Post Game: Blazers

[BC_]

everything happens for a reason....

Tank?

[paul]

I don't get this... we had won what 4 of 5 before he got hurt in the SA game, lost that game to the best team in the league on a last second shot. Things were looking pretty good.

Yeah but the difference is, Bogut and the rest of the team didn't play like a bucket of **** in those games, if they did we would have been blown out in those games also. Our current team chemistry is rooted.

I will agree obviously Bogut played like crap, but did anyone else play worse than normal? I don't think so. We never got beat this bad even when Bogut was out. I think Bogut and Brandon have a good chemistry and he missed having Jennings out there. We may (probably) still would have lost, buy my money says it would've been a lot closer. I just think it's too much of a coincidence that his first game that he is out, we (and Bogut) play the worst game of the year.

There is definitely some irony in the fact that the guy who has been accused of ignoring Bogut a lot (well because he has ) goes out and Bogut is passed the ball a grand total of about 3 times for the game lol.

[JayMKE]

It's not time to tank lol. We knew we'd struggle through this stretch, if Jennings was going to get injured at all then he got injured at the "best" time because we weren't going to win a lot of these games as it is.

I don't see us winning many games period without Jennings and Delfino. If Bogut regresses back to emo Bogut without Jennings, this is easily the worst team in the league.

[blkout]

On the bright side, we could be close to full strength and losing by 30 to the Wizards like Charlotte.

[Scoops]

clearly we shoulda done that jennings for mo williams trade while we could, this game woulda been a 50 point win for the bucks if they had mo out there.

The future would be so much brighter too.

[paul]

clearly we shoulda done that jennings for mo williams trade while we could, this game woulda been a 50 point win for the bucks if they had mo out there.

Maybe just aim that directly as Sigra in his thread huh? It's ok, just growing a bit old after the 50 like it in the first 5 pages of the GT during the game.

[turbo2k]

Unless Salmon's returns to last years form miraculously, I agree that this is probably the worst team in the league. All a team has to do is pack the paint, send a double when (if) Bogut gets the ball, wait for brick, rush the ball up court, swing the ball, hit open jumper/dunk, repeat. No worries of penetration, or someone getting hot (ala Jennings, Delfino). Or maybe CDR takes a step forward. That would also be nice. Right now our most even competition appears to be Cavs, Raptors, Bobcats.

[Fight the Tank]

Addition by substraction. It is unbelivable how better some teams are without some players even if those players are talented and have good stats. Wait and see

Just classic.

[ampd]

If they are really going to tank at least waive or trade Boykins, Skinner, Brockman, and Dooling and pick up some D League guys with some upside or potential.

I could stand to watch some young guys with upside learn the ropes, or even reforming headcase types like Sean Williams and Rashad McCants. Watching veterans like dooling, Brockman, boykins, skinner, and the like get pounded is just brutal and demoralizing. In some ways its even worse than a D league team because you don't have guys who could potentially improve into quality players playing big minutes.

[unklchuk]

If I try to sum this up, I come up with the Bucks being a leaderless team. Don't think Skiles is most popular right now. Bogut didn't plug himself in. Jennings is missing in action. Salmons, Dooling, none of them are leaders.

The team doesn't know itself. The players are... hunkered down and enduring.

I honestly don't know what I'd do right now if I was GM. Bring in a good PG? That would help some, maybe more than some. But the cost? And if all it leads to is a short 1st round exit to a powerful EC team, that IMO doesn't make the franchise healthier.

Dump vets and look to the future? Doesn't sound like Herb Kohl. Does sound like a long slog to try to get good.

This season has unraveled like bad knitting. If there's a right course of action, I don't see it.

[paul]

If they are really going to tank at least waive or trade Boykins, Skinner, Brockman, and Dooling and pick up some D League guys with some upside or potential.

I could stand to watch some young guys with upside learn the ropes, or even reforming headcase types like Sean Williams and Rashad McCants. Watching veterans like dooling, Brockman, boykins, skinner, and the like get pounded is just brutal and demoralizing. In some ways its even worse than a D league team because you don't have guys who could potentially improve into quality players playing big minutes.

They absolutely are not going to tank, book it. No chance in hell this team tanks until at least Feb/March if at all.

[ampd]

It's not time to tank lol. We knew we'd struggle through this stretch, if Jennings was going to get injured at all then he got injured at the "best" time because we weren't going to win a lot of these games as it is.

I don't see us winning many games period without Jennings and Delfino. If Bogut regresses back to emo Bogut without Jennings, this is easily the worst team in the league.

I have no idea how some of you are giving Skiles a pass on this. There is no way that Skiles goes into practice, tells everyone that Bogut is the focal point of the offense and that he needs to touch the ball on the majority of possessions, and then what we saw in the game tonight happens. There is no way if Skiles wants the offense to go through bogut that he touches the ball in the paint once in the entire 1st quarter and finishes the game 2-7 with MAYBE 4 plays called for him while boykins and dooling shoot 23 times.

There is no way you take a player who has played as well lately as Bogut has and who has earned the confidence and respect that he has and call no plays for him and yank him simply because he is having a bad quarter or half. You don't do that to your best player as a coach, because giving your best player the ball repeatedly gives you the best chance to win, and you trust that that guy has the ability to turn it around if they don't start the game efficiently.

Skiles willingness to cut bait on guys when they don't play well sometimes is a great thing but with Bogut in this game, and likely in this stretch, it is a recipe for failure. Really ugly, horrible to watch failure.

[JayMKE]

If they are really going to tank at least waive or trade Boykins, Skinner, Brockman, and Dooling and pick up some D League guys with some upside or potential.

I could stand to watch some young guys with upside learn the ropes, or even reforming headcase types like Sean Williams and Rashad McCants. Watching veterans like dooling, Brockman, boykins, skinner, and the like get pounded is just brutal and demoralizing. In some ways its even worse than a D league team because you don't have guys who could potentially improve into quality players playing big minutes.

They absolutely are not going to tank, book it. No chance in hell this team tanks until at least Feb/March if at all.

we don't have to tank, we suck that bad

[UWM_Brew_Buck]

Why the hell is Brockman getting Larry's minutes or even seeing the court at all? Brockman for Bogut in the 1st was the worst sub move I've ever seen.

[Scoops]

Oh yeah, Scott I know you don't have much to work with right now but here's a tip, when you've got a guy averaging 21ppg since coming back from injury and your best scorer goes out GIVE HIM THE DAMN BALL.

Bogut didn't start the game out well, its true. But point me to a successful team that just stops going to their best player completely if he doesn't start the game hot. Bogut needs to get 15-20 attempts per game, 7 is ridiculous and completely Skiles' fault.

That shouldn't be taken as an endorsement of the Bucks' occasional tendency for forgetting about Bogut, but I'd posit that keeping Bogut involved requires more than just throwing him the ball on his preferred right block. For one he hasn't been particularly effective in the post thus far, scoring just 0.74 PPP, and it's also easier to double and take him out of the game with his back to the basket. Running P&R works well when it's there (1.05 PPP), but the Bucks haven't been able to get him many touches that way--just 17 shots all season.

In the end it's a two-way street. It's important Brandon Jennings and company continue to make an effort to find Bogut, but he also needs to stay active off the ball--something we've been seeing more of over the past couple weeks.

Blurb from the brewhoop article before the Jazz game.

It's so simple. Just dump the ball to Bogut in the post and watch the team succeed. Amazing how no coach can figure this out. Time to get a new one, imo.

[unklchuk]

Part of the reason Dooling and Boykins got so many more shots than Bogut is because that's the kind of guards they are. Score? Sure. Run an offense? Not so much.

I recall Dooling trying to feed the paint and I think I recall as many turnovers as assists.

[paul]

Oh yeah, Scott I know you don't have much to work with right now but here's a tip, when you've got a guy averaging 21ppg since coming back from injury and your best scorer goes out GIVE HIM THE DAMN BALL.

Bogut didn't start the game out well, its true. But point me to a successful team that just stops going to their best player completely if he doesn't start the game hot. Bogut needs to get 15-20 attempts per game, 7 is ridiculous and completely Skiles' fault.

That shouldn't be taken as an endorsement of the Bucks' occasional tendency for forgetting about Bogut, but I'd posit that keeping Bogut involved requires more than just throwing him the ball on his preferred right block. For one he hasn't been particularly effective in the post thus far, scoring just 0.74 PPP, and it's also easier to double and take him out of the game with his back to the basket. Running P&R works well when it's there (1.05 PPP), but the Bucks haven't been able to get him many touches that way--just 17 shots all season.

In the end it's a two-way street. It's important Brandon Jennings and company continue to make an effort to find Bogut, but he also needs to stay active off the ball--something we've been seeing more of over the past couple weeks.

Blurb from the brewhoop article before the Jazz game.

It's so simple. Just dump the ball to Bogut in the post and watch the team succeed. Amazing how no coach can figure this out. Time to get a new one, imo.

Wait, was someone suggesting that Bogut should just stand on the block and be given the ball in a stationary 'about to be double or triple teamed' position? Did I miss that? Well we wouldn't even need a coach for that right?
Call me crazy, but a few of us wouldn't have minded seeing a few actual plays run for him at some point other than the very first play of the game lol, that way maybe he can do exactly what Frank suggested and catch it on the move. Hell just run that one again if you have to, it seemed to work pretty well the only time we did run it seeing LMA hacked him and put him on the line.

I know, all this experimental thinking is getting to me too.

[ReasonablySober]

Plays run for the center? Maybe it's just me but when I think of the centers who deserve to have the offense run through them, guys like Shaq, Duncan, Hakeem and Ewing, they get the ball in an iso and make things happen. I don't remember them coming off picks or getting the ball in motion.

[Franc]

Why the hell is Brockman getting Larry's minutes or even seeing the court at all? Brockman for Bogut in the 1st was the worst sub move I've ever seen.

My point also.

[blkout]

Plays run for the center? Maybe it's just me but when I think of the centers who deserve to have the offense run through them, guys like Shaq, Duncan, Hakeem and Ewing, they get the ball in an iso and make things happen. I don't remember them coming off picks or getting the ball in motion.

Your point is? Bogut isn't Shaq/Duncan/Hakeem? Bogut shouldn't be the first option when Jennings is out?