'14 Draft Thread pt 2: vote again? VOTE AGAIN.

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I think Smart wasn't too smart by his actions and it probably cost him a lot in the draft. Who wants to draft such a head case?

I don't understand this. He wasn't viable before the incident. Who wants to draft a guard who can't shoot or run an offense?

Somewhere around 30 NBA teams give or take zero.

Any team or person wanting Marcus Smart is foolish.

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I'd easily give up Henson for Smart. I might even give up Sanders to get Smart if I got Embiid at #1. That would be something of a dream scenario. Smart/Giannis/Embiid core. Middleton to space it.

Smart over a guy, like, LaVine, even?

[breakchains]

I'd easily give up Henson for Smart. I might even give up Sanders to get Smart if I got Embiid at #1. That would be something of a dream scenario. Smart/Giannis/Embiid core. Middleton to space it.

Smart over a guy, like, LaVine, even?

Maybe. I'm not sure yet, but I have been intrigued by LaVine since pretty early. I am concerned about Smart's J but am not ready to dismiss him as a prospect yet. I have been up and down on him as a prospect. Early on I wanted no part of him, then I started really warming up to him, and now I'm basically unsure. We'll see where things stand at the end of the year. There is A LOT to like about his game though, and his J doesn't look broken, so there is hope.

[VooDoo7]

I'd easily give up Henson for Smart. I might even give up Sanders to get Smart if I got Embiid at #1. That would be something of a dream scenario. Smart/Giannis/Embiid core. Middleton to space it.

Smart over a guy, like, LaVine, even?

I take LaVine over Smart, quite easily actually. Wonder if LaVine will declare.

[skones]

I'd take Smart over Lavine easily.

[Baddy Chuck]

I don't understand this. He wasn't viable before the incident. Who wants to draft a guard who can't shoot or run an offense?

Somewhere around 30 NBA teams give or take zero.

Any team or person wanting Marcus Smart is foolish.

Because shooting and being a point guard are the only skills that work in the NBA.

I don't even like Smart, but your agenda against Smart is just as funny/ridiculous or more than even the Wiggins detractor horde.

[PkrsBcksGphsMqt]

If we miss out on Embiid, we can always hope for this guy...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDZaJFd4aSk#t=72[/youtube]

Where the hell did this come from? Wow. Very interesting...

Giannis at PG. Thon at SG. Dynasty.

[flipparsons]

Where does Jabari Brown sit in this draft? I know a lot of people like Clarkson and Brown is older but he has ha a great season. If we could get him with one of our seconds I would be really happy.

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Somewhere around 30 NBA teams give or take zero.

Any team or person wanting Marcus Smart is foolish.

Because shooting and being a point guard are the only skills that work in the NBA.

I don't even like Smart, but your agenda against Smart is just as funny/ridiculous or more than even the Wiggins detractor horde.

The closest things to "stars" in the NBA with his collegiate statistical profile are Redd, Stuckey and Tyreke. If you're happy with either of them in a loaded draft, I don't know what to tell you.

http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/pla ... der_by=pts

You act like shooting as outright terribly as Smart does is just another weakness, like lateral quickness might be for one prospect or "inconsistent" is for another. Smart's shot is an enormous red flag. A disqualifying red flag which puts a severe limit on his ceiling.

EDIT:

Because shooting and being a point guard are the only skills that work in the NBA.

I mean, if you're a combo guard prospect, being a point guard and shooting are kind of necessary.

[Madtown]

Thon is a soph in HS??? Christ on a cross!

[bigkurty]

Sophomore, holy ****!!! This kid is unreal. How does he have that coordination? He is like a genetic anomaly to the nth degree.

[Baddy Chuck]

The closest things to "stars" in the NBA with his collegiate statistical profile are Redd, Stuckey and Tyreke. If you're happy with either of them in a loaded draft, I don't know what to tell you.

No, but I'm also not going to act like any of the other 5+++ picks in this draft have any more ability to be a "star" than Smart does, they mostly all have huge glaring weaknesses in their games. He's a top tier college defender and probably one of the best prospects in recent history at attacking the rim and getting to the line. He's not a point guard, but his vision isn't anything to scoff at as an off guard either. I've said it before, I don't like Smart's ability to be a main piece on a winning team at all, but that doesn't mean he can't be a very effective player in the league and thus be a pretty "good" player. Not being able to shoot hasn't stopped Tyreke and Stuckey or a guy like DeRozan from scoring the ball in the league. You get essentially a guy with better tools (like Smart) and a better work ethic and he could be a better and more efficient version of that guy. Again, might not be a guy who is leading you to a championship, but he could put up some pretty impressive stats, certainly could be worthy of a 5+ pick in this draft.

[cinematographer]

The closest things to "stars" in the NBA with his collegiate statistical profile are Redd, Stuckey and Tyreke. If you're happy with either of them in a loaded draft, I don't know what to tell you.

I've said it before, I don't like Smart's ability to be a main piece on a winning team at all, but that doesn't mean he can't be a very effective player in the league and thus be a pretty "good" player.

That's a pretty low standard for 5+ draft slot.

Not being able to shoot hasn't stopped Tyreke and Stuckey or a guy like DeRozan from scoring the ball in the league.

I mean, DeRozan's a volume guy whose saving grace has been increased defensive intensity and a surprising ability to create off the dribble, and neither of the other two are exactly paragons of efficiency.

You get essentially a guy with better tools (like Smart) and a better work ethic and he could be a better and more efficient version of that guy. Again, might not be a guy who is leading you to a championship, but he could put up some pretty impressive stats, certainly could be worthy of a 5+ pick in this draft.

To borrow from Baseball Prospectus, what do you think Smart's 70th percentile is? Which is to say, what do you think is a realistic expectation of his prime? Do you think his dreadful jumper can be made average? Do you think, at a level where his athleticism won't be elite and where his strength won't be the positive it is now, he can still get to the rim at the rate he does? Against defenses that will sag off him, without fear of his outside shot?

A lot has to break perfectly for Smart.

[Max Green]

Somewhere around 30 NBA teams give or take zero.

Any team or person wanting Marcus Smart is foolish.

Because shooting and being a point guard are the only skills that work in the NBA.

I don't even like Smart, but your agenda against Smart is just as funny/ridiculous or more than even the Wiggins detractor horde.

His agenda against Smart has made his posts about him unreadable at this point. There is more to Smarts game then what Basketball-Reference.com shows. Shooting can be improved upon, one of the guys he quoted who's statistical profile is closely resembles Smart, was one of the best scorers in the league during his prime and became one of the better 3-point shooters as well.

[breakchains]

I appreciate strong opinions. I don't consider it "an agenda." Everyone seems to think strong opinions around here are the result of some "agenda." The guy doesn't like Smart as a prospect and feels strongly about it. He should continue to post about it if he feels that way in the draft thread.

I feel that way about Kyle Anderson. He's a guy I wouldn't touch even with our last second round pick. I will be disgusted if we pass some of these high upside prospects, especially Thanasis, for him.

[breakchains]

Smart's lack of a jumper could truly be a fatal flaw. That is a real issue that can't be glossed over. He isn't a Rondo/Rubio type elite court vision and delivery passer. I'm also not sure he's an elite penetrator, and he's not an elite ball handler. So you start to add these things up and it is scary for projecting him to the next level. I don't think developing a decent J is out of the question though, and if he can, he can be a very valuable player because of a lot of other aspects of his game.

[Baddy Chuck]

That's a pretty low standard for 5+ draft slot.

I mean, DeRozan's a volume guy whose saving grace has been increased defensive intensity and a surprising ability to create off the dribble, and neither of the other two are exactly paragons of efficiency.

To borrow from Baseball Prospectus, what do you think Smart's 70th percentile is? Which is to say, what do you think is a realistic expectation of his prime? Do you think his dreadful jumper can be made average? Do you think, at a level where his athleticism won't be elite and where his strength won't be the positive it is now, he can still get to the rim at the rate he does? Against defenses that will sag off him, without fear of his outside shot?

A lot has to break perfectly for Smart.

A lot really doesn't have to go perfectly to be a good player in the league. A ton has gone wrong for nearly all three of those players compared to him and they're still solid contributors in the NBA. The fact that you can spew some nonsense that no NBA should want him is ludicrous. In 5 years could he prove to be a solid player but not worth a top 10 pick, sure, but the draft could play out where he could just as easily be a top 10 player. A guy like DeRozan isn't a great player, but he looks like a top 10 player in his draft. Hell, a guy like Stuckey could even be considered a top 10-15 player in that draft. Thinking he isn't going to be Allen Iverson isn't a low standard for a 5+ pick in an extremely top heavy draft, it's being realistic. I don't think he has a shot at being a guy who leads you to a championship, but I don't think any of the other 5+ players in the draft do either, just like basically any draft.

As for the "70th percentile" stuff, I wouldn't be surprised if he at the least he was a semi/average efficiency 15-18 PPG type player with around 4-5 assists a game with 5+ free throws a game. That's a solid contributor in the league. Might not be a guy you love, but he has a pretty clear role in the league, certainly not a guy every team in the league would scoff at drafting. That line of thinking is absolutely ridiculous.

I've seen you post stuff like "we could sign him in 4 years to be Tony Allen". Tony Allen with any offensive game, especially an offensive game like Stuckey or Evans, would be a very valuable player to a ton of teams.

[cinematographer]

His agenda against Smart has made his posts about him unreadable at this point. There is more to Smarts game then what Basketball-Reference.com shows. Shooting can be improved upon, one of the guys he quoted who's statistical profile is closely resembles Smart, was one of the best scorers in the league during his prime and became one of the better 3-point shooters as well.

And Redd's case is an outlier. Are we going to be making decisions now based on what one guy out of 80 some comparables did? And, needless to say, Karl didn't play Redd for ages until he learned how to shoot: he knew he wasn't viable as was.

I wholeheartedly agree that there's more to Smart's game. But none of that makes up for his absolute inability to score from a few feet from the basket. If he could run an offense like Wolters, who's also on that list, that'd be one thing. But he can't do that. And, lest we forget, Wolters wasn't ever in consideration to be a top pick.

It's not an agenda. Smart's biggest flaw isn't comparable to, say, questions about Parker's ability to play the three, or Wiggins being able to be a high assist guy. Any traditional lineup with him will have no floor spacing. A stretch four would be a necessity just for some semblance of space for Giannis to operate with. And then there's Smart's "ability" to run an offense.

[Buzzsaw]

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[Badgerlander]

Elfrid Payton is the guy I want at #31.

I'd like to get him and Vasilije Micic in the second round