Bucks News, Trades, Transactions - CP3/Gallo trade idea pg.81

[Commenter]

Middleton + 1st for DeRozan+trade filler makes sense.

i logged in just to say "**** that"

[blazza18]

Middleton + 1st for DeRozan+trade filler makes sense.

It does not make sense.

[TroyD92]

Middleton + 1st for DeRozan+trade filler makes sense.

It does not make sense.

Imagine thinking Derozan is better than Middleton. I wouldn't trade Indy's first for Derozan.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

I think the way to get better is to be constantly seeking ways to improve every rotation player on the team. hell we got beat by fred vanvleet last year. we can talk in circles all we want about the other stuff in that series but if that mfer doesn't go off we win a damn title in possibly a ECF and finals sweep.

improve the roster top to bottom. hill was a huge addition last year. mirotic wasn't. keep fiddling. keep trying to develop the ddvs, browns, and wilsons. trade for who you can when the opportunity arises.

I agree that it's almost certainly easier to get better from say Wes Matthews (4th most minutes so far) than from Middleton. We're also at a point where we're just really good and aren't playing bad players. Much harder to improve from there compared to the old days where half our team didn't belong in the league at all. Like even improving on Matthews or Ersan would not be particularly easy.

getting a guy off the bench who could do what vanvleet did is what we tried with mirotic. hill was a surprise but another dude of that ilk whose maybe a bit more athletic and can put it on the floor and score from all 3 levels would be cool. ddv maybe will someday but im not sure im going to trust him in his first playoff season.

[Ruzious]

MKE out: Middleton, Wilson ($33,564,598‬)
MKE in: Gallinari, Bogdanovic ($31,144,945‬)

SAC out: Barnes, Ariza, Dedmon, Bogdanovic, SAC '20 1st ($58,210,447)
SAC in: Middleton, Adams ($56,446,145)

OKC out: Gallinari, Adams ($48,458,256)
OKC in: Barnes, Ariza, Dedmon, Wilson, SAC '20 1st ($52,642,181)

Bledsoe / Hill
Bogdanovic / DiVincenzo
Gallinari / Brown / Korver
Giannis / Ilyasova
Brook / Robin

I think this trade makes us better this year. Both Bogdanovic and Gallinari are FA so I don't know if we would be able to resign them

Yeah, that's kinda the point though. We'd surely resign Bogdan with Khris off the books, and with Gallo's age/injury history, there's a chance you get him back on a team friendly deal. I'm looking for a contender today and competitive flexibility tomorrow.

Getting back to Sac's Bogdan, every time I look at his stats, they're better - he's one of the most improved players of the season. So, once Sac realizes they're not going to re-sign him, any chance Milwaukee can get him for the Indy first and Ilyasova (and then Sac moves Ersan for a 2nd rounder or something)? If the Bucks do that - any chance they can find the room to re-sign him - guessing he'll cost roughly 15 mil a year?

[Frank Nova]

Love Bogdon, its hard to give up a lot for him tho. Hes more than likely a rental and I think DDV could be just as good moving forward with similar opportunity. So how much is that really worth? Indys 1st and Wes? Seems kinda steep but maybe not...

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[machu46]

Middleton + 1st for DeRozan+trade filler makes sense.

Makes sense in what way exactly? Why would we add a first while getting the lesser player?


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[MissKhriddleton]

Middleton + 1st for DeRozan+trade filler makes sense.

Makes sense in what way exactly? Why would we add a first while getting the lesser player?


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Because Derozan's expiring and we'd be clearing one of the 5 worst contracts in the league. Hammond would be proud.

[MissKhriddleton]

Don't think SAS does that btw.

[Buck Dweller]

youre way overthinking this. a 1 for 1 contract is a deal comparative to what is league wide value. its not some random arbitrary number you perceive as bad.... its relative to other deals in that range.

You can make good arguments for Middleton that:
a) Giannis wanted him back (don't know that, but it's powerful if true)
b) Don't break up a contender on cusp of a title
c) Middleton the highest level player available to the Bucks last summer. Not a $5 player, but a $1 player to Bojan's 75 cents by example.

Those are all good arguments.

But when you get into the "player x makes more, and he's not as good" it usually means you've just conceded that the player isn't worth his contact.

Another team tossing crazy cash at their guy should never be a reason for you to toss crazy cash at your guy.

all 3 of those arguments are monster arguments. not just good... monster.

letting middleton walk and replacing him with bojan for the next 4 years until hes 35 makes me want to puke. I cant even imagine how Giannis would have looked at it.

midleton has been Giannis running mate for years. they've proved they can win. they are basically the same age tier. replacing middleton with an old pissy white guy to be his robin would have been horrific

The first one doesn't have any weight as it's only theoretical, we have no idea if Giannis wanted him back, and IMO it has little theoretical validity as Middleton, while good, is not the kind of player to influence an ECF game, let alone Giannis' FA decision.

The second one is easily contestable given that the team was and is only a contender because of one variable - Giannis (in your own words, #1 guy is all that matters), and not some magical, unsubstantiated continuity principle. Good teams win because they have talent. If there's an improvement you can make on that, i.e. not massively overpaying a non-needle-mover (and the room for debate on that Middleton characterization continues to narrow as we're going on 7-0 now without him, and he didn't make any difference in the ECF), you should do it regardless of your team's contention standings.

The last point, while true, does not take into account the price tag. While Midds was best player available, he was also biggest overpay available. I personally don't think he was BPA by any wide margin, but his contract certainly was biggest by a wide margin.

With the Middleton contract, they have now gridlocked the roster by overpaying a player who, and this is becoming clear in his absence, they potentially don't even need to win games.

[DrWood]

Id do Middleton for Millsaps expiring and Will Barton or Malik Beasley

what? millsap is going to be 35 this year???

deal is basically for barton?

deal would be to improve our team this year and shed Midds contract.
It would be a no-brainer for the Bucks, outside of the negative appearance of trading someone you just gave a big contract to,

[machu46]

Middleton + 1st for DeRozan+trade filler makes sense.

Makes sense in what way exactly? Why would we add a first while getting the lesser player?


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Because Derozan's expiring and we'd be clearing one of the 5 worst contracts in the league. Hammond would be proud.

*Clearing a contract we don’t want to clear


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[GHOSTofSIKMA]

Id do Middleton for Millsaps expiring and Will Barton or Malik Beasley

what? millsap is going to be 35 this year???

deal is basically for barton?

deal would be to improve our team this year and shed Midds contract.
It would be a no-brainer for the Bucks, outside of the negative appearance of trading someone you just gave a big contract to,

no. im sorry. clearly with the value coming back middeltons contract and value is not a problem...... and a 2 for 1 is like the last thing we need. 2 older players coming in and the best player going out... horrible

[DrWood]

what? millsap is going to be 35 this year???

deal is basically for barton?

deal would be to improve our team this year and shed Midds contract.
It would be a no-brainer for the Bucks, outside of the negative appearance of trading someone you just gave a big contract to,

no. im sorry. clearly with the value coming back middeltons contract and value is not a problem...... and a 2 for 1 is like the last thing we need. 2 older players coming in and the best player going out... horrible

MIlsap is still the best player. Barton is a much more reasonably paid player than Midds.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

You can make good arguments for Middleton that:
a) Giannis wanted him back (don't know that, but it's powerful if true)
b) Don't break up a contender on cusp of a title
c) Middleton the highest level player available to the Bucks last summer. Not a $5 player, but a $1 player to Bojan's 75 cents by example.

Those are all good arguments.

But when you get into the "player x makes more, and he's not as good" it usually means you've just conceded that the player isn't worth his contact.

Another team tossing crazy cash at their guy should never be a reason for you to toss crazy cash at your guy.

all 3 of those arguments are monster arguments. not just good... monster.

letting middleton walk and replacing him with bojan for the next 4 years until hes 35 makes me want to puke. I cant even imagine how Giannis would have looked at it.

midleton has been Giannis running mate for years. they've proved they can win. they are basically the same age tier. replacing middleton with an old pissy white guy to be his robin would have been horrific

The first one doesn't have any weight as it's only theoretical, we have no idea if Giannis wanted him back, and IMO it has little theoretical validity as Middleton, while good, is not the kind of player to influence an ECF game, let alone Giannis' FA decision.

The second one is easily contestable given that the team was and is only a contender because of one variable - Giannis (in your own words, #1 guy is all that matters), and not some magical, unsubstantiated continuity principle. Good teams win because they have talent. If there's an improvement you can make on that, i.e. not massively overpaying a non-needle-mover (and the room for debate on that Middleton characterization continues to narrow as we're going on 7-0 now without him, and he didn't make any difference in the ECF), you should do it regardless of your team's contention standings.

The last point, while true, does not take into account the price tag. While Midds was best player available, he was also biggest overpay available. I personally don't think he was BPA by any wide margin, but his contract certainly was biggest by a wide margin.

With the Middleton contract, they have now gridlocked the roster by overpaying a player who, and this is becoming clear in his absence, they potentially don't even need to win games.

the first one is theoretical but its also.... duh.... unless you think our fornt office are morons which I don't.

the 2nd one is not contestable. we had a historical good SRS and were 10-1 in the playoffs before we got clipped by the eventual champion. breaking that up after year one would be liiterally moronic and its embarrassing so many on this board suggest it.

the 3rd one does take the price tag into account. our owners aren't cheap. they aren't going to dump the teams 2nd all-star just because it costs a lot of money

[Diggr14]

I think it's just hard for many people to swallow paying Khris Middleton like a max player when he isn't a max-talent - or even dependable in crunch time. But if we compare our #2s to other title-contenders, it helps clarify things a bit:

The two most obvious comparisons are the:

Clippers: KL and PG
Lakers: LeBron and AD

Both of these teams have #2 players who are a class above the rest of the league, let alone Khris Middleton. They have #2s that would be #1s on virtually every other team in the league not based in Milwaukee.

The next tier of potential opponents:

Philly: Embiid and Simmons/Tobes
Boston: Kemba and Tatum
Denver: Jokic and Murray
Utah: Mitchell and Gobert/Bojan
Houston: Harden and Russ
Miami: Butler and Winslow/Adebayo
Toronto: Siakam and Lowry

I don't think the gap between Middleton and most of those #2 players is especially large.

Not this year, maybe. I also dont trust Middleton in the playoffs at all. But come year 3 we are going to be regretting this deal immensely.

[Chuck Diesel]

If you put Enes Kanter in Robin’s role the Bucks are better. Strictly in that 15 min role, nothing more. Think the Celtics would probably prefer Robin too. Kanter is cartoonish WWE heel who’s said dumb **** about Milwaukee and a guy Giannis probably can’t stand though, so it’ll never happen. But he’d be an upgrade at backup center, despite his glaring defensive faults.

[Bernman]

Sadly, signing brothers of existing key players to keep them happy tethers us to them at least until the end of the season, and then there's still an issue not bringing them back if they weren't free agents at minimum. It's a short-sighted benefit.

When it comes to Robin, that deal looked favorable on paper because of who his brother was. But he hasn't fit the system because of how poor of a 3-pt shooter he is but has still tried to force it. That, and he's struggled to get clean looks in the post. He isn't running the floor either.

[Ron Swanson]

RoLo is still completely fine in the role we've placed him in. He was always gonna be a 10-15 minute, heavily matchup oriented guy, so I'm not sure what exactly anyone expected otherwise?

[BroncoBuck]

Teams overpay good players in the NBA, that’s what the market has been. (Blake, Midds, Love, Conley, Aldridge, Lowry, Ibaka, Gasol, Dragic, etc.)

You just can’t overpay bad-average ones.(Parsons, Batum, Bazemore, Tyler Johnson, Biyombo, Snell, JIngles, THJ, Waiters, Dieng, Shröder, etc.)

Treating Midds like a bottom tier contract the Bucks HAVE to get off of is a terrible take.