for us getting Dame in the end.

Also an interesting thought (assuming we would've been able to resign FVV) is would we be better off with FVV/Jrue/Khris/Giannis/Brook over Dame/whoever/Khris/Giannis/Brook?

Quality over quantity in the NBA, always and forever. You pick Dame over FVV/Jrue 100/100 times.

Turk Nowitzki · Post #143 » by **Turk Nowitzki** » Tue Oct 10, 2023 4:27 pm

Ron Swanson wrote:
Turk Nowitzki wrote:
raferfenix wrote:
Am curious how close we really were to a non-Dame trade.

Shams sure made it seem like we wanted FVV at the deadline. Less sure that I believe Bojan was a serious target.

Lot of Bradley Beal smoke this offseason too.

If you trust Shaffty's info and I'm remembering correctly, he said we had the best offer on the table for FVV at the deadline and Masai decided not to trade him. So we can probably thank Masai for us getting Dame in the end.

Also an interesting thought (assuming we would've been able to resign FVV) is would we be better off with FVV/Jrue/Khris/Giannis/Brook over Dame/whoever/Khris/Giannis/Brook?

Quality over quantity in the NBA, always and forever. You pick Dame over FVV/Jrue 100/100 times.

Yeah, I think it worked out to where we got the best player in the end and also the one Giannis most desired so that's an undeniable win/win.

Shaffty · Post #144 » by **Shaffty** » Tue Oct 10, 2023 4:58 pm

Turk Nowitzki wrote:
raferfenix wrote:
Ron Swanson wrote:Like it was gonna be some 4D Chess move to have *checks notes* Spencer Dinwiddie or Fred Van Vleet take the ball out of his hands for the betterment of the offense.

Am curious how close we really were to a non-Dame trade.

Shams sure made it seem like we wanted FVV at the deadline. Less sure that I believe Bojan was a serious target.

Lot of Bradley Beal smoke this offseason too.

Also an interesting thought (assuming we would've been able to resign FVV) is there any argument we would be better off with FVV/Jrue/Khris/Giannis/Brook over Dame/whoever/Khris/Giannis/Brook?

the only team combo that is better then Dame/Giannis is Steph/Giannis

engelmartin · Post #145 » by **engelmartin** » Tue Oct 10, 2023 5:27 pm

I’m just going to come right out and say it, I hate FVV. Not as a person but as a basketball player. He’s basically Earl Boykins. A clown show. The Dylan Brooks of PGs.

raferfenix · Post #146 » by **raferfenix** » Tue Oct 10, 2023 5:58 pm

Paying FVV upwards of $40 million per would have been ugly. Losing him outright to the Rockets would have been catastrophic.

It's an alternative history. Who knows what happens if Love doesn't undercut Giannis.

But based on what else we saw I don't think FVV would have been the difference in whether we won a ring or not. Seems like there was something that wasn't working with Bud.

And knowing we got Dame now makes the whole calculus different.

Serge28 · Post #147 » by **Serge28** » Tue Oct 10, 2023 6:11 pm

Read on Twitter

KG refers to Brook as one of the best "talkers" in the league here (~1:55-2:05). As in helping defense communicate, even when he's on the bench. Haven't heard that before.

Profound23 · Post #148 » by **Profound23** » Tue Oct 10, 2023 6:56 pm

engelmartin wrote:I’m just going to come right out and say it, I hate FVV. Not as a person but as a basketball player. He’s basically Earl Boykins. A clown show. The Dylan Brooks of PGs.

So Houston now has a backcourt of Dillon Brooks and Dillon Brooks? Ouch!

emunney · Post #149 » by **emunney** » Tue Oct 10, 2023 7:08 pm

Ron Swanson wrote:
Turk Nowitzki wrote:
raferfenix wrote:
Am curious how close we really were to a non-Dame trade.

Shams sure made it seem like we wanted FVV at the deadline. Less sure that I believe Bojan was a serious target.

Lot of Bradley Beal smoke this offseason too.

If you trust Shaffty's info and I'm remembering correctly, he said we had the best offer on the table for FVV at the deadline and Masai decided not to trade him. So we can probably thank Masai for us getting Dame in the end.

Also an interesting thought (assuming we would've been able to resign FVV) is would we be better off with FVV/Jrue/Khris/Giannis/Brook over Dame/whoever/Khris/Giannis/Brook?

Quality over quantity in the NBA, always and forever. You pick Dame over FVV/Jrue 100/100 times.

I agree with you, there's no comparison, if for no other reason than how uniquely perfect the pairing is with Giannis. Getting FVV for Bobby and change would have been a great move, though, and it was smart to pursue it.

BUCKnation · Post #150 » by **BUCKnation** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 12:29 am

Yeah, I think FVV would have been quite a good fit and think we easily have the best starting 5 last year.

Frank Nova · Post #151 » by **Frank Nova** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 1:07 am

If Pat wins the SG spot outright in the preseason do you give it to him or keep him in his reserve role and try and play him 30+mpg?

nagawicka · Post #152 » by **nagawicka** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 1:44 am

drdrG wrote:
nagawicka wrote:
drdrG wrote:Giannis saying he’ll set 50 screens for Dame if need be was the most encouraging thing said all preseason.

Why start now?

Obviously Giannis has big warts offensively. This will be the first time he plays with someone who he will defer to on offense. Dame will be by far the best PnR player he's played with and Stotts/Griffin are directing the offense rather than Bud.

You come across as very negative on a guy who has resurrected basketball in Milwaukee

Nah, not at all: everone knows heroball isn't winning ball. As you say: with Stotts/Griffin G should be able to play with flow & outside Bud's constraints. He'll have to sync w/Dame, & Dame's not dumb enough to make it a two-man show. G's commitment to 'working' wasn't a good look after a season of iso, 'point G', and dribbling & falling down--Bucks on the floor w/that had to do whatever they could, so what's he talkin 'bout, really. And IF he *doesn't* work on those aspects, we'll get a show, n points n wins . . . but it won't flow and shortchanging the team'll just look ugly on the floor.

MilHammer · Post #153 » by **MilHammer** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 7:18 am

Not knowing whats possible cap wise, my dream is we trade AJJ and Marjon for a bonafide 3&D guy.

theFireBlanket · Post #154 » by **theFireBlanket** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 7:41 am

MilHammer wrote:Not knowing whats possible cap wise, my dream is we trade AJJ and Marjon for a bonafide 3&D guy.

No, just say no.

Read on Twitter

RiotPunch · Post #155 » by **RiotPunch** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 7:58 am

MilHammer wrote:Not knowing whats possible cap wise, my dream is we trade AJJ and Marjon for a bonafide 3&D guy.

They both make so little, that player likely doesn't exist at $3.7M. Any move for a real dude at SG probably involves Bobby or Pat.

ShootingtheJ · Post #156 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 12:06 pm

Griffin has been extremely rigid in his rotations. Bobby hasn't played a minute at the 5 yet, and Crowder hasn't played a minute at the 4. The young guys never play with the starters.

I hope everyone is ready for the youngsters, especially AJJ, to get no chance at the rotation.

crowhead76 · Post #157 » by **crowhead76** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 12:23 pm

ShootingtheJ wrote:Griffin has been extremely rigid in his rotations. Bobby hasn't played a minute at the 5 yet, and Crowder hasn't played a minute at the 4. The young guys never play with the starters.

I hope everyone is ready for the youngsters, especially AJJ, to get no chance at the rotation.

The only known starter that we have seen play is Brook.

crowhead76 · Post #158 » by **crowhead76** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 12:38 pm

Marjon and the Portland 2nd for Nembhard

raferfenix · Post #159 » by **raferfenix** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 1:01 pm

BUCKnation wrote:Yeah, I think FVV would have been quite a good fit and think we easily have the best starting 5 last year.

If Giannis were healthy, do we think that team wins it all?

That's assuming we would have dealt Bobby + Grayson + 2029 (or something like that) for FVV.

Main issue this offseason would have been having to match Houston's offer.

Middleton also would have been less inclined to take less money if someone worse (or less accomplished at least) that's new to the team would be paid dramatically more, which has the tagalong effect when it'd come to Holiday's extension too.

If it'd have secured another chip and a Giannis extension the team wouldn't have cared so much about the money. But I don't think that future is better vs what we got now.

rayallenscalves · Post #160 » by **rayallenscalves** » Wed Oct 11, 2023 1:22 pm

I've largely been a Marjon non-believer since the day he was drafted, but still think he'd be the best option as the fifth starter. While his offense is still a work in progress (see Memphis game), his offense doesn't need to be perfect when playing with Dame, Giannis, Midds and Brook. However, I've seen enough of the other things -- rebounding, on-ball pressure, deflections, C&S 3s -- to maintain my belief in him in the starting lineup.

Plus, this helps balance out the first and second units. Malik feels like a great flamethrower type off the bench and would group nicely with Cam and Bobby for some second-unit offense.