Woj: Malcolm Brogdon S&T to Pacers for Picks (NO TPE)

HaroldinGMinor · Post #1461 » by **HaroldinGMinor** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 10:42 pm

Do I think Brogdon would have been a malcolmtent (intentional) if the Bucks matched? No. But by the same token if a guy wants out I have no problem with management trading him away. yes, there will always be caveats to that but in this case, he wanted to play a position that was occupied by a guy that's pretty good and just resigned to an extension.

Post #1462 » by **ReasonablySober** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 10:45 pm

I don't even think he signs that deal if he doesn't know ahead of time that the Bucks and Pacers had a trade. He probably signs the QO and takes unrestricted FA next summer. Hell, his agents probably indicated he would to the Bucks to force them to deal.

Post #1463 » by **humanrefutation** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 10:52 pm

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
Pachinko_ wrote:Ehm, all of us?
Like, when you're looking for a job and you have two offers, you're gonna pass on the one that offers you a promotion and more money and a more interesting role, because the other company is a few spot higher in the business insider rankings?
As if LOL

GOS's issues with Brogdon are personal. I don't think you need to spend more time analyzing it than that.

yeah im a bucks fan. if i was a toronto fan id be the one talking **** about kawhi right now too. ive missed 20 bucks games in 20 years 15k posts on this site how the hell isn't it personal. ive got rabies for crissakes

Nah, I think with you it's deeper than "I'm a Bucks fan." I'm a Bucks fan, too. I think you just don't like Brogdon as a human being.

Post #1464 » by **humanrefutation** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 10:54 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
HaroldinGMinor wrote:
Wooderson wrote:If Giannis had hit RFA and indicated he preferred to play elsewhere would you guys have obliged?

This is like comparing an apple to an orangutan anus.

If the alternative was a year on the QO and then he walks for nothing, of course I'm trading Giannis.

That's not the alternative in this situation, though. The direct comparison would be to ask whether you would match his offer sheet.

And for me, the answer is unquestionably yes, I match. Then I think about moving him if it's clear it won't work out in the long run.

yannisk · Post #1465 » by **yannisk** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:04 pm

The owners did not want to pay the luxury tax and they did not think that Brogdon was worth that money anyway. Otherwise they would have matched the offer and traded him for a comparable asset down the line. The fact that Brogdon wanted to leave gave them a nice excuse and they appear as nice employers instead of stingy

AussieBuck · Post #1466 » by **AussieBuck** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:09 pm

humanrefutation wrote:
GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
GOS's issues with Brogdon are personal. I don't think you need to spend more time analyzing it than that.

yeah im a bucks fan. if i was a toronto fan id be the one talking **** about kawhi right now too. ive missed 20 bucks games in 20 years 15k posts on this site how the hell isn't it personal. ive got rabies for crissakes

Nah, I think with you it's deeper than "I'm a Bucks fan." I'm a Bucks fan, too. I think you just don't like Brogdon as a human being.

Could be also true, but GOS does this with everyone who leaves like it's basic rules of the Bucks cult. :lol:

Post #1467 » by **humanrefutation** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:18 pm

AussieBuck wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:
yeah im a bucks fan. if i was a toronto fan id be the one talking **** about kawhi right now too. ive missed 20 bucks games in 20 years 15k posts on this site how the hell isn't it personal. ive got rabies for crissakes

Nah, I think with you it's deeper than "I'm a Bucks fan." I'm a Bucks fan, too. I think you just don't like Brogdon as a human being.

Could be also true, but GOS does this with everyone who leaves like it's basic rules of the Bucks cult.

Perhaps that's part of it, but I mean:

Malcolm brogdon can go **** his pompous glass feet bad back hurt leg too good for milwaukee self promoting smarter than the coach have it all whatever whatever ass

That doesn't seem to be just about him signing an offer sheet elsewhere. But then again, I actually like Brogdon as a person even as I'm disappointed that he left, so it does come off as outrageous to me to say those things about him.

Post #1468 » by **ReasonablySober** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:19 pm

yannisk wrote:The owners did not want to pay the luxury tax and they did not think that Brogdon was worth that money anyway. Otherwise they would have matched the offer and traded him for a comparable asset down the line. The fact that Brogdon wanted to leave gave them a nice excuse and they appear as nice employers instead of stingy

Given his role in Milwaukee he obviously isn't worth that money.

RogerMurdock · Post #1469 » by **RogerMurdock** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:21 pm

How can someone not like Brogdon as a human being? He's arguably the best citizen in the NBA. And I'm not exaggerating.

There sure is a whole lot of BS in this thread.

Post #1470 » by **humanrefutation** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:24 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
yannisk wrote:The owners did not want to pay the luxury tax and they did not think that Brogdon was worth that money anyway. Otherwise they would have matched the offer and traded him for a comparable asset down the line. The fact that Brogdon wanted to leave gave them a nice excuse and they appear as nice employers instead of stingy

Given his role in Milwaukee he obviously isn't worth that money.

That's one way to look at it, but I look at it as if the tax is triggered by the entire roster. That in order to get to the point where Brogdon's salary puts you in the tax, you have to pay Lopez and Middleton and Bledsoe and Giannis etc etc. Thus, the question should be whether the roster with all of those pieces is worth paying the tax for. Or would a cheaper roster with all minus Bledsoe be preferable? Or all minus Lopez? Or all minus Middleton?

AussieBuck · Post #1471 » by **AussieBuck** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:27 pm

humanrefutation wrote:
AussieBuck wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
Nah, I think with you it's deeper than "I'm a Bucks fan." I'm a Bucks fan, too. I think you just don't like Brogdon as a human being.

Could be also true, but GOS does this with everyone who leaves like it's basic rules of the Bucks cult.

Perhaps that's part of it, but I mean:

Malcolm brogdon can go **** his pompous glass feet bad back hurt leg too good for milwaukee self promoting smarter than the coach have it all whatever whatever ass

That doesn't seem to be just about him signing an offer sheet elsewhere. But then again, I actually like Brogdon as a person even as I'm disappointed that he left, so it does come off as outrageous to me to say those things about him.

GOS is the Bogut of posting. When things are going badly he's internally outrageous, when we're doing well he's pissing out of the tent, calling the guys who leave traitors and trashing everyone's team on the general board. I don't agree with it, I'm happy for Brogdon, I get that he felt held back and he was a good dude.

kid idioteque · Post #1472 » by **kid idioteque** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:39 pm

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:we got players making 80+ million all over this league who are malcontent and demanding out. with what we know now it appears he was even demanding out of last years amazing run. I think its cute some of you guys think we should have spent 85 million forcing him to come back simply because we could.

considering the nature of how the rest of this team gets along and how well they play without him all I can say with all my heart is.... Malcolm brogdon can go **** his pompous glass feet bad back hurt leg too good for milwaukee self promoting smarter than the coach have it all whatever whatever ass

Exactly! He was already vocally unhappy on a team that could've easily won the whole thing. :lol:

kid idioteque · Post #1473 » by **kid idioteque** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:42 pm

Ron Swanson wrote:Sorry, I'm not gonna go with the narrative that paints a guy who was nothing but a model citizen both on and off the court during his time here as someone who would "become an issue" in the locker room simply because he wanted a bigger role on the team.

So you're saying it's impossible that he's both a good guy and wanted out? That's a weird insinuation. Those two things are not mutually exclusive.

kid idioteque · Post #1474 » by **kid idioteque** » Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:48 pm

I believe Malcolm is a good guy who really, really wanted to be elsewhere. I don't even hold that against him.

If we had matched I don't believe he'd have been a particularly vocal malcontent but a malcontent nonetheless and eventually would've forced his way off the team.

Or as someone mentioned he could've accepted the QO and been unrestricted next year.

truly · Post #1475 » by **truly** » Sat Nov 16, 2019 12:02 am

ReasonablySober wrote:I don't even think he signs that deal if he doesn't know ahead of time that the Bucks and Pacers had a trade. He probably signs the QO and takes unrestricted FA next summer. Hell, his agents probably indicated he would to the Bucks to force them to deal.

You think that Brogdon with serious injury concerns would be willing to take the QO and explore FA as a 27 year old?I think there is zero chance that would have happened.

Wooderson · Post #1476 » by **Wooderson** » Sat Nov 16, 2019 12:04 am

Seriously doubt Brogdon would have taken the QO. Right out of the gate he's down $17M as his QO was like $3M

If he picks up a serious injury and is set to miss the following season what's his market then? Does he have to take a one year prove it deal and then be 29 in the first year of next contract with a better FA class and more injury concern?

He loses out the $ this year and pushes his first UFA contract out another year if not more if there's a serious injury (which then might be the only big contract he ever gets). Massive gamble for someone who hasnt made a ton in his career so far.

Post #1477 » by **ReasonablySober** » Sat Nov 16, 2019 12:09 am

He didn't want to be here. So either he takes the QO, works with the Bucks to make a trade happen, or the Pacers offer him a poison pill deal so odious the Bucks are put in a bad spot. Remember, it was their owner who approached the Bucks with the offer of picks so as to make the clean deal happen.

Neuromancer56 · Post #1478 » by **Neuromancer56** » Sat Nov 16, 2019 12:12 am

In an interview Horst said that there were additional things that led to Malcolm Brogdon leaving that he was not free to talk about. Not sure what those things were. Brogdon is the 2nd highest paid player in Pacers history. That makes me feel a little less bad about letting him go. But I still think we gave way too much to Middleton (who I actually like) and should have spent some of that money on keeping Brogdon. Brogdon was one of the smartest players on the Bucks, and I'm sad to see him go. The real question is do we prefer Bledsoe or Brogdon. In my mind they are about equal. Korver, Mathews, and RoLo seem like absolute trash though.

DavidDunn21 · Post #1479 » by **DavidDunn21** » Sat Nov 16, 2019 12:19 am

Mike Redd was another second rounder who wanted out. So what?

The question is: would you have traded Mike Redd because he wanted out if you already had 1994 Shaq? Would you do that just to avoid the luxury tax while at the same time giving Big Dog 178 million dollars?

rilamann · Post #1480 » by **rilamann** » Sat Nov 16, 2019 12:39 am

Both guys at their best, it's close, but I would take Bledsoe over Brogdon, if we are going strictly on talent and skill set. However, the comparison becomes comically not close when you take into account the mental aspect. Bledsoe might very well make the all star team this season, but that isn't going to do us any good when he inevitably falls off a cliff when we need him the most. If I am serious about winning a championship, give me Brogdon over Bledsoe all day.