ATL - 20-21 Season Begins

tedbrogen · Post #261 » by **tedbrogen** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:45 am

buckboy wrote:
giannis and 1 wrote:Levert+Dinwiddie+Prince+Allen+3 firsts, 2 first swaps, and 2 2nds. If it's something like that, I don't see how that is terrible considering Harden wants a trade, is 2 years away from free agency, and is 31 years old.

There's very likely not a top 50 player in that package.

That is a horrible deal for a top 5 player under contract for 2 years.

Yep. They can just hold onto Harden and call his bluff. Trade him for a better package at the deadline to a contender thinking he is the final piece. Harden's not going to sit out and lose out on millions because he can't instantly be in Brooklyn. The Rockets have leverage.

giannis and 1 · Post #262 » by **giannis and 1** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:54 am

tedbrogen wrote:
buckboy wrote:
giannis and 1 wrote:Levert+Dinwiddie+Prince+Allen+3 firsts, 2 first swaps, and 2 2nds. If it's something like that, I don't see how that is terrible considering Harden wants a trade, is 2 years away from free agency, and is 31 years old.

There's very likely not a top 50 player in that package.

That is a horrible deal for a top 5 player under contract for 2 years.

Yep. They can just hold onto Harden and call his bluff. Trade him for a better package at the deadline to a contender thinking he is the final piece. Harden's not going to sit out and lose out on millions because he can't instantly be in Brooklyn. The Rockets have leverage.

What contender has space to fit in Harden and also has a young elite player to offer? Only one is Philly. Maybe the Warriors if they offer Wiggins, #2, and a few 1sts but do the Rockets want Wiggins contract? It's a questionable fit as well for the Warriors. There is zero chance they get a Mitchell/Murray/Tatum type of player.

giannis and 1 · Post #263 » by **giannis and 1** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:57 am

tedbrogen wrote:
buckboy wrote:
giannis and 1 wrote:Levert+Dinwiddie+Prince+Allen+3 firsts, 2 first swaps, and 2 2nds. If it's something like that, I don't see how that is terrible considering Harden wants a trade, is 2 years away from free agency, and is 31 years old.

There's very likely not a top 50 player in that package.

That is a horrible deal for a top 5 player under contract for 2 years.

Yep. They can just hold onto Harden and call his bluff. Trade him for a better package at the deadline to a contender thinking he is the final piece. Harden's not going to sit out and lose out on millions because he can't instantly be in Brooklyn. The Rockets have leverage.

Also, you have to look at all the factors in the trade. Harden is 31, is a difficult player to play with , and is now forcing his way out of an organization that has done basically everything to accommodate him. These factors limit the number of teams interested in him.

giannis and 1 · Post #264 » by **giannis and 1** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:00 am

Maybe Adebayo(or Herro)+Robinson+Nunn+Olynyk+draft picks

Then they flip Nunn and Olynyk at the deadline for more picks

thrice123 · Post #265 » by **thrice123** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:03 am

giannis and 1 wrote:Maybe Adebayo(or Herro)+Robinson+Nunn+Olynyk+draft picks

Then they flip Nunn and Olynyk at the deadline for more picks

Would love that. Then Butler and Harden don't work out and we get to see miami fans sad.

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Nowak008 · Post #266 » by **Nowak008** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:15 am

Boston trading Smart for Harden would be the worst move alive.

DrWood · Post #267 » by **DrWood** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:21 am

paulpressey25 wrote:I like Phoenix on this one. With Paul, Rubio is redundant. And always viewed Oubre as a volume scorer guy on a bad team. The pick is protected out 4 years.

In the meantime, the Suns should win 45-50 games if they can assemble the rest of the roster well (big if).

I agree with all that, but why trade for CP if your upside is 50 wins? (assuming you mean 50 wins in an 82 game schedule. in a 72 game schedule it would be pretty good).

raferfenix · Post #268 » by **raferfenix** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:33 am

Would love to see the Rockets refuse to trade Harden and Russ and prove they are really “willing to get uncomfortable" until their demands are met.

buckboy · Post #269 » by **buckboy** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:46 am

giannis and 1 wrote:
tedbrogen wrote:
buckboy wrote:
There's very likely not a top 50 player in that package.

That is a horrible deal for a top 5 player under contract for 2 years.

Yep. They can just hold onto Harden and call his bluff. Trade him for a better package at the deadline to a contender thinking he is the final piece. Harden's not going to sit out and lose out on millions because he can't instantly be in Brooklyn. The Rockets have leverage.

Also, you have to look at all the factors in the trade. Harden is 31, is a difficult player to play with , and is now forcing his way out of an organization that has done basically everything to accommodate him. These factors limit the number of teams interested in him.

Then keep him and win 50 games for the next 2 years before you accept that garbage Nets offer imo.

giannis and 1 · Post #270 » by **giannis and 1** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:51 am

buckboy wrote:
giannis and 1 wrote:
tedbrogen wrote:
Yep. They can just hold onto Harden and call his bluff. Trade him for a better package at the deadline to a contender thinking he is the final piece. Harden's not going to sit out and lose out on millions because he can't instantly be in Brooklyn. The Rockets have leverage.

Also, you have to look at all the factors in the trade. Harden is 31, is a difficult player to play with , and is now forcing his way out of an organization that has done basically everything to accommodate him. These factors limit the number of teams interested in him.

Then keep him and win 50 games for the next 2 years before you accept that garbage Nets offer imo.

I don't think it's that simple. Harden may sit out and even if he does play he'll just pack it in (seems like the type of guy to do that), and lower his value even further.

buckboy · Post #271 » by **buckboy** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:57 am

giannis and 1 wrote:
buckboy wrote:
giannis and 1 wrote:Also, you have to look at all the factors in the trade. Harden is 31, is a difficult player to play with , and is now forcing his way out of an organization that has done basically everything to accommodate him. These factors limit the number of teams interested in him.

Then keep him and win 50 games for the next 2 years before you accept that garbage Nets offer imo.

I don't think it's that simple. Harden may sit out and even if he does play he'll just pack it in (seems like the type of guy to do that), and lower his value even further.

I doubt it, but maybe. And even if that happens, there will be better offers than the Nets one. That's a bunch of role players and crappy picks.

I have zero faith in Levert ever staying healthy. Dinwiddie is a nice role player as is Allen. Prince is nothing.

No thanks.

WeekapaugGroove · Post #272 » by **WeekapaugGroove** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:03 am

DrWood wrote:
paulpressey25 wrote:I like Phoenix on this one. With Paul, Rubio is redundant. And always viewed Oubre as a volume scorer guy on a bad team. The pick is protected out 4 years.

In the meantime, the Suns should win 45-50 games if they can assemble the rest of the roster well (big if).

I agree with all that, but why trade for CP if your upside is 50 wins? (assuming you mean 50 wins in an 82 game schedule. in a 72 game schedule it would be pretty good).

They haven't made the playoffs in 10 years. Booker is hitting his prime and has played with a load of garbage players and coaches under McDonough who was one of the worst GMs to ever hold the position. He's got 4 years left on his deal and him and Paul are both CAA guys and wanted play together. Keeping your best player and a very powerful agency happy is a good thing. They took Ayton 1 and he's never going to be Luka but he's improved a ton on D and Paul should be great for his development. The ideal scenario is you're competitive for the next two years then paul expires and youd have space to add to what might be an attractive situation in 22. While phoenix isn't LA it's also not minnesota and if they are good they can get guys to want to live there.

Last summer they signed Rubio and people were like why do that it's not like it makes you a contender. But the year before Okobo, Melton, and Cannan running the point was so bad they couldn't run offense and nobody developed. Rubio helped guys like Ayton and Bridges a ton and the suns were not terrible for the first time in years. Not being terrible lead to Chris Paul wanting to play there (his old coach running the show helped too). So now if you can take the step from not terrible to good maybe you can then take another step in a couple years.

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Bucksfan28 · Post #273 » by **Bucksfan28** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:31 am

I dont think Harden sits out but delaying a reset, winning 45-50 games while never contending, and letting him walk for nothing serves no purpose. And the closer you get to trade deadline of his final year, the less leverage you have.

No indication that Michell, Murray, Dame, Booker, Beal, etc. are available and no guarantee they will be. Simmons would definitely be the better route if offered w/ picks.

Post #274 » by **paulpressey25** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:42 am

DrWood wrote:
paulpressey25 wrote:I like Phoenix on this one. With Paul, Rubio is redundant. And always viewed Oubre as a volume scorer guy on a bad team. The pick is protected out 4 years.

In the meantime, the Suns should win 45-50 games if they can assemble the rest of the roster well (nsmnsbig if).

I agree with all that, but why trade for CP if your upside is 50 wins? (assuming you mean 50 wins in an 82 game schedule. in a 72 game schedule it would be pretty good).

Good point on the 50 games. Have to recalibrate on that.

On the Suns, they need some wins. A franchise reset. Walk before you run. Paul does that.

MartyConlonOnTheRun · Post #275 » by **MartyConlonOnTheRun** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:45 am

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/30338853/nba-regular-season-schedule-2020-21-released-2-stages-play-tournament-18-21
Wonder what the olympics look like? It would be crazy but awesome if Giannis went from winning game 6 finals MVP straight to a plane headed to the Olympics.

Wisky4life · Post #276 » by **Wisky4life** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:07 am

Probably unlikely but I want a Harden/Westbrook for Kyrie trade. Lets create some chaos in the league.

Bring back the big 3 to the Oklahoma Nets.

Jez2983 · Post #277 » by **Jez2983** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:18 am

I'll say it again, but Harden has a vendetta against the guy he fits with best in the league, because salt. I really don't know about how I'd feel about Harden and Giannis together, but I certainly know Harden/Kyrie/Durant need 2 balls to be on the court together. I'm sure there's a joke in there somewhere...

Lippo · Post #278 » by **Lippo** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:18 am

Wisky4life wrote:Probably unlikely but I want a Harden/Westbrook for Kyrie trade. Lets create some chaos in the league.

Bring back the big 3 to the Oklahoma Nets.

They can get Green back on the MLE and get Collison out of retirement.

drone3 · Post #279 » by **drone3** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 6:53 am

Ainge is ready to pull the trigger for Harden. It will probably happen, Brown + bunch of FRPs looks good for a Rockets rebuild.

blazza18 · Post #280 » by **blazza18** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:05 am

My bias in wanting to see Simmons in a good situation liked the 3 way Rockets get all the picks, Simmons to GSW and Harden to Philly trade Sam Veceine mentioned on one of the athletic podcasts today.