Moderators: paulpressey25, MickeyDavis
Kerb Hohl wrote:I think if Johnny can get the 3P% up he will be a good player in the NBA. Or I guess he can have a unicorn Derozan career.
If he shoots like he did his entire freshman year + the 2nd half of this year, he will be a bust. Of course, no matter what, this was the right decision. I doubt he walks away with less than $20 million over the next 5 years.
DrWood wrote:Kerb Hohl wrote:I think if Johnny can get the 3P% up he will be a good player in the NBA. Or I guess he can have a unicorn Derozan career.
If he shoots like he did his entire freshman year + the 2nd half of this year, he will be a bust. Of course, no matter what, this was the right decision. I doubt he walks away with less than $20 million over the next 5 years.
Derozan with defense and rebounding would be a helluva player.
DingleJerry wrote:DrWood wrote:Kerb Hohl wrote:I think if Johnny can get the 3P% up he will be a good player in the NBA. Or I guess he can have a unicorn Derozan career.
If he shoots like he did his entire freshman year + the 2nd half of this year, he will be a bust. Of course, no matter what, this was the right decision. I doubt he walks away with less than $20 million over the next 5 years.
Derozan with defense and rebounding would be a helluva player.
After that early season hot shooting streak where he was hitting every contested mid range he came back to reality. When he had full size athletic defenders on him he really struggled to get these shots. IMO he has a long way to go and I don't expect any 'star' level from him in the NBA. I think his best case is hustle role player slasher type who can hang in the league because of the good D. If he learns to shoot the 3 he becomes a classic off the ball 3 and D type as his best case.
Hope he does better and all but put me in the skeptical camp.
DrWood wrote:DingleJerry wrote:DrWood wrote:Derozan with defense and rebounding would be a helluva player.
After that early season hot shooting streak where he was hitting every contested mid range he came back to reality. When he had full size athletic defenders on him he really struggled to get these shots. IMO he has a long way to go and I don't expect any 'star' level from him in the NBA. I think his best case is hustle role player slasher type who can hang in the league because of the good D. If he learns to shoot the 3 he becomes a classic off the ball 3 and D type as his best case.
Hope he does better and all but put me in the skeptical camp.
I don't think his ability to hit contested shots disappeared.
chonestown wrote:Diggr14 wrote:buckboy wrote:
Yeah, I didn't get that part either. I'm guessing it's because he's from Woodbury.
Sorry, it comes from the assumption that he thought he deserved more minutes on this team (which is true).. rather than working and earning them. He had a lot of talent, but was never going to displace Wahl for minutes, not unless he played harder and developed something Wahl couldnt do well... like shoot the 3. Most of the undertones about him transfering happened earlier in the season when Carter Gilmore was getting burn over him.
This is replacing one assumption with another assumption. Instead of entitled, he's lazy?
Carlson found little time because he provided little production. Not only is there no need to juice up the narrative, there's no evidence supporting it. Carlson was tentative when he found time, indecisive when he took action on offense and frequently overpowered on defense. I don't see hard work overcoming those limitations. That's not taking unwarranted shots at Carlson. He didn't look like a rotation player for a good B10 team. It happens. Hell, it happens more years than not with UW scholly players.
MickeyDavis wrote:I think he'll be a good NBA player. I also think once he was talked about as a lottery pick he pressed too much, forced things too much. I don't think he'll go as high as many do but looking forward to seeing him in the NBA next season.
Diggr14 wrote:That's my read on the situation from in person chatter and real life chatter. This guy was out the door in December. If you think he was just overmatched and said golly gee im going to transfer somewhere else.. that's naivety. He mailed in the offseason and the season itself, especially early on. This guy was a top 100 recruit by some, flashed early promise, then had a minor back injury and from there out just kind of mailed it in. He had all of the talent, heck probably more natural talent than Wahl, and just never made the next step over the last two seasons. Maybe you think it was because of injury. I tend to believe it's because he wasn't dedicated or in the right mindset to achieve like he should have at UW. If you have one foot out of the door before the season even really begins, how in the hell is one supposed to believe you aren't likely mailing it in and disgruntled?
chonestown wrote:Diggr14 wrote:That's my read on the situation from in person chatter and real life chatter. This guy was out the door in December. If you think he was just overmatched and said golly gee im going to transfer somewhere else.. that's naivety. He mailed in the offseason and the season itself, especially early on. This guy was a top 100 recruit by some, flashed early promise, then had a minor back injury and from there out just kind of mailed it in. He had all of the talent, heck probably more natural talent than Wahl, and just never made the next step over the last two seasons. Maybe you think it was because of injury. I tend to believe it's because he wasn't dedicated or in the right mindset to achieve like he should have at UW. If you have one foot out of the door before the season even really begins, how in the hell is one supposed to believe you aren't likely mailing it in and disgruntled?
My point is Carlson was not good. There's no need to read body language or engineer behavioral reasons for him not being good. His minor back injury kept him out for one full year and part of the following year, so it's disingenuous for it be portrayed as anything less than what it was.
His trajectory reminds me of Ilikanen. Highly sought, had physical gifts, never put it together. He barely got time this year, Hodges and at least one portal guy would have looked into eating into his possible minutes next year and he saw the writing on the wall.
Diggr14 wrote:chonestown wrote:Diggr14 wrote:That's my read on the situation from in person chatter and real life chatter. This guy was out the door in December. If you think he was just overmatched and said golly gee im going to transfer somewhere else.. that's naivety. He mailed in the offseason and the season itself, especially early on. This guy was a top 100 recruit by some, flashed early promise, then had a minor back injury and from there out just kind of mailed it in. He had all of the talent, heck probably more natural talent than Wahl, and just never made the next step over the last two seasons. Maybe you think it was because of injury. I tend to believe it's because he wasn't dedicated or in the right mindset to achieve like he should have at UW. If you have one foot out of the door before the season even really begins, how in the hell is one supposed to believe you aren't likely mailing it in and disgruntled?
My point is Carlson was not good. There's no need to read body language or engineer behavioral reasons for him not being good. His minor back injury kept him out for one full year and part of the following year, so it's disingenuous for it be portrayed as anything less than what it was.
His trajectory reminds me of Ilikanen. Highly sought, had physical gifts, never put it together. He barely got time this year, Hodges and at least one portal guy would have looked into eating into his possible minutes next year and he saw the writing on the wall.
I can see this. You are right with him not being as talented as advertised.
Prior to his back injury, when he displayed promise, and a 4-year player potential for us, he put forth quite a lot more effort in my opinion than what we saw this season (especially early on in the season). I do think he's listed a few inches taller than he really is which as a PF - 6'6 is not optimal. Either way, he is gone now. Too bad. You're probably right.. overrated. But I also think he was mailing it in as well. I really hate the transfer portal. If you want to leave.. leave, stop wasting everyone's time. Commit to the process or just leave the program and go work out on your own and try to find another program to deal with your schtick.
Diggr14 wrote:chonestown wrote:Diggr14 wrote:That's my read on the situation from in person chatter and real life chatter. This guy was out the door in December. If you think he was just overmatched and said golly gee im going to transfer somewhere else.. that's naivety. He mailed in the offseason and the season itself, especially early on. This guy was a top 100 recruit by some, flashed early promise, then had a minor back injury and from there out just kind of mailed it in. He had all of the talent, heck probably more natural talent than Wahl, and just never made the next step over the last two seasons. Maybe you think it was because of injury. I tend to believe it's because he wasn't dedicated or in the right mindset to achieve like he should have at UW. If you have one foot out of the door before the season even really begins, how in the hell is one supposed to believe you aren't likely mailing it in and disgruntled?
My point is Carlson was not good. There's no need to read body language or engineer behavioral reasons for him not being good. His minor back injury kept him out for one full year and part of the following year, so it's disingenuous for it be portrayed as anything less than what it was.
His trajectory reminds me of Ilikanen. Highly sought, had physical gifts, never put it together. He barely got time this year, Hodges and at least one portal guy would have looked into eating into his possible minutes next year and he saw the writing on the wall.
I can see this. You are right with him not being as talented as advertised.
Prior to his back injury, when he displayed promise, and a 4-year player potential for us, he put forth quite a lot more effort in my opinion than what we saw this season (especially early on in the season). I do think he's listed a few inches taller than he really is which as a PF - 6'6 is not optimal. Either way, he is gone now. Too bad. You're probably right.. overrated. But I also think he was mailing it in as well. I really hate the transfer portal. If you want to leave.. leave, stop wasting everyone's time. Commit to the process or just leave the program and go work out on your own and try to find another program to deal with your schtick.
jschligs wrote:I'm surprised people are soured even remotely by this move. It's normal now-a-days. People go to a big program, don't cut it, decide to go play closer to home. All good by me, we'll find a replacement.
Bucksmaniac wrote:I'm sorry, but I'm starting to sour on Giannis