Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions

[Ron Swanson]

Bobby's been the obvious guy to deal since the Dame trade happened and we've all but exhausted all the discussion around it. At this point it's on Horst to finally pull the trigger, but one idea that I'll keep bringing up is he's maybe the one candidate on this roster that you don't necessarily have to get an immediate win-now asset back. Yes, he's a great regular season player still a cheap contract relative to his production. But those are precisely the reasons why you cash out now, not cling to his box score production until he becomes an old and overpaid, and even more of a situational playoff guy. Kings SI writer posited this trade back in October. Something worth discussing:

https://www.si.com/nba/kings/sacramento-kings-news/kings-swap-talented-rookie-bucks-big-man-mock-trade

Portis is set to make around $12.5 million this season with a player option of $13.4 million for next year. That $12.5 million fits like a glove in the Kings' $12.8 million MLE.

The Kings could send Devin Carter, the 13th overall pick in the 2024 NBA Draft, to make the money work and draft picks as needed to make the deal worth it for the Bucks.

It would be a huge gamble as Sacramento would lose a young promising player in Carter and lose flexibility around the luxury cap, but Portis is the exact type of player the Kings have been searching for for years.

I'd do that in an instant. I can't believe the Kings would.

Relatedly, I'd have zero interest in Murray. I've never seen it with him. Someone referred to him as poor man's Tobias Harris. That seems about right to me. And that's not a good player.

Murray's a way better defender than he's given credit for. You guys haven't been paying attention to him. I'd bank on the shooting sorting itself out. It's all speculation but if the Kings are ripe for a panic trade, they're the team for us to deal with.

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[raferfenix]

Otherwise I'm not giving Bobby away. He brings a ton of intangibles to this team, including being a great regular season player.

I'm not giving Bobby away either.

But I've grown increasingly convinced we need a more athletic and defensive minded backup big man -- even aside from a longer term Brook replacement.

That and I'm increasingly doubtful we will make a competitive offer to keep him here when he can opt out this summer.

[Prez]

Strongly disagree with the idea that Bobby's been a great regular season player, I think he's actually been one of the more destructive 20+ mpg guys in the league this season.

If you can get any halfway decent defensive big off the bench in a Bobby trade, you have to pounce on it. He's abominable on that end and there's too much riding on this season to let one dude off the bench tank you on that end every night. Offensively his style makes no sense on this team; terribly inefficient post ups is one of the main things dragging this offense down from being truly elite and he's one of the biggest culprits...like there is no **** reason why he should be 2nd in the entire league in post up frequency, especially at 34th percentile efficiency. He's got the worst net rating on the entire team and you feel that game to game.

If you can get someone who can move their feet, be even a mild deterrent at the rim, and just stays the hell out of the way offensively, pull the trigger.

[Bernman]

Greg Monroe was another guy I was a fan of & vouch for early in his Bucks' tenure. That was backed up by net rating/on-off, just like it was for Bobby, who I was a supporter of too. But their games just aged so poorly, for similar reasons. They were both merely adequate athletes for big skill guys who hustled. Then they hit their late 20's, & had moderate injuries, to lose a little athleticism, so they bottomed out. They also didn't evolve to shoot enough 3's effectively. Wanted to hang out in mid-range too much.

We didn't stay in the Greg Monroe business for way too long. Ultimately he was traded at the start of his 3rd season &, along w/ a pick, netted Eric Bledsoe who was a borderline all-star for us in regular seasons, before disastrous postseasons (similar to Jrue only cost a lot less). In Bobby's case we're in yr 5, when he started to struggle in the middle of yr 3. After that season was the time to get out of that business. A team reportedly offered us a lotto pick. Now we just have to take anything useful.

[raferfenix]

Sam Amick:

Here are the before and after splits…

Through Nov. 11 (2-8 record): 22nd in net rating, 22nd in defensive rating, 20th in offensive rating.
Since Nov. 12 (9-2): Eighth in net rating, sixth in offensive rating, eighth in defensive rating.

More importantly, Antetokounmpo and Lillard are playing an elite brand of basketball that even inspired the “Greek Freak” to deem their chemistry “incredible” recently. Just look at the production from their (finally) dynamic duo during this stretch, and you start to realize that the only logical conclusion — for now, at least — is to give this group more time. Besides, as we’ve discussed before, the prohibitive nature of their strained salary cap situation means there isn’t any sort of “Plan B” available that makes any sense.

Giannis (in 10 games): 33.5 points (62.4 percent overall on 20.2 shots per), 10.6 rebounds, 7.9 assists, 1.7 blocks.

Lillard (in eight games): 25.9 points (46.1 percent overall on 17.6 shots per; 41.3 percent from three-point range on 9.4 attempts per), 8.6 assists, 4.3 rebounds.

If the Bucks keep winning games with Antetokounmpo putting up these sorts of gaudy numbers, then the prospect of him wrestling the MVP award back from Denver’s Nikola Jokić is not outside the realm of possibility. The 34-year-old Lillard, meanwhile, is making a strong case to be on his ninth All-Star team.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5971428/2024/12/05/nba-bucks-knicks-magic-no-panic/?source=emp_shared_article

[ReasonablySober]

[buckboy]

I have no idea how they do that stuff. Pretty good.

[paulpressey25]

Greg Monroe was another guy I was a fan of & vouch for early in his Bucks' tenure. That was backed up by net rating/on-off, just like it was for Bobby, .

I'll save Big O the post. Comparing Bobby to Monroe is just heresy. Bobby is far more mobile, active and can spread the floor.

Monroe was an oak tree that couldn't move, couldn't jump and would regularly miss bunny putbacks. There is a reason he went out of the league so fast. Bobby will be playing at least another five seasons after this one.

[Bernman]

Greg Monroe was another guy I was a fan of & vouch for early in his Bucks' tenure. That was backed up by net rating/on-off, just like it was for Bobby, .

I'll save Big O the post. Comparing Bobby to Monroe is just heresy. Bobby is far more mobile, active and can spread the floor.

Monroe was an oak tree that couldn't move, couldn't jump and would regularly miss bunny putbacks. There is a reason he went out of the league so fast. Bobby will be playing at least another five seasons after this one.

Monroe had a +7 on/off both real seasons w/ the Bucks. Portis has been negative in 4 of 5 seasons.

The last real season Monroe had w/ the Bucks the team was +3.6 w/ him on the court. That's FAR better than Bobby the last 3 seasons, when they were even, & this season way below. This is on a better (contending) team.

I was more than fair to this shell version of Bobby. The former variety was better than Monroe was here, the current much worse. He's an unplayable saboteur who can't be traded soon enough. That's up to him if he has a better post Bucks career than Greg.

[TroyD92]

Bobby has been the most overrated Buck for a long time. I think he was sneaking under the radar because of Middleton/Jrue/Brook struggling with different issues (health, playoff performances, getting abused in certain matchups).

[Fotis St]

I am rolling with T.Prince, AJ Green, GTJ and hoping for Ajax hitting his corner 3s ... ship Khris, Pat C and Brook for some athleticism
It is time to deBud this slow @$s team
Keep Bobby , he is a double double machine on cheap salary.
You Bobby haters pretending he was not a huge part of our Championship run ... and Mr Glass is somehow our savior ... wake up.
Khris already efs up our chemistry , his return will break all the connections currently formed ... get him out of my team

[ShootingtheJ]

I am rolling with T.Prince, AJ Green, GTJ and hoping for Ajax hitting his corner 3s ... ship Khris, Pat C and Brook for some athleticism
It is time to deBud this slow @$s team
Keep Bobby , he is a double double machine on cheap salary.
You Bobby haters pretending he was not a huge part of our Championship run ... and Mr Glass is somehow our savior ... wake up.
Khris already efs up our chemistry , his return will break all the connections currently formed ... get him out of my team

Lol, the guy with the best chemistry with Giannis ever is going to break our chemistry?

I'll play along. Do you think we can really cash in on him? Can we get a guy that can average 24.7 points, 9.2 rebounds, and 4.7 assists in a playoff series for him?

[ShootingtheJ]

Bobby's been the obvious guy to deal since the Dame trade happened and we've all but exhausted all the discussion around it. At this point it's on Horst to finally pull the trigger, but one idea that I'll keep bringing up is he's maybe the one candidate on this roster that you don't necessarily have to get an immediate win-now asset back. Yes, he's a great regular season player still a cheap contract relative to his production. But those are precisely the reasons why you cash out now, not cling to his box score production until he becomes an old and overpaid, and even more of a situational playoff guy. Kings SI writer posited this trade back in October. Something worth discussing:

https://www.si.com/nba/kings/sacramento-kings-news/kings-swap-talented-rookie-bucks-big-man-mock-trade

Portis is set to make around $12.5 million this season with a player option of $13.4 million for next year. That $12.5 million fits like a glove in the Kings' $12.8 million MLE.

The Kings could send Devin Carter, the 13th overall pick in the 2024 NBA Draft, to make the money work and draft picks as needed to make the deal worth it for the Bucks.

It would be a huge gamble as Sacramento would lose a young promising player in Carter and lose flexibility around the luxury cap, but Portis is the exact type of player the Kings have been searching for for years.

I'd do that in an instant. I can't believe the Kings would.

Relatedly, I'd have zero interest in Murray. I've never seen it with him. Someone referred to him as poor man's Tobias Harris. That seems about right to me. And that's not a good player.

I agree, I don't believe in Murray's offense.

Carter and draft compensation is really interesting though. I think Carter would be the perfect pairing with Cade Cunningham. Jaden Ivey overlaps with Cunningham too much.

I wonder if Detroit would do Carter, draft compensation from Sacramento, and our 2031 1st, along with Patty C, for Ivey and Paul Reed? Ivey has taken a major step forward this year on both ends of the court, and is still just 22.

Could we get Detroit to throw a 2nd back, so we could deal Marjon and 2- 2nds for Dalano Banton?

[jakecronus8]

Bobby has become the fall guy for every problem the team has had the last few years. He’s a quality player and I’m a fan of the intangibles.

That said, if they insist on depending on Middleton (which I think is futile) they kinda have to trade Bobby. Midd should be the instant offense off the bench guy playing mostly at the 4.

[TroyD92]

Bobby has become the fall guy for every problem the team has had the last few years. He’s a quality player and I’m a fan of the intangibles.

That said, if they insist on depending on Middleton (which I think is futile) they kinda have to trade Bobby. Midd should be the instant offense off the bench guy playing mostly at the 4.

It's the opposite he hasn't gotten nearly the blame he's deserved until recently.

[ShootingtheJ]

Bobby has become the fall guy for every problem the team has had the last few years. He’s a quality player and I’m a fan of the intangibles.

That said, if they insist on depending on Middleton (which I think is futile) they kinda have to trade Bobby. Midd should be the instant offense off the bench guy playing mostly at the 4.

It's the opposite he hasn't gotten nearly the blame he's deserved until recently.

So when Bobby averaged 19 points and 13 rebounds with a team best plus/ minus in the playoffs, did he get any credit for his contributions?

I agree that Bobby should be dealt because he doesn't pair well with neither Brook nor Giannis, but pretending like he's a bad player is just inaccurate.

Ever notice how his terrible on/off numbers disappear when he starts? Or notice how his on/off numbers suddenly became more normal when Pat got benched?

[blazza18]

Or notice how his on/off numbers suddenly became more normal when Pat got benched?

Hmmm https://www.pbpstats.com/wowy-combos/nba?TeamId=1610612749&Season=2024-25&SeasonType=Regular%2BSeason&PlayerIds=1626171,1626192

[fansinceforever]

I have no idea how they do that stuff. Pretty good.

It's gotta be staged. There's no other way.

[AussieBuck]

Greg Monroe was another guy I was a fan of & vouch for early in his Bucks' tenure. That was backed up by net rating/on-off, just like it was for Bobby, .

I'll save Big O the post. Comparing Bobby to Monroe is just heresy. Bobby is far more mobile, active and can spread the floor.

Monroe was an oak tree that couldn't move, couldn't jump and would regularly miss bunny putbacks. There is a reason he went out of the league so fast. Bobby will be playing at least another five seasons after this one.

Bobby at this point is Gooden plus a three ball, minus passing ability. Too slow laterally to guard non-plodders but also a terrible defensive C. Before he messed with form and looked like being a regular three point sniper, it was fine because that's generally what you get from a stretch 4, but he's not that anymore and his iso game is poison on a team where the main guys are also iso guys.

Current day Bobby is just not a good player and he's now a terrible fit which multiplies the downside.

[Bernman]

Or notice how his on/off numbers suddenly became more normal when Pat got benched?

Hmmm https://www.pbpstats.com/wowy-combos/nba?TeamId=1610612749&Season=2024-25&SeasonType=Regular%2BSeason&PlayerIds=1626171,1626192

Haha, it was the exact opposite if anything. But some never let facts get in the way of a good story.

It's more like Pat has gotten scapegoated bcuz he's been a neutral on/off guy 2 of the last 3 yrs, including this one. We turned things around when he was playing. And yet many act like benching him was the main difference.

Pat actually has some humility to play within himself and i.q. to do the little things. Bobby's ego makes him call for the ball more when things are going wrong & not just do the fundamentals like boxing out.