Bucks Offseason Thread - Trade, news, re-tool discussion

[Mtsportsfan]

Thank you blazza and plossum , what a great discussion , found myself going back and forth and handing out and ones.
Who knows , maybe a coaching change is what this team needed and our big three will thrive with the next coach . with a few more additions and subtractions this team can get back .
Still not completely sold on Midds though , just don't want to pay him a max contract of any kind ! Now if he would restructure so we could sign other decent players I would be all for it , he is still a very good player . I guess I might be more inclined to run it back considering we just don't have a lot of assets to work with.

[midranger]

In the past 40 years, there haven’t been too many one-off champions.

Of those, most had the core just kind of age out without making big trades.
Ben Wallace Pistons
Shaq Heat (Wade was young enough that they retooled multiple years later)
Garnett Celtics
Dirk Mavs
Lebron Lakers (we’ll see)

One, the star player left immediately after
Kawhi Raptors

One team had a super star entering the backside of career and two all star-ish guys that they didn’t trade and kept going for it
Lebron Cavs 2.0


I’d put us in that last group as well. Of course, the superstar left a few years later for the big market where he won another championship*

[raferfenix]

I’m bullish on Holiday’s offense improving demonstrably if he plays more 2 in a different coach’s system.

I similarly think he has a ton of trade value. Just would be reticent to move him if we aren’t making a killing of a return.

[raferfenix]

If Bucks brass (including training staff tuned into player health) think we likely could trade Khris for a haul at the 2024 draft or whenever else that’d be a stark contrast with losing him for nothing.

Whether we can trade him this offseason for a good return without taking on that risk is a big question of course.

But I don’t see how just removing Middleton makes us better. We can find other places to get younger and more athletic than pure addition by subtraction.

Yes we need to solve for the second apron eventually. However you bring Haslem in so it’s not only a cash decision.

[German Athens]

If the Bucks make the commitment to get younger and athletic, what are the two best Khris and Jrue trades (or possibly just one big one) you can come up with? Go!

Riotpunch’s

Jrue and Bobby for maxey and Tobes

It would likely require harden staying in Philly, but the Philly board liked the proposal a few weeks ago. That would be the one at the top of my list.

Other lesser targets could be simons and Poole where we get more assets back, but I certainly don’t feel as good about those.

I guess KPJ or Jalen Green could be potential targets, too.

All of the deals above would likely be sending out one of the players, not both.

[Couch Potato]

If the Bucks make the commitment to get younger and athletic, what are the two best Khris and Jrue trades (or possibly just one big one) you can come up with? Go!

Riotpunch’s

Jrue and Bobby for maxey and Tobes

It would likely require harden staying in Philly, but the Philly board liked the proposal a few weeks ago. That would be the one at the top of my list.

Other lesser targets could be simons and Poole where we get more assets back, but I certainly don’t feel as good about those.

I guess KPJ or Jalen Green could be potential targets, too.

All of the deals above would likely be sending out one of the players, not both.

Tobias and Maxey are expiring deals though after next season. Yeah Bird rights for Tobias. Maxey will be RFA. Not sure I wanna even think about Tobias next contract. Bad enough were stuck in that boat now with Middleton opting in or a new max or walks. Also having Tobias. What we doing with Middleton? Giannis already plays PF. I don't want Middleton at SG.

[German Athens]

I’m bullish on Holiday’s offense improving demonstrably if he plays more 2 in a different coach’s system.

I similarly think he has a ton of trade value. Just would be reticent to move him if we aren’t making a killing of a return.

Yeah, I’ve been warming up to this idea. He has an incredible workload on defense, and I’m sure his legs aren’t as fresh as a result. Lessening his load on offense may make some of his shooting outside 16 feet look more like it does in the regular season.

Then factor in that Jrue has kinda been the bellwether of the team. When he hits shots, we look like a juggernaut.

I still don’t love the offensive fit with Giannis, though, and that largely drives my skepticism. Pretty much all of the recent championship winners had their top dollar players complement each other offensively. I think a better fit may raise our ceiling.

[German Athens]

Riotpunch’s

Jrue and Bobby for maxey and Tobes

It would likely require harden staying in Philly, but the Philly board liked the proposal a few weeks ago. That would be the one at the top of my list.

Other lesser targets could be simons and Poole where we get more assets back, but I certainly don’t feel as good about those.

I guess KPJ or Jalen Green could be potential targets, too.

All of the deals above would likely be sending out one of the players, not both.

Tobias and Maxey are expiring deals though after next season. Yeah Bird rights for Tobias. Maxey will be RFA. Not sure I wanna even think about Tobias next contract. Bad enough were stuck in that boat now with Middleton opting in or a new max or walks. Also having Tobias. What we doing with Middleton? Giannis already plays PF. I don't want Middleton at SG.

Yes, the deal is about maxey. Tobes is there for salary matching, but he’d likely be someone you let walk after the year, unless he comes back at like MLE or slightly above money. You’d then pay maxey big time after next season.

For just next season, Tobes would come off the bench, but he’d probably be a better 6th man for us than Bobby.

[German Athens]

The list of rising young talent who would conceivably be available drops off pretty hard though, imo. At least, drops off relative to just acquiring monte Morris and keeping the group intact.

Monte’s been thrown around here quite a bit over the past couple seasons, and he’s someone I wanted badly after the Boston series last year.

He can absolutely score from everywhere on the court, and his efficiencies holding up away from joker is a really good sign. He had a **** 5 to 1 assist to turnover ratio this year - what the hell. 75% (0-3), 51% (3-10), 49% (10-16), 46% (16-3p), 38% (3p) shooting splits this past season by distance. Those are insane, and his shooting has held up pretty well in the playoffs, too. He’s also currently 27.

[chonestown]

The list of rising young talent who would conceivably be available drops off pretty hard though, imo. At least, drops off relative to just acquiring monte Morris and keeping the group intact.

Monte’s been thrown around here quite a bit over the past couple seasons, and he’s someone I wanted badly after the Boston series last year.

He can absolutely score from everywhere on the court, and his efficiencies holding up away from joker is a really good sign. He had a **** 5 to 1 assist to turnover ratio this year - what the hell. 75% (0-3), 51% (3-10), 49% (10-16), 46% (16-3p), 38% (3p) shooting splits this past season by distance. Those are insane, and his shooting has held up pretty well in the playoffs, too. He’s also currently 27.

He ain't the Count of Monte Assist to TO for nothing.

[raferfenix]

Marc Stein:

The working assumption around the league is that both Middleton and Lopez will stay in Milwaukee. But even that comes with considerable uncertainty because A) no one knows yet how much it will cost to re-sign them and B) if the Bucks will have any flexibility to make the moves they need to make to freshen up the rest of the roster.

[Couch Potato]

Marc Stein:

The working assumption around the league is that both Middleton and Lopez will stay in Milwaukee. But even that comes with considerable uncertainty because A) no one knows yet how much it will cost to re-sign them and B) if the Bucks will have any flexibility to make the moves they need to make to freshen up the rest of the roster.

It's easy to say they will stay if Middleton just picks up his player option. Then just have to sign Lopez to a one or two year deal. But if Middleton opts out or pushes for his 5 year max of 5/$272M. I doubt we do it. If we do were probably back peddling and trimming payroll next few years to the point the Bucks would be just Giannis and Middleton with vet minimums and bought second round picks.

[Matches Malone]

No clue who this is, but he claims to have heard things lol.

Read on Twitter

[JayMKE]

No clue who this is, but he claims to have heard things lol.

Read on Twitter

seems "my uncle works at nintendo" tier

[pifhluk23]

I see the board has already flipped back to "yeah we can win another chip with this aging overpaid team."

If Middleton opts in an there is no trade for him then yeah you have to just go for it. That's the least desirable scenario imo and we'll be here again same spot next year.

[Licensed to Il]

No clue who this is, but he claims to have heard things lol.

Read on Twitter

seems "my uncle works at nintendo" tier

I rec’d this because “my uncle works at nintendo” was TOTALLY a thing kids claimed back in the day. The other one that was always around was “my dad is in the armed forces, and he’s going to beat you up when he gets back from his deployment!” Come on man, your dad picks you up from school in a station wagon.

[MickeyDavis]

I see the board has already flipped back to "yeah we can win another chip with this aging overpaid team."

If Middleton opts in an there is no trade for him then yeah you have to just go for it. That's the least desirable scenario imo and we'll be here again same spot next year.

As Human said in the Middleton thread you don't win a title with a bunch of Connaughton''s replacing Middleton. Because that's your option. No one on this team is currently overpaid. Brook is bargain. If Middleton gets a 4 year max we can have that conversation. But if anyone thinks we can replace Middleton (and Brook) with mid-level crap welcome to the lottery.

[Profound23]

I see the board has already flipped back to "yeah we can win another chip with this aging overpaid team."

If Middleton opts in an there is no trade for him then yeah you have to just go for it. That's the least desirable scenario imo and we'll be here again same spot next year.

As Human said in the Middleton thread you don't win a title with a bunch of Connaughton''s replacing Middleton. Because that's your option. No one on this team is currently overpaid. Brook is bargain. If Middleton gets a 4 year max we can have that conversation. But if anyone thinks we can replace Middleton (and Brook) with mid-level crap welcome to the lottery.

Miami fans would have said "You can't replace Herro with a bunch of Gabe Vincent's and Caleb Martin's." When you have good coaching you can do stuff like that.

I am not letting Brook walk unless he asks for a monster deal.
I am not giving Middleton 4/160m unless there is a very good chance we can flip him in a year. If our front office has a good feel on the Middleton trade market and truly believes they can eventually land something worth while for re-signing Middleton then fine. However, if we are going to be stuck with that contract while other teams have YOUNGER players doing what Middleton is doing at a fraction of the price that could also end up eventually putting us in the lottery, or worse.

I know one thing, I would not want to be the Bucks GM. There is no easy answer. You let Middleton go and don't find equivalent replacement(s).....that's a wrap and Giannis walks. You re-sign Middleton and he completely falls apart.........that's a wrap and Giannis walks. You hire a horrific coach......etc...etc. This could be our make or break season, I really hope not....but it could.

[raferfenix]

How highly do we rank Scoot?

Worth going all out for (whatever that means in practice)?

[emunney]

How highly do we rank Scoot?

Worth going all out for (whatever that means in practice)?

Very good prospect but not on that level in my opinion.