First Round Playoff Thread

[Badgerlander]

[Newz]

LeBron didn't put his stamp on the game?

What big plays did he make in the fourth quarter with the game on the line? Simple question.

Way to completely avoid what I was saying.

What big plays would anyone on the Heat be able to make in the fourth quarter if he didn't do what he did for the rest of the game?

Wade's 5-5 would have been pretty awesome when it brought them within 15, because he didn't have LeBron to carry him for the rest of the game, hey?

[europa]

Yup. I posted earlier that were it not for Rondo's amazing play, this block by Wade may have gone down as one of the greatest defensive plays in recent playoff history. That was an amazing play by Wade. Rondo just trumped it with something even more amazing.

I won't mention who Rondo tipped the ball way from either. Just doesn't seem fair at this point.

[Newz]

I will say this was one of the more amazing plays I have seen in a while. I thought he was going to get dunked on.

[Nebula1]

I think lebron has a huge game 6 and swings the series back to miami. Bosh should be better. This will be a lebron 'NOWAYWELOSETHISGAME' game.

[europa]

LeBron didn't put his stamp on the game?

What big plays did he make in the fourth quarter with the game on the line? Simple question.

Way to completely avoid what I was saying.

I didn't avoid what you're saying. You're focusing on one segment of the game and I'm focusing on another. If you wish to believe the first three quarters of a close game are more important than the final 12 or so that's cool. I believe the latter is more important. Did LeBron's play "give the Heat a chance to win" (to quote a phrase)? Absolutely. But when the game needed to be won by the Heat, what plays did the MVP make to lift his team to victory? We saw what Pierce did. We saw what KG and Rondo did. We saw what Wade did. What did the MVP do?

Again, simple question.

[jeremyd236]

I can't believe people are still making excuses for this guy. Nobody's questioning his dominance in the first 3 quarters of most games. But the guy simply cannot close. How is this an argument?

[Newz]

I didn't avoid what you're saying. You're focusing on one segment of the game and I'm focusing on another. If you wish to believe the first three quarters of a close game are more important than the final 12 or so that's cool. I believe the latter is more important. Did LeBron's play "give the Heat a chance to win" (to quote a phrase)? Absolutely. But when the game needed to be won by the Heat, what plays did the MVP make to lift his team to victory? We saw what Pierce did. We saw what KG and Rondo did. We saw what Wade did. What did the MVP do?

Again, simple question.

He put up 30/13 while carrying his team for a majority of the game.

Simple answer.

[europa]

I didn't avoid what you're saying. You're focusing on one segment of the game and I'm focusing on another. If you wish to believe the first three quarters of a close game are more important than the final 12 or so that's cool. I believe the latter is more important. Did LeBron's play "give the Heat a chance to win" (to quote a phrase)? Absolutely. But when the game needed to be won by the Heat, what plays did the MVP make to lift his team to victory? We saw what Pierce did. We saw what KG and Rondo did. We saw what Wade did. What did the MVP do?

Again, simple question.

He put up 30/13 while carrying his team for a majority of the game.

Simple answer.

He put up 30/13 in the fourth quarter? I must've missed that. I'll need to re-watch the game. That's an amazing quarter.

[Newz]

I didn't avoid what you're saying. You're focusing on one segment of the game and I'm focusing on another. If you wish to believe the first three quarters of a close game are more important than the final 12 or so that's cool. I believe the latter is more important. Did LeBron's play "give the Heat a chance to win" (to quote a phrase)? Absolutely. But when the game needed to be won by the Heat, what plays did the MVP make to lift his team to victory? We saw what Pierce did. We saw what KG and Rondo did. We saw what Wade did. What did the MVP do?

Again, simple question.

He put up 30/13 while carrying his team for a majority of the game.

Simple answer.

He put up 30/13 in the fourth quarter? I must've missed that. I'll need to re-watch the game. That's an amazing quarter.

You said when the game needed to be won. I didn't realize a game was 12 minutes long.

He did a lot more to help his team win than Wade did, that's for damn sure.

[Badgerlander]

Rondo just trumped it with something even more amazing.

you mean this?

[europa]

I asked what he did in the fourth quarter with the game and possibly the series on the line. I saw what Wade did. I'm just asking what the MVP did.

[Wooderson]

And perhaps they win those games and others if LeBron had been more assertive when the game was on the line. We can play this game all day long. As I posted earlier, when the Heat win it's because of how great LeBron is. When they lose, it's because the talent around him didn't get it done.

I agree that LeBron needs to be more assertive. He definitely settled for way too many jumpers in the 2nd half last night.

However, just as Wade's lower production has been somewhat justified by the fact that they are going against such a strong defense, LeBron's lack of assertiveness needs to be taken into context. No one on the Heat can be relied upon to hit an open shot - and Boston knows this. They can just pack the paint and force the Heat into long jumpers. Add in the fact that their best mid-range shooter in Bosh has been out, and the Heat's struggles down the stretch isn't much of a surprise.

[europa]

Rondo just trumped it with something even more amazing.

you mean this?

That's outstanding.

[Newz]

This is amazing.

[jr lucosa]

Rondo just trumped it with something even more amazing.

you mean this?

Awesome

[europa]

And perhaps they win those games and others if LeBron had been more assertive when the game was on the line. We can play this game all day long. As I posted earlier, when the Heat win it's because of how great LeBron is. When they lose, it's because the talent around him didn't get it done.

I agree that LeBron needs to be more assertive. He definitely settled for way too many jumpers in the 2nd half last night.

However, just as Wade's lower production has been somewhat justified by the fact that they are going against such a strong defense, LeBron's lack of assertiveness needs to be taken into context. No one on the Heat can be relied upon to hit an open shot - and Boston knows this. They can just pack the paint and force the Heat into long jumpers. Add in the fact that their best mid-range shooter in Bosh has been out, and the Heat's struggles down the stretch isn't much of a surprise.

I agree the Celtics defense is terrific. But we've seen this story from LeBron against a lot of other teams in the playoffs. So this isn't a surprise that it's happening again. I do think the Celtics know how to get in LeBron's head and take away some of his aggressiveness. That happened a few years ago when he was with Cleveland although he seemed to fight through it last season. But it appears to be happening again.

[Badgerlander]

I meant this

[Newz]

I asked what he did in the fourth quarter with the game and possibly the series on the line. I saw what Wade did. I'm just asking what the MVP did.

I don't think you understand my stance on LeBron and I don't think you've read what I've said in this thread:

* LeBron needs to look to dominate more down the stretch in games. He's capable of doing it, he's done it before. He's even made huge, clutch plays in this series. He's had one of the most impressive and clutch performances in playoff history, as a matter a fact. But he doesn't do it as often as he could.
* LeBron had a bigger impact on the game last night than Wade. Without LeBron, they get blown out of the building. Without Wade, they are still right in it at the end of the game.
* I think people need to look at what is happening and understand it without just saying "He isn't producing!". LeBron's second best player isn't producing at a high level (Wade), the other guy is hurt (Bosh) and their cast cannot make wide open jumpers to space the floor.
* In addition, Miami is looking for LeBron to carry them the first three quarters... then carry them in the fourth was well. No other player has this burden. Not Kobe, not Durant, not anyone on the Celtics, not Wade. LeBron can't take time off, he can't stop dominating the entire game or they lose.
* People have gone insane when it comes to LeBron. Wade is playing well below the norm and people are now RUNNING TO DEFEND HIM just because they think it makes the case against LeBron stronger. It's obvious and it's obnoxious.

Like I've said countless times, LeBron is not without his faults. But the arguments against him are severely flawed and he's the last person anyone should point the finger at for the Heat not winning this series. He's produced like the MVP, he's kept his team in the game, he's putting up historic numbers... yet the guy everyone defends is playing well below his career playoff norms, because he hit some shots in the 4th quarter.

If any other guy was doing what LeBron was doing, it would be considered amazing. LeBron does it and people just see him producing like LeBron James and take it for granted. It's bizarre to me.

[jerrod]

realistically though, that masseuse died at bosh's house and lebron didn't even resurrect her.

what a bitch