Bucks-Bobcats Postgame Thread 1/6/2007

[LUKE23]

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See, I would think those three guys would be good too....but for some reason they essentially suck. Granted they have had some injuries, but they just don't ever break out.

I don't like Felton at all as a PG and never did....the guy plays out of control.....but I can't pin all their problems on him. I think they are like us....a lot of over-rated talent that occasionaly gets some stats because someone has to on that team. I think it is bad management like we have

Not to open the Redd debate up, but you can see that Golden State doesn't miss J-Rich much at all.....but they clearly missed Stephen Jackson. For whatever reasons, a guy like Stephen Jackson has "it" whereas guys like Redd and J-Rich don't.

If they had JRich at the beginning of the year with Jackson out they don't lose as many games. GS is a system, Davis is what makes it run overall, the wings for the most part are interchangeable, you just have to be a good athlete to play in that system.

I understand what you're saying about Charlotte and us, I just think you're oversimplfying it.

Also, Jackson, the guy you're saying "gets it" is one of the biggest criminals and POS' in the entire NBA. I won't deny he hits a lot of big shots, etc, but I wouldn't take him on our team in a million years.

[europa]

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See, I would think those three guys would be good too....but for some reason they essentially suck. Granted they have had some injuries, but they just don't ever break out.

I don't like Felton at all as a PG and never did....the guy plays out of control.....but I can't pin all their problems on him. I think they are like us....a lot of over-rated talent that occasionaly gets some stats because someone has to on that team. I think it is bad management like we have

Not to open the Redd debate up, but you can see that Golden State doesn't miss J-Rich much at all.....but they clearly missed Stephen Jackson. For whatever reasons, a guy like Stephen Jackson has "it" whereas guys like Redd and J-Rich don't.

It also helps that Baron Davis is pretty damn good and Nellie is a pretty damn good head coach. Redd has never had the luxury of a teammate as good as Davis or a head coach as good as Nellie.

Richardson is a decent player but he's more of a third option on a good team. Redd in my opinion is a legit No. 2 option on a good team. But as we all know he's thrust into the No. 1 role in Milwaukee. I actually think Richardson is a good fit for the Bobcats because he doesn't have to be the No. 1 guy there. That should fall on Wallace and Okafor.

And I agree with you about Felton. His game hasn't gone anywhere and I think he's best suited to be a backup combo guard on a good team.

[paulpressey25]

-= GS is a system, Davis is what makes it run overall, the wings for the most part are interchangeable, you just have to be a good athlete to play in that system..

I don't agree with this....there is something about Stephen Jackson...the guy has been on numerous winning teams....he knows how to play tough defense and has a take no prisoners mentality on the court....part of the reason Golden State came back from the dead was Jackson playing defense. He draws all the tough matchups and get's in guys heads like Artest and Rodman did.

I'd trade Redd for Steph Jackson tomorrow if I knew Jackson wouldn't get into trouble.....

[LUKE23]

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I don't agree with this....there is something about Stephen Jackson...the guy has been on numerous winning teams....he knows how to play tough defense and has a take no prisoners mentality on the court....part of the reason Golden State came back from the dead was Jackson playing defense. He draws all the tough matchups and get's in guys heads like Artest and Rodman did.

I'd trade Redd for Steph Jackson tomorrow if I knew Jackson wouldn't get into trouble.....

You're drunk man, seriously. No way in hell I trade Redd for Jackson.

And yes, Baron and Nellie are what make that GS team go. You surround his system and Baron's ridiculous abilities with guys who can get up and down the floor, and you have the Warriors. A team that will never win a title but be fun to watch and probably win enough games to make the playoffs.

Redd for Jackson, no way in hell. None.

[europa]

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I'd trade Redd for Steph Jackson tomorrow if I knew Jackson wouldn't get into trouble.....

That's a big key right there. I think the guy has a screw or two loose. But I agree he's very under-rated. He just seems to find himself on winning teams almost whereever he goes. I don't think that's a coincidence.

[REDDzone]

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That's a big key right there. I think the guy has a screw or two loose. But I agree he's very under-rated. He just seems to find himself on winning teams almost whereever he goes. I don't think that's a coincidence.

Yep, ask Warriors fans how they feel about ole "Cap'n Jack".

He's a straight winner.

EDIT: Even if he is a lil' crazy at times.

[LUKE23]

I'm not disagreeing he's a good player and clutch, but would you trade Redd for him? I sure as hell wouldn't.

[schweig]

Unless I'm mistaken we should take this Sund stuff back further.

I'm the opposite of excited about this guy. But he pulled one over on us in the Allen/Payton trade.

Also it looks like his first moves were in the 2001 draft, including Bobby Simmons #42 overall and trading his rights to the Wizards for Predrag Drobnjak. I'll beat you jokers to it, he did not win that trade. His draft record there really looks like ass. Not in a good way either.

[paulpressey25]

Luke...I know you are jumping on an opinion, but take a look at Jackson's stats...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/g ... atsId=3210

He's averaging 21/5/4 while his team has gone 18-9 with him in the lineup......some of his stats account for pace, but not all.

He's 6-8" and playing smothering defense on whoever is in his way. He's exactly what this team could use.....

[LUKE23]

Luke...I know you are jumping on an opinion, but take a look at Jackson's stats...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/g ... atsId=3210

He's averaging 21/5/4 while his team has gone 18-9 with him in the lineup......some of his stats account for pace, but not all.

He's 6-8" and playing smothering defense on whoever is in his way. He's exactly what this team could use.....

I know his numbers. They are somewhat inflated playing in a system that elevates FGA. I agree he's a good defender. Redd in that same situation in GS has elevated numbers as well.

I wouldn't trade Redd for him.

[europa]

I'm not disagreeing he's a good player and clutch, but would you trade Redd for him? I sure as hell wouldn't.

I would if I was confident he wouldn't go absolutely gonzo. Unfortunately, I have no such confidence. Even more important is the fact the two places where he has thrived most (San Antonio and Golden State) have strong head coaches and strong personalities with their top player. The Bucks have neither. Putting Jackson in a situation where he'd be the best player would be disastrous in my opinion. He had that situation in Atlanta and it didn't go well at all.

[paulpressey25]

-= Yep, ask Warriors fans how they feel about ole "Cap'n Jack"..

I'll dare Luke to post on the Warriors board a trade proposal of Redd for Steph Jax even up (forget cap implications)

It will be about 94-3 against the deal....and vehemently against the deal......and I'll wager that the most common reply is "why do we want an even higher paid clone of J-Rich back for our second best player?"

And I agree Europa, Jax will blow up again....Nellie is able to keep him under control right now.....here I guess he probably would fall to pieces.

[Simulack]

I'm not disagreeing he's a good player and clutch, but would you trade Redd for him? I sure as hell wouldn't.

Relative to their contracts, there is no question Jackson destroys Redd in terms of production this year. 21/5/4 with good defense for only 6 million a year.

Speaking completely hypothetically, no doubt Jackson and 10 million to spend on another player would probably help this team more than just Redd does regardless of Jackson being a nut case. With that money, you have enough to sign a Wallace type at SF.

Its so hypothetical its pointless, but if I could swap Jackson for Redd and know the Bucks would spend the 10 million on another player, I'd go for it. Of course we'd probably end up signing Bobby Simmons II with the ten million.

[schweig]

I think the difference in all-around scoring is enough that you're riding that J-Rich/Michael into the ground a little bit.

[Nowak008]

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I think the Bobcats have more upside. .

Disagree. Yi is the only player on either team that has superstar potential. They might have more young talent then we do, but we could deal Redd for better.

[LUKE23]

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I'll dare Luke to post on the Warriors board a trade proposal of Redd for Steph Jax even up (forget cap implications)

It will be about 94-3 against the deal....and vehemently against the deal......and I'll wager that the most common reply is "why do we want an even higher paid clone of J-Rich back for our second best player?"

And I agree Europa, Jax will blow up again....Nellie is able to keep him under control right now.....here I guess he probably would fall to pieces.

They have some of the most homer fans on RealGM, so I'm not going to waste my time doing that. They think Brandan Wright is clearly better than Yi for God's sake.

Jackson is having a great year. It's not a normal year for him while with Redd he has proven he's a 24-25 ppg scorer consistently in this league. That is not easy to come by. I do want to move him, but not for a player like Jackson.

Jackson was 17/3.3/4.6 last year and 14/2.6/3.1 the year before. I think he's in an ideal situation this year in GS in a pace-inflated situation with JRich out of the picture.

No argument he's a better defender than Redd.

[bentley]

I am surprised that no one mentioned a major adjustment in Bogut's game tonight. He almost never backed down the opposing center. He ALWAYS turned and faced the basket after receiving a pass making him highly effective with the hook.
When Bogut faces the basket he is very very effective whether outside or down low. He can pass or shoot effectively facing the basket.
The players looked very happy with the win.

[europa]

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Disagree. Yi is the only player on either team that has superstar potential. They might have more young talent then we do, but we could deal Redd for better.

I'm not sure Yi has superstar potential. I hope he does but I'm trying to temper my enthusiasm about him until he shows clear signs he can be an elite player. I haven't seen that yet.

[bigkurty]

How about Jackson and Harrington for Redd and CV? It works in the trade checker. However Golden State would probably laugh at me.

[Simulack]

I'm not sure Yi has superstar potential. I hope he does but I'm trying to temper my enthusiasm about him until he shows clear signs he can be an elite player. I haven't seen that yet.

I'd be happy if I felt Yi has certain all-star potential much less superstar potential.

I'm very happy we drafted him but he still has a ways to go. Obviously he isn't going to get the strength to play in the post this year but I'd like to see him demonstrate more of an ability to create his own shot... whether that be a couple of dribbles and then being able to shoot on the move or whether that be taking it all the way to the hoop and actually finishing (although that gets back to the needed strength).

He looks great compared to the other rookies drafted after him but if he is 23/24, you are comparing him to guys like Aldridge and Al Jefferson and hope to see more than a 20 point effort every 10 games or so..

Promising player but I'm going to withhold judgment before I'm sold on anything regarding his future.