PG Celtics - Bucks Fade

[mattg]

Settle down dude. Pretty much everyone's acknowledging that Giannis has played like ass so far this season. He also didn't turn into Ben Simmons overnight.

You're missing the point, this isn't remotely new at all. Also haven't remotely compared him to Ben Simmons in any way, so that's just stupid.

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=2374445&p=113085248&hilit=lineup#p113084975
https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=2357992&p=111482593&hilit=lineup#p111482593

Been saying it since last year mid season and not a single person has even been able to post 1 theoretical contending lineup led by Giannis. So I will continue asking it until people pull their head out of the sand.

Brook
Giannis
Khris
Trent
Dame

You're welcome.

That's a 2nd round CEILING lineup at 100% health and everyone here knows it. And that's if everything breaks right for us. If everyone actually believed it was a contending lineup like you say then there would be zero discussion on this board other than "we're good once Midds is back".

[DingleJerry]

Here's another, media generally considers NYK a contender. KAT for Giannis only makes them stronger. Media considers PHI a contender, Embiid for Giannis. Bradley Beal for Giannis in PHX. Kyrie for Giannis in Dallas.

Those are just like 5 easy ones.

[mattg]

Here's another, media generally considers NYK a contender. KAT for Giannis only makes them stronger. Media considers PHI a contender, Embiid for Giannis. Bradley Beal for Giannis in PHX. Kyrie for Giannis in Dallas.

Those are just like 5 easy ones.

So basically the "easy ones" that are "realistic lineups" are where if you can pair Giannis with 2 other All-NBA players, and some cases multiple additional all stars in addition to the all nba players you can have a contender around Giannis.

Besides that these "examples" are not only unrealistic, but also just adding Giannis to teams that are already looked at contenders without him and in some cases he's not even the best player on the team anymore.

[DingleJerry]

Here's another, media generally considers NYK a contender. KAT for Giannis only makes them stronger. Media considers PHI a contender, Embiid for Giannis. Bradley Beal for Giannis in PHX. Kyrie for Giannis in Dallas.

Those are just like 5 easy ones.

So basically the "easy ones" that are "realistic lineups" are where if you can pair Giannis with 2 other All-NBA players, and some cases multiple additional all stars in addition to the all nba players you can have a contender around Giannis.

Besides that these "examples" are not only unrealistic, but also just adding Giannis to teams that are already looked at contenders without him and in some cases he's not even the best player on the team anymore.

Thats all besides the point and the question asked.

[Sigra]

Giannis clearly use like 10% of his posible effort because he wants to stay healthy for playoffs. Talking about defense here.

[nagawicka]

Sorry, but basketball is a business and if you get a godfather offer for Giannis, you do it. Especially if the moves you’re making on the fringes aren’t doing anything but spinning the wheels.

The Godfather offer for Giannis is like somebody who's arguably as good as Giannis plus something else really really good. Anything else you absolutely can refuse. You keep him until he doesn't want to be here, it really is as simple as that. I can't imagine how 'basketball is a business' justifies moving arguably the best player in the world *who loves our small city* for a collection of abstractions.

'It's a business' justifies everything and it's the collection of concrete assets received in return that justifies moving him. Not some unnamed abstractions nobody is proposing.

[emunney]

Sorry, but basketball is a business and if you get a godfather offer for Giannis, you do it. Especially if the moves you’re making on the fringes aren’t doing anything but spinning the wheels.

The Godfather offer for Giannis is like somebody who's arguably as good as Giannis plus something else really really good. Anything else you absolutely can refuse. You keep him until he doesn't want to be here, it really is as simple as that. I can't imagine how 'basketball is a business' justifies moving arguably the best player in the world *who loves our small city* for a collection of abstractions.

'It's a business' justifies everything and it's the collection of concrete assets received in return that justifies moving him. Not some unnamed abstractions nobody is proposing.

'It's a business' does not justify doing something that will immediately destroy the business. But I will stand corrected when I see Fiserv fill up with people wearing "UNPROTECTED DRAFT PICK" jerseys.

[AussieBuck]

Been mostly catching the games on my phone commuting so I haven't had the most informed view so far. Has Thannies been on the bench at all? He's usually the one in Gianni's ear when he's playing suboptimal.

[chonestown]

Time to accept the fact that Giannis is a low IQ, coach killer who either refuses or cannot adapt his game in order to help the team win. Horst, Bud, Griff, Doc, Jrue, Dame, Kobe - it’s all irrelevant.

Thank god the stars aligned in 2021.

What I grab from this is Giannis got Kidd fired.

My analysis regarding that: whatta guy.

[blazza18]

Giannis turns 30 in December. The Thunder traded Russell Westbrook at age 30 and he had two really good years after that then fell off. I really hope Giannis can improve his outside game in the next couple years because I fear a Westbrook trajectory with too much reliance on athleticism. It would be really sad to see Giannis move to a different team and I hope he can age gracefully and stay with the Bucks.

I don't think we're quite there yet but this is interesting indeed. I wont knock people for wanting to go down with the ship if Giannis does completely fall off but the organisation should have some fallback options in case it does.

[Plossum]

You never trade an MVP candidate unless they’re asking out and pulling a Harden on you.

Trading Giannis would be madness.

[fansinceforever]

Every statement about Giannis should be preceded by saying that Doc is a **** disaster. Two of the best offensive players of all time and he can't scheme easy baskets for them or others who should theoretically be open.

It's pathetic.

[MickeyDavis]

Every statement about Giannis should be preceded by saying that Doc is a **** disaster. Two of the best offensive players of all time and he can't scheme easy baskets for them or others who should theoretically be open.

It's pathetic.

Maybe. You can coach Giannis to do all the right things. He'll nod. And then he goes out and plays the same way he always plays. And Dame isn't the same player when he only initiates some of the time. Can it still work with the 2 of them? Sure. But it becomes less likely with each game.

[paulpressey25]

Every statement about Giannis should be preceded by saying that Doc is a **** disaster. Two of the best offensive players of all time and he can't scheme easy baskets for them or others who should theoretically be open.

It's pathetic.

Maybe. You can coach Giannis to do all the right things. He'll nod. And then he goes out and plays the same way he always plays. And Dame isn't the same player when he only initiates some of the time. Can it still work with the 2 of them? Sure. But it becomes less likely with each game.

Would be interesting to watch a game from say spring of 2019, when the team was operating on all cylinders. See the differences then and now. I may watch one this weekend.

[fansinceforever]

Every statement about Giannis should be preceded by saying that Doc is a **** disaster. Two of the best offensive players of all time and he can't scheme easy baskets for them or others who should theoretically be open.

It's pathetic.

Maybe. You can coach Giannis to do all the right things. He'll nod. And then he goes out and plays the same way he always plays. And Dame isn't the same player when he only initiates some of the time. Can it still work with the 2 of them? Sure. But it becomes less likely with each game.

True but it's also tough to ask him to commit to something that hasn't worked especially when we're almost always playing from behind. Giannis is playing with blinders on more than we've ever seen him. I think it's because he doesn't trust his teammates.... And who can blame em?

[MickeyDavis]

We won the title in Jrue's first year here. Having the season start 2 months later and be 10 games shorter helped. We struggled early going 2-3. We had a 6 game losing streak that season. But eventually figured it out. And of course Giannis, Khris and Brook were 4 years younger.

[BUCKnation]

Mavs and Celtics in recent years have been .500 teams going into the new year before eventually making the finals

[ShootingtheJ]

The Godfather offer for Giannis is like somebody who's arguably as good as Giannis plus something else really really good. Anything else you absolutely can refuse. You keep him until he doesn't want to be here, it really is as simple as that. I can't imagine how 'basketball is a business' justifies moving arguably the best player in the world *who loves our small city* for a collection of abstractions.

'It's a business' justifies everything and it's the collection of concrete assets received in return that justifies moving him. Not some unnamed abstractions nobody is proposing.

'It's a business' does not justify doing something that will immediately destroy the business. But I will stand corrected when I see Fiserv fill up with people wearing "UNPROTECTED DRAFT PICK" jerseys.

I can't even imagine the horror of John Horst trying to rebuild through the draft.

[ShootingtheJ]

We won the title in Jrue's first year here. Having the season start 2 months later and be 10 games shorter helped. We struggled early going 2-3. We had a 6 game losing streak that season. But eventually figured it out. And of course Giannis, Khris and Brook were 4 years younger.

I'm obviously not the biggest Brook fan here, but he's a vampire. Clearly hasn't aged a single day. Was matched up with Tatum repeatedly last night, anticipated his moves, and knocked the dribble away at least twice

You can argue that Brook gets cooked in the playoffs because he too slow, I do all the time, but I don't see any argument for him being older, or slower.

[Prez]

Not trading Bobby at any point in the past year is unserious business and makes me not take this team seriously.

It'd be one thing if he was just a trash defensive player. But even offensively, in 2024 the dude is taking the fewest 3PA since his 2nd season almost a decade ago at this point. But is #2 in the entire league in post up frequency on crap efficiency, despite playing on a team with Giannis/Dame. And it's not a small sample size thing either, he was #2 in post up frequency last year as well.

We are almost 18 points per 100 possessions worse with this loser on the floor and you feel it every time he's in the game. I'm just so tired man. If he is not traded idk if I'm making it through this season lol.