1/12/2009 Woelfel: Conley deal waiting for Herb (poll added)

[Ill-yasova]

We just need a time machine in order to get this deal the 100% RealGm stamp of approval. Perhaps we can teleport back 18-months to July 2007. Imagine this thread being started on the board.

"Guy's, Woelfel is reporting that the Bucks have traded the guy the Bucks just picked in the secound round (Ramon Sessions) along with our 2008 pick (top-7 protected) for Mike Conley, Jr. AND the Lakers 2010 pick."

I realize there is a massive obvious flaw here of Conley playing 100 games and not doing much, but it you don't like this deal, just pretend it went down 18-months earlier as stated above in italics.

Unfortunately, it doesn't work like that, because we see how good Sessions has become.

How good has Sessions become?

Better than Conley. Whatever that's worth.

[Octopus Jonny]

What if Memphis throws in Darrell Arthur?

(Suggested on dimemag.com)

I'd be much more interested in Sessions/JA for Conley/Arthur.

[BuckFan25226]

We just need a time machine in order to get this deal the 100% RealGm stamp of approval. Perhaps we can teleport back 18-months to July 2007. Imagine this thread being started on the board.

"Guy's, Woelfel is reporting that the Bucks have traded the guy the Bucks just picked in the secound round (Ramon Sessions) along with our 2008 pick (top-7 protected) for Mike Conley, Jr. AND the Lakers 2010 pick."

I realize there is a massive obvious flaw here of Conley playing 100 games and not doing much, but it you don't like this deal, just pretend it went down 18-months earlier as stated above in italics.

Unfortunately, it doesn't work like that, because we see how good Sessions has become.

How good has Sessions become?

+1

I was excited the first 15 games or so when he was putting up 15/6 too. But the fact is, he's sucked since.

[europa]

What if Memphis throws in Darrell Arthur?

(Suggested on dimemag.com)

I'd be much more interested in Sessions/JA for Conley/Arthur.

I posted in the other thread that Sessions/Alexander/Allen for Conley/Arthur worked. I'm not all that big on Arthur, though, so I'm not sure how much difference there would be between Arthur and the Lakers' pick if that's the deal.

[LUKE23]

Rather have Arthur than the Lakers pick. Arthur actually started out the season pretty strong, he fell in the 2008 draft because of injury concerns. I am pretty confident he will be a better player than a guy picked 25+ in 2010.

[WEFFPIM]

Rather have Arthur than the Lakers pick. Arthur actually started out the season pretty strong, he fell in the 2008 draft because of injury concerns. I am pretty confident he will be a better player than a guy picked 25+ in 2010.

And would certainly have more impact than Alexander has right now.

[raferfenix]

Are there any indications that other players could be included or are we just speculating? I'm not sure how credible dime mag is.

[SupremeHustle]

What if Memphis throws in Darrell Arthur?

(Suggested on dimemag.com)

I'd be much more interested in Sessions/JA for Conley/Arthur.

I'd do that.

[Octopus Jonny]

Rather have Arthur than the Lakers pick. Arthur actually started out the season pretty strong, he fell in the 2008 draft because of injury concerns. I am pretty confident he will be a better player than a guy picked 25+ in 2010.

And would certainly have more impact than Alexander has right now.

...and replace CV as our PF so we can trade him for cash!

[Ill-yasova]

+1

I was excited the first 15 games or so when he was putting up 15/6 too. But the fact is, he's sucked since.


Do you mean when he was starting? That might have something to do with it. It seems to me that his play ebbs and flows with his confidence. That said, if you think Sessions sucks, boy are we in for a treat when Conley brings in his monster stats.

[Octopus Jonny]

Are there any indications that other players could be included or are we just speculating? I'm not sure how credible dime mag is.

Should have elaborated. As suggested by poster Jeremy J on this article:

http://dimemag.com/2009/01/nba-trade-ru ... the-bucks/

[WEFFPIM]

Rather have Arthur than the Lakers pick. Arthur actually started out the season pretty strong, he fell in the 2008 draft because of injury concerns. I am pretty confident he will be a better player than a guy picked 25+ in 2010.

And would certainly have more impact than Alexander has right now.

...and replace CV as our PF so we can trade him for cash!

[aboveAverage]

We just need a time machine in order to get this deal the 100% RealGm stamp of approval. Perhaps we can teleport back 18-months to July 2007. Imagine this thread being started on the board.

"Guy's, Woelfel is reporting that the Bucks have traded the guy the Bucks just picked in the secound round (Ramon Sessions) along with our 2008 pick (top-7 protected) for Mike Conley, Jr. AND the Lakers 2010 pick."

I realize there is a massive obvious flaw here of Conley playing 100 games and not doing much, but it you don't like this deal, just pretend it went down 18-months earlier as stated above in italics.

Unfortunately, it doesn't work like that, because we see how good Sessions has become.

How good has Sessions become?

Really? Do you really want to argue this? I swear, your manlove of Conley is out of control. Did he save you from a burning house when your were young or something?

Sessions stats this year:
10.8 ppg, 4.5 asst, 2.8 rebounds in 24 minutes per game. Shooting 44% from the field. When given the ability to play more, we saw how Sessions numbers skyrocketed. He has played poor this last month, but we have seen what he can do when given the chance. Plus he's 6-4, has an ability to get to the hoop at will, and has a good work ethic. His defense is sloppy as of now, but certainly not terrible, and it can get better.

Conley's stats this year:
7.5 ppg, 3.1 asst, 2.9 rebounds in 25 minutes a game. Shooting 41% from the field. And he is 3 inches shorter than Ramon, and can't play over Kyle Lowry mainly because his lack of defense and poor shooting ability.

Yet you think that he is somehow a better passer than Ramon (averages less assists per game), a better defender than Ramon (there's a reason he isn't getting more PT in Memphis), and a better leader (which we can't really tell at this point).

Bottom line is, everything points to Sessions being the better player, plus we are throwing in our top 10 pick this year, and you still think this is a great trade.

[BuckFan25226]

Are there any indications that other players could be included or are we just speculating? I'm not sure how credible dime mag is.

Yup...

We throw in Redd, they give us Mayo and Darko

[unklchuk]

We just need a time machine in order to get this deal the 100% RealGm stamp of approval. Perhaps we can teleport back 18-months to July 2007. Imagine this thread being started on the board.

"Guy's, Woelfel is reporting that the Bucks have traded the guy the Bucks just picked in the secound round (Ramon Sessions) along with our 2008 pick (top-7 protected) for Mike Conley, Jr. AND the Lakers 2010 pick."

I realize there is a massive obvious flaw here of Conley playing 100 games and not doing much, but it you don't like this deal, just pretend it went down 18-months earlier as stated above in italics.

Unfortunately, it doesn't work like that, because we see how good Sessions has become.

How good has Sessions become?

+1: How good has Sessions become?

Definite NBA skills in areas. Definite NBA weaknesses. Nice player but not one whose loss haunts one at night.

But I should tread lightly, and stick to daytime. This thread may attract the MWWDs - the Mo Williams Walking Undead. Not only is Williams a mentor to Sessions, his legions are said to be sworn to common defense.

[WEFFPIM]

+1

I was excited the first 15 games or so when he was putting up 15/6 too. But the fact is, he's sucked since.


Do you mean when he was starting? That might have something to do with it. It seems to me that his play ebbs and flows with his confidence. That said, if you think Sessions sucks, boy are we in for a treat when Conley brings in his monster stats.

No one's saying Conley is any good. We're saying Sessions hasn't been any good as well.

[paulpressey25]

I was excited the first 15 games or so when he was putting up 15/6 too. But the fact is, he's sucked since.

I don't know what to think here, but am starting to come around with your thought that Session's overall game has too many holes for him to be a top-tier/top ten PG which is where we should be aiming with this. He just isn't a dominant ball handler under pressure when playing PG, but that is what you need.

His really good play this year came with him as the SG, where he's got an uncanny ability to get the rack and lay it in. But ultimately I'm not sure you can ever win with a 6-3" SG who doesn't have a killer outside shot (like Andrew Toney did). So at best we come back to maybe a little better version of Mo Williams that will cost us $30mm come July 1st.

[jerrod]

jerrod, consider this possibility:

Hammond thought JA was a *project* to become a better-than-average NBA player. Liked him better than anyone else at 8. Drafted him. Maybe he hasn't changed his mind at all; maybe he now thinks he's not a great fit here (not quite the right mix of mind and heart). He gets a chance to trade for a PG (his "favorite" position) that he really thought at the time of the draft had the makings to run the Bucks team the way he and Skiles want it run. (Which is not just getting the most out of your PG, but getting the most out of the team.)

He asks himself if Conley's inauspicious beginnings with the Grizz mean much. Decides for various reasons, that they don't.

So he trades a player he likes, and a player he kinda likes, for a player he likes *better*.

If he's right, great move. If he's wrong, strike one.

does it rain gummi bears in your world? you couldn't possibly be trying any harder to come up with a way to explain this without admitting that hammond might have made a mistake.

so now, a player that we were told was the future of the team at point guard, and our lottery pick who was pretty much universally believed to be a big time reach at 8, is now gonna net us an amazing franchise quality pg?

i don't think so. i think that hammond bought into the april ramon hype and it's fading quickly, and also thought that joe wasn't as much of a project as he's turning out to be. with all of this fueled by skiles wanting to pick his players. not necessarily an awful situation. of course, if luke is gone when his contract is done, and conley plays like he has so far, we're gonna have a major point guard shortage fairly soon. just my opinion of course

[WEFFPIM]

FYI, jsonline has not reported anything yet.

Stun

[ReasonablySober]

Really? Do you really want to argue this? I swear, your manlove of Conley is out of control. Did he save you from a burning house when your were young or something?

Sessions stats this year:
10.8 ppg, 4.5 asst, 2.8 rebounds in 24 minutes per game. Shooting 44% from the field. When given the ability to play more, we saw how Sessions numbers skyrocketed. He has played poor this last month, but we have seen what he can do when given the chance. Plus he's 6-4, has an ability to get to the hoop at will, and has a good work ethic. His defense is sloppy as of now, but certainly not terrible, and it can get better.

Conley's stats this year:
7.5 ppg, 3.1 asst, 2.9 rebounds in 25 minutes a game. Shooting 41% from the field. And he is 3 inches shorter than Ramon, and can't play over Kyle Lowry mainly because his lack of defense and poor shooting ability.

Yet you think that he is somehow a better passer than Ramon (averages less assists per game), a better defender than Ramon (there's a reason he isn't getting more PT in Memphis), and a better leader (which we can't really tell at this point).

Bottom line is, everything points to Sessions being the better player, plus we are throwing in our top 10 pick this year, and you still think this is a great trade.

No one's saying Conley is any good. We're saying Sessions hasn't been any good as well.