The Official Playoffs Thread

[midranger]

"Gigantic downgrade at SG?"

Perhaps I missed Redd's play down the stretch this season, but I think Salmons would have helped a bit more.

[europa]

There's nothing about Jamaal Crawford that's better than Redd other than the fact he makes less money.

And the main reason why he makes less money is because he isn't as good. He's not as good as any of the guys you just listed.

[europa]

"Gigantic downgrade at SG?"

Perhaps I missed Redd's play down the stretch this season, but I think Salmons would have helped a bit more.

Was he coming to the Bucks in the trade Press proposed? I thought he was talking about Brad Miller coming to the Bucks.

[midranger]

Salmons averaged 2 less points, more rebounds, more assists, shot better from every spot on the floor and plays better defense than Redd.

Forget the salary: Salmons > Redd straight up.

[midranger]

"Gigantic downgrade at SG?"

Perhaps I missed Redd's play down the stretch this season, but I think Salmons would have helped a bit more.

Was he coming to the Bucks in the trade Press proposed? I thought he was talking about Brad Miller coming to the Bucks.

I believe so.

[Newz]

Who do you guys think is a worse player than Redd?

You honestly talk about him like he is the worst player at his position in the entire league.

I remember a thread a few years back where people were trying to claim Jason Kapono could add the same things to our team that Redd did. Talking about Redd with 90% of this board is pointless, because they are just totally unrealistic when it comes to him.

That being said I would have moved Redd for Salmons/Miller, but it doesn't have anything at all to do with Salmons being as good as Redd... I think adding depth with Brad Miller to come in over the garbage like Gadzuric/Elson that we have now would have been huge.

[paulpressey25]

[Looking at the tax - you've reduced the length of a big contract by substituting Miller for Redd but you're only saving $2M. .

Two thoughts.

a) I never thought Sacramento would throw in Salmons on a Miller trade like they did with the Bulls. If they did that with us, we've replaced Redd.

b) Let's say that wasn't an option and we traded Redd for Miller (with Raef going to Sacramento)

For next year we've got Brad Miller at $12 million. Redd's contract is $17mm. We've now saved $5mm in cap room. Plus we've got a legit guy to play backup center and/or PF with Bogut. If Elson opts out, we pick up another $1.7mm and still have a backup center.

I thought we could make do for now with Bell/Sessions/LRMAM at SG, but that what was absolutely killing us was the lack of size and rebounding with Bogut out. I think if we made that deal we have a shot at 40-42 season and the 8th seed.

And we are better off for next season. The following year Miller's contract expires, so we don't face the gun again on the luxury tax in the summer of 2010.

[europa]

"Gigantic downgrade at SG?"

Perhaps I missed Redd's play down the stretch this season, but I think Salmons would have helped a bit more.

Was he coming to the Bucks in the trade Press proposed? I thought he was talking about Brad Miller coming to the Bucks.

I believe so.

Ahh ok. Sorry about that then. I thought he was talking about a 3-team trade where the Kings got Raef/Wally, the Blazers/Cavs got Redd and the Bucks got Miller. I didn't see Salmons included.

[midranger]

Jamal Crawful is certain a worse player than Redd.

I do take offense to the "top-10 at his position" or "top-40 in the NBA" talk.

Redd is on a tier with about 15 other guys who are all about the same. Redd just makes the most of any of them. By far.

[europa]

I remember a thread a few years back where people were trying to claim Jason Kapono could add the same things to our team that Redd did. Talking about Redd with 90% of this board is pointless, because they are just totally unrealistic when it comes to him.

My favorite this season was the post which said Anthony Parker would be an upgrade because he shot a good percentage from 3-point range.

Sometimes I wonder if people post that type of stuff honestly or just to get a rise out of people.

[paulpressey25]

[Ahh ok. Sorry about that then. I thought he was talking about a 3-team trade where the Kings got Raef/Wally, the Blazers/Cavs got Redd and the Bucks got Miller. I didn't see Salmons included.

No, you were partially right. I would have done either variation on that deal.

But that was the type of deal we needed to go for sometime in December or the first week of January, so we'd have had Miller for a long enough period to make an impact.

[Newz]

I remember a thread a few years back where people were trying to claim Jason Kapono could add the same things to our team that Redd did. Talking about Redd with 90% of this board is pointless, because they are just totally unrealistic when it comes to him.

My favorite this season was the post which said Anthony Parker would be an upgrade because he shot a good percentage from 3-point range.

Sometimes I wonder if people post that type of stuff honestly or just to get a rise out of people.

I think it is just to get a rise out of people... Because if they are being serious, they just make themselves look like complete fools.

You can argue salary stuff all you want, because I don't think anyone would disagree that Redd is overpaid... But people act like any player could just come in and be as good as Redd. Redd is a 10 million a year guy making 17 because he is moving towards the end of a huge contract. We overpaid him, obviously... But that is no reason to say he is a terrible player and guys like Anthony Parker and John Salmons are better than him. Those guys are both solid, but they aren't what Redd is.

[europa]

My apologies Press. I looked at the wrong number for Redd's contract for next season. You're right, the Bucks would've saved $5M with Miller, not $2M. I looked at RJ's salary and not Redd's.

I still believe that a Miller trade does nothing to help the Bucks "win now" since the drop-off at SG would, in my opinion, not be offset by the upgrade at C with Miller. But the tax savings would've been much better.

[europa]

You can argue salary stuff all you want, because I don't think anyone would disagree that Redd is overpaid... But people act like player could just come in and be as good as Redd.

I think the second half of this season showed us quite clearly how difficult it can be to do what Redd can do as a scorer. RJ couldn't do it consistently and neither could Villanueva. I agree with what George Karl has always said - when you have a guy who can score 20+ per game year in and year out you have something of value because that isn't an easy thing to do.

That said, Redd is overpaid and I'm all for trading him in the right deal. And if the Bucks struggle out of the gate next season I think Hammond will look to deal him (and RJ). He's already said that will occur.

[Newz]

My apologies Press. I looked at the wrong number for Redd's contract for next season. You're right, the Bucks would've saved $5M with Miller, not $2M. I looked at RJ's salary and not Redd's.

I still believe that a Miller trade does nothing to help the Bucks "win now" since the drop-off at SG would, in my opinion, not be offset by the upgrade at C with Miller. But the tax savings would've been much better.

I respectfully disagree. I think that Miller is such a massive upgrade over our back-up big men that it would offset the drop off from Redd to Salmons.

I just really think our back-up big man situation is probably the weakest spot on this team by far, those guys are just terrible.

[paulpressey25]

Jamal Crawful is certain a worse player than Redd.

Did you guys see Crawful's game-log?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/g ... ayerId=165

There were a number of nights where he got hot a heck and shot the Warriors a victory. Where are the "crunchtime" stats? I'm guessing Crawford is near the top.

I'm not sure what Crawford did this year is so much different than what Redd does for us. He shoots you into or out of a game.

But my Redd trade for Crawford (posted in early November) was also going to bring David Lee back this way. I can find that thread. I got hammered by almost everyone here on that deal. In hindsight, that would have worked out better for us as well.

[europa]

My apologies Press. I looked at the wrong number for Redd's contract for next season. You're right, the Bucks would've saved $5M with Miller, not $2M. I looked at RJ's salary and not Redd's.

I still believe that a Miller trade does nothing to help the Bucks "win now" since the drop-off at SG would, in my opinion, not be offset by the upgrade at C with Miller. But the tax savings would've been much better.

I respectfully disagree. I think that Miller is such a massive upgrade over our back-up big men that it would offset the drop off from Redd to Salmons.

I just really think our back-up big man situation is probably the weakest spot on this team by far, those guys are just terrible.

I agree and I also agree Miller would be a gigantic upgrade. No doubt. But I do think this team struggled and often struggled badly offensively without Redd. I think that would have occurred had such a trade go down.

That's one of the reasons why if the Bucks stay in the 9-11 range I hope they get a shot at DeRozan. I believe he'd be a very nice backup for Redd and eventually his replacement.

[paulpressey25]

That's one of the reasons why if the Bucks stay in the 9-11 range I hope they get a shot at DeRozan. I believe he'd be a very nice backup for Redd and eventually his replacement.

I'd be thrilled with DeRozan. I just think he ends up going higher. Teams will come to their senses on his potential.

[LUKE23]

Yeah, DeRozan at 10 is a dream, IMO.

[Newz]

Jamal Crawful is certain a worse player than Redd.

Did you guys see Crawful's game-log?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/g ... ayerId=165

There were a number of nights where he got hot a heck and shot the Warriors a victory. Where are the "crunchtime" stats? I'm guessing Crawford is near the top.

I'm not sure what Crawford did this year is so much different than what Redd does for us. He shoots you into or out of a game.

But my Redd trade for Crawford (posted in early November) was also going to bring David Lee back this way. I can find that thread. I got hammered by almost everyone here on that deal. In hindsight, that would have worked out better for us as well.

I think Jamal Crawford is a really talented player, but I don't think he is nearly as good as Redd. Jamal Crawford is one of the guys you couldn't pay me to have on my team, I think he is a cancer.

Crawford has absolutely no concept of how to play within a team or a system. He dribbles out shot clocks all of the freaking time, totally dominates the ball whenever he gets it and has some of the worse shot selection in NBA history. I don't think Redd always plays the right way, he dominates the ball sometimes, takes some bad shots, forces things down the stretch... But it isn't even comparable to Jamal Crawford.

He also always shoots a poor percentage and right now is playing in a run and gun system that should inflate his FG% and PPG... Yet he still scores less than Redd and shoots a lower percentage.