First Round Playoff Thread

[turbo2k]

This was about as clutch of a performance as has ever been delivered in the mordern NBA. Not too many teams in history have been under more pressure than Miami were coming in to this game and unlike virtually all of his teammates Lebron stood up.

Like I said I'm no fanboy of his, but he deserves major props out of tonight. This was Jordan like, and I hold Jordan to a god-like level when it comes to basketball.

Even the haterzzz have to give it up to him tonight. This is what everyone's wanted all along. That 'I'm gonna do it myself' attitude when it gets down to the nitty gritty.

I don't think there's any doubt James has gotten himself into trouble over the journey by trying to be too good of a teammate and share too much.

Something Jordan and Bryant in particular never had to worry about.

People have to realize though, that if you are in fact the best in the world (as LeBron clearly is, and Jordan/Kobe clearly were at their peaks) you need to know it, and know that no one can do it like you so the ball SHOULD be in your hands because no one can do it like you do. You SHOULD be a super cocky mofo who don't give an eff if you're open, because even if I'm double teamed, I'm better than you wide open.

[InsideOut]

James vanished again in the last 3 minutes of this big game...figures.

[REDDzone]

LeBron is ridic.

[LUKE23]

Doc is really a great coach.

[jeremyd236]

Lebron with a dominating performance, and Boston just didn't show up. At least not the Old Three.

[Ayt]

Even the haterzzz have to give it up to him tonight. This is what everyone's wanted all along. That 'I'm gonna do it myself' attitude when it gets down to the nitty gritty.

I don't think there's any doubt James has gotten himself into trouble over the journey by trying to be too good of a teammate and share too much.

Something Jordan and Bryant in particular never had to worry about.

People have to realize though, that if you are in fact the best in the world (as LeBron clearly is, and Jordan/Kobe clearly were at their peaks) you need to know it, and know that no one can do it like you so the ball SHOULD be in your hands because no one can do it like you do. You SHOULD be a super cocky mofo who don't give an eff if you're open, because even if I'm double teamed, I'm better than you wide open.

Magic didn't play like that. Sure, he hit some huge shots during his career, but he also set his teammates up for huge shots. He just happened to play with role players who would nail them.

LeBron is much more like Magic than he is Jordan or, especially, Kobe. Even Jordan had memorable passes for huge shots in huge games. How many huge shots have Manu or Parker made for Duncan?

I like this play in particular for Jordan. He gives up the ball before even getting beyond halfcourt down 2 in game six in the Finals, and he was the only Bull who had scored up to that point in the 4th quarter! They had scored only 9 in the 4th (an NBA record for fewest in a 4th quarter in the FInals), and he had scored all of them. I can't imagine Kobe even considering passing the ball in this situation.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnAr4I3-Z48[/youtube]

[coolhandluke121]

I don't think there's any doubt James has gotten himself into trouble over the journey by trying to be too good of a teammate and share too much.

Something Jordan and Bryant in particular never had to worry about.

Yep. Impressionable people who spew all this narcissistic b.s. about being "the man" or "the alpha male" basically haven't moved past chimp psychology into modern manhood. There's plenty of objective evidence that the way guys like Lebron play is superior to the agenda that Kobe and MJ pursued (except when Phil was able to coach them out of it), but chimps don't value solid evidence over subjective impressions so there's no point to bringing that up.

By any reasonable criteria Lebron is far superior to Durant, but I don't care - Durant has the "it" factor!!11!!1!!1

[EastSideBucksFan]

I don't think there's any doubt James has gotten himself into trouble over the journey by trying to be too good of a teammate and share too much.

Something Jordan and Bryant in particular never had to worry about.

Yep. Impressionable people who spew all this narcissistic b.s. about being "the man" or "the alpha male" basically haven't moved past chimp psychology into modern manhood. There's plenty of objective evidence that the way guys like Lebron play is superior to the agenda that Kobe and MJ pursued (except when Phil was able to coach them out of it), but chimps don't value solid evidence over subjective impressions so there's no point to bringing that up.

By any reasonable criteria Lebron is far superior to Durant, but I don't care - Durant has the "it" factor!!11!!1!!1

MJ 6 rings
Kobe 5 rings
Lebron 0 rings.

That's all the evidence I need.

[coolhandluke121]

I don't think there's any doubt James has gotten himself into trouble over the journey by trying to be too good of a teammate and share too much.

Something Jordan and Bryant in particular never had to worry about.

Yep. Impressionable people who spew all this narcissistic b.s. about being "the man" or "the alpha male" basically haven't moved past chimp psychology into modern manhood. There's plenty of objective evidence that the way guys like Lebron play is superior to the agenda that Kobe and MJ pursued (except when Phil was able to coach them out of it), but chimps don't value solid evidence over subjective impressions so there's no point to bringing that up.

By any reasonable criteria Lebron is far superior to Durant, but I don't care - Durant has the "it" factor!!11!!1!!1

MJ 6 rings
Kobe 5 rings
Lebron 0 rings.

That's all the evidence I need.

You should change your username to Exhibit A.

[europa]

Magnificent game from LeBron. I was surprised the Celtics came out so flat in a close out game at home. I can't see them recovering from it in Game 7. It looks like the Heat's series to lose now.

Oh, can we please stop comparing Jordan and LeBron. Please? I'm begging you. Please. Just. Stop.

[emunney]

I don't think there's any doubt James has gotten himself into trouble over the journey by trying to be too good of a teammate and share too much.

Something Jordan and Bryant in particular never had to worry about.

Yep. Impressionable people who spew all this narcissistic b.s. about being "the man" or "the alpha male" basically haven't moved past chimp psychology into modern manhood. There's plenty of objective evidence that the way guys like Lebron play is superior to the agenda that Kobe and MJ pursued (except when Phil was able to coach them out of it), but chimps don't value solid evidence over subjective impressions so there's no point to bringing that up.

By any reasonable criteria Lebron is far superior to Durant, but I don't care - Durant has the "it" factor!!11!!1!!1

MJ 6 rings
Kobe 5 rings
Lebron 0 rings.

That's all the evidence I need.

So LeBron is tied for worst player in NBA history.

[europa]

Another great column from Woj:

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--lebro ... UlEmK8vLYF

[coolhandluke121]

Oh, can we please stop comparing Jordan and LeBron. Please? I'm begging you. Please. Just. Stop.

I'm not comparing them in the usual sense. Not saying which one is better or anything like that. That's not informative at all. But it is useful and informative to compare the way they approached the game. The well-documented fact is that MJ and Kobe routinely had to be coached to play team basketball, and it was a constant struggle with coaches and a recurring impediment to their success. You could argue that with all their talent and great teammates, they should have more titles than they do. I hate to put MJ in that category because he was a great leader and teammate in the 90's, but the fact is that he had to go through a long process of personal growth as a teammate in order to achieve that. They could have easily started winning titles sooner with their talent.

By contrast, guys like Duncan, Magic, Bird, Nash, and Lebron were innate team players. The improvement they brought to their teams was much more than what their individual talent would have suggested - at least in the sense that the public does not recognize making teammates better, whether you get credit for it or not, as individual talent.

Bottom line:
Lebron/Nash/Magic/Duncan/Bird get less credit than they deserve.
Kobe and MJ get more.

[europa]

Jordan's deserving of all the credit he receives. He's the GOAT in my opinion. There was nothing Michael Jordan couldn't and wouldn't do on a basketball court. Fundamentally sound. High-impact player on both ends of the court. A will to win that few others have ever been able to emulate. I don't deny the process he had to go through to ultimately become a champion but once he went through it and the light bulb went on he dominated the game like few others before or since have been able to do.

Honestly, it's not fair to guys like LeBron or Kobe to compare them to Jordan. They fail to stack up and in many ways it isn't even close. They simply are not in Jordan's class.

[Newz]

MJ 6 rings
Kobe 5 rings
Lebron 0 rings.

Scottie Pippen with Jordan - 6 Rings
Rodman with Jordan - 3 Rings
Prime Shaq with Kobe - 3 Rings
Gasol/Bynum/Odom with Kobe - 2 Rings

LeBron years played with Varaejo or Mo Williams as the second best player on his team? 7 out of 9.

This is really the most pathetic argument in the history of pro sports. The 'rings' argument.

[Newz]

Honestly, it's not fair to guys like LeBron or Kobe to compare them to Jordan. They fail to stack up and in many ways it isn't even close. They simply are not in Jordan's class.

I think LeBron stacks up to Jordan in many ways and he falls short in some. LeBron isn't quite as good as Jordan most likely.

Kobe doesn't stack up to either of those guys in any way.

[coolhandluke121]

Jordan's deserving of all the credit he receives. He's the GOAT in my opinion. There was nothing Michael Jordan couldn't and wouldn't do on a basketball court. Fundamentally sound. High-impact player on both ends of the court. A will to win that few others have ever been able to emulate. I don't deny the process he had to go through to ultimately become a champion but once he went through it and the light bulb went on he dominated the game like few others before or since have been able to do.

Honestly, it's not fair to guys like LeBron or Kobe to compare them to Jordan. They fail to stack up and in many ways it isn't even close. They simply are not in Jordan's class.

I'm not concerned with how talented MJ was or how talented Lebron is. I just find it stupid that people say Lebron should play more like Kobe or MJ. I understand that he doesn't have the same ability as MJ. That's a fair criticism. But to criticize him for not having the selfish streak those two had is idiotic, especially considering the fact that those two had to overcome their own selfishness to achieve the very success that people cite when they hate on Lebron.

[europa]

Last night when LeBron essentially played "selfishly" the Heat won in commanding fashion.

Coincidence?

Note that I put "selfishly" in quotes because I don't believe he was selfish. I think he played the way he had to play, with a single-minded determination to win that game for his team.

[Newz]

Last night when LeBron essentially played "selfishly" the Heat won in commanding fashion.

Coincidence?

I didn't see him playing selfish at all. He took about as many shots as he normally does... he just made a lot more of them than he normally does. Yes, when LeBron makes like 70-80% of his shots and grabs 15 boards while dishing out 5 dimes... it's going to be almost impossible for the opposing team to win.

Is that what you expect out of him every game?

[europa]

I didn't see him playing selfish at all.

Neither did I and I said that.

Is that what you expect out of him every game?

In a big playoff game with the season on the line, that's absolutely the mindset I think he needs to have.