Wisconsin Badgers 2017-18 Season Thread

[wapith]

Timing isn't ideal. Poor form even for a high schooler. Also poor form from the MU fan

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Blame the MU fan bringing rationale and the high school kid acting fully within his rights for all the bitching and moaning in this thread. Never change, Wisco.

C'mon dude... you're clearly rubbing salt with this "holier than thou" stuff. I'm not condoning ripping on a high schooler, but to pretend like pretty much every fan base wouldn't act the same is just BS and you know it.

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[midranger]

Still don't get why people always side with the school when they can pull the offer whenever they want pre signing day. This happens every year guys back out. Maybe UW can snipe someone else in this time.

Yeah it’s a huge double standard. The transfer rules make it even worse for the players. Go to a school and don’t like it? Well guess what you have to sit out a season in order to play at a different one. It’s ridiculous. Meanwhile coaches can leave for different jobs at will.

I think if UW found a "better player" and pulled a scholarship from a kid at the last minute and left him in the lurch we'd probably talk about how crappy it was too.

we don't expect things like that to happen at UW basketball. MU? Of course. It happens routinely. UW? No.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

Timing is horrible and you always want a kid to honor a commitment but there are worst things a 18-year old can do besides changing his mind on a college when his dream school opens up a spot for him. I think College BBall is the root of all evil (though I still follow it) so I don't mind once in a while where the kid screws the college. I always love college bball fans who hate the 5th year transfer rule, its the one thing actually encouraging the kids to complete the degree and a lot of fans want to take it away since *gasp* they can transfer to another school they want to without penalty.

[MVP2110]

I agree that if Gard had pulled his offer now we would be and should be talking about how crappy of him that was, so it's ok to say that the kid backing out at the last minute is also crappy.

[Turk Nowitzki]

I agree that if Gard had pulled his offer now we would be and should be talking about how crappy of him that was, so it's ok to say that the kid backing out at the last minute is also crappy.

Yep, I don't think it's out of line to call this a really **** thing to do by Herro. Also another reminder of how I should really just totally ignore recruiting for college sports until signing day is over.

[nmeurett]

To those of you thinking hes going to UNC im pretty positive this is not the case. UNC dsoent even technically have any other scholarships unless someone leaves early for the draft after the Nassir Litte signing. Plus they are in on Darius Days, Zion Williamson, Romeo Langford and Simi Shittu who I would assume they value over Hero as they have plenty of guard depth.

[Kerb Hohl]

I'll reiterate what most have said...Herro can do what he wants. I put myself in the shoes of a 17 year old commit with the world at his fingertips and I'd maybe consider going to UCLA or something like that. That would be cool as hell.

Blows for Gard and a weak move by Herro in that regard (timing), but again, there's nothing you can do about it at this point.

[DingleJerry]

I hate people trashing a kid on twitter, cmon be adults. Crappy timing and all but it just seems he thinks he made the decision too quickly and the only reason he waited this long to back out is that he knew the instate backlash would be bad. What's odd is maybe if he'd waited 2-3 months and done visits to the blue bloods maybe he'd have still committed here, probably not but who knows. Whereas now he can't go back on this and still sign with UW, it's over.

Big pic, if I was advising him I'd say he should not be planning on being a 1 and done. Just doesn't have the physical tools normally associated with it. He's likely the type that needs at least two, likely 3 years. Therefore if I'm not a 1 and done you're best to go to a second level school like a UW, MSU, etc rather than blue bloods like UNC, Duke, Kansas, Kentucky, AZ because they're going to bring in a 5 star each class to possibly squash your minutes/shots. But more power to him, if he thinks he's that good and all he cares about is giving it his all to make the NBA after one year then go for it, good luck.

[HaroldinGMinor]

I stopped getting upset about recruits after Vander Blue.

As for this situation, I'm guessing the parents are mostly to blame. There's a reason the long time Whitnal coach quit after last season.

[HaroldinGMinor]

Also, MU is trash.

[Kerb Hohl]

Don't take this as a "I've cooled on him" post, but they'll be fine, of course. Silver lining is that guard depth is good and young. They obviously would take Herro any day of the week, but now that he's gone, they didn't necessarily need him in terms of having a good team. Of course, maybe if he's really this good he pushes them over the top in 2 years.

The challenge will be the 5 or 6 player class coming up for the 2019 recruiting cycle. You have to satisfy a bunch of needs. Don't shoot too low to just fill the spots but if you shoot too high, you could leave yourself with some giant empty holes if you miss on certain guys. If you take a transfer or a really good player at one position, now you wall yourself off a bit from getting another really good player at that position, etc.

[DingleJerry]

Yea a talent like him could have been the difference between our normal good team and a true FF & title contender though.

For the big 2019 class, it's not just that. They still have 2 spots in 2018. They essentially have to get 6ish recruits still in those classes and thus far haven't been able to get one other than a blah big guy on a 5 for 4 deal because he's not that good, maybe he'll turn into Frank though I guess. The fear is you'll end up settling for a bunch of blah guys just because that's all you can get and don't want to get run around by the top guys like has been happening.

[Kerb Hohl]

Yea a talent like him could have been the difference between our normal good team and a true FF & title contender though.

For the big 2019 class, it's not just that. They still have 2 spots in 2018. They essentially have to get 6ish recruits still in those classes and thus far haven't been able to get one other than a blah big guy on a 5 for 4 deal because he's not that good, maybe he'll turn into Frank though I guess. The fear is you'll end up settling for a bunch of blah guys just because that's all you can get and don't want to get run around by the top guys like has been happening.

I think Hedstrom basically got the grayshirt offer because you don't want to go into a 5-6 man class with zero big man depth locked up beyond Reuvers in 2 years. Get a depth guy and pray that he develops just so you aren't desperately recruiting big men in the 2019 class knowing that if you miss on that one, you now literally have no big man depth.

I'm thinking now they just give the scholarship to Hedstrom. They try to recruit one more guy but if nobody worthy wants to take it, Trevor Anderson gets the other scholarship. That's probably how the two scholarships play out. They'll still have a pretty good/deep team next year and the one after that and the 2019 class is key to ensuring good teams beyond that and depth for the team 3 years from now.

[DingleJerry]

Yea a talent like him could have been the difference between our normal good team and a true FF & title contender though.

For the big 2019 class, it's not just that. They still have 2 spots in 2018. They essentially have to get 6ish recruits still in those classes and thus far haven't been able to get one other than a blah big guy on a 5 for 4 deal because he's not that good, maybe he'll turn into Frank though I guess. The fear is you'll end up settling for a bunch of blah guys just because that's all you can get and don't want to get run around by the top guys like has been happening.

I think Hedstrom basically got the grayshirt offer because you don't want to go into a 5-6 man class with zero big man depth locked up beyond Reuvers in 2 years. Get a depth guy and pray that he develops just so you aren't desperately recruiting big men in the 2019 class knowing that if you miss on that one, you now literally have no big man depth.

I'm thinking now they just give the scholarship to Hedstrom. They try to recruit one more guy but if nobody worthy wants to take it, Trevor Anderson gets the other scholarship. That's probably how the two scholarships play out. They'll still have a pretty good/deep team next year and the one after that and the 2019 class is key to ensuring good teams beyond that and depth for the team 3 years from now.

Yea, that's fine for him. I'm just pointing out that thus far, pretty late in the game, we haven't' even been able to get 1 legit recruit for 2018 and yet somehow we expect them to get like 6 more. Call me skeptical on how that big class will shape up. Probably one more Hedstrom type depth body and one or two Hill/Dearing types in there too

[Kerb Hohl]

Yea a talent like him could have been the difference between our normal good team and a true FF & title contender though.

For the big 2019 class, it's not just that. They still have 2 spots in 2018. They essentially have to get 6ish recruits still in those classes and thus far haven't been able to get one other than a blah big guy on a 5 for 4 deal because he's not that good, maybe he'll turn into Frank though I guess. The fear is you'll end up settling for a bunch of blah guys just because that's all you can get and don't want to get run around by the top guys like has been happening.

I think Hedstrom basically got the grayshirt offer because you don't want to go into a 5-6 man class with zero big man depth locked up beyond Reuvers in 2 years. Get a depth guy and pray that he develops just so you aren't desperately recruiting big men in the 2019 class knowing that if you miss on that one, you now literally have no big man depth.

I'm thinking now they just give the scholarship to Hedstrom. They try to recruit one more guy but if nobody worthy wants to take it, Trevor Anderson gets the other scholarship. That's probably how the two scholarships play out. They'll still have a pretty good/deep team next year and the one after that and the 2019 class is key to ensuring good teams beyond that and depth for the team 3 years from now.

Yea, that's fine for him. I'm just pointing out that thus far, pretty late in the game, we haven't' even been able to get 1 legit recruit for 2018 and yet somehow we expect them to get like 6 more. Call me skeptical on how that big class will shape up. Probably one more Hedstrom type depth body and one or two Hill/Dearing types in there too

The year before, they got King/Reuvers/Davison. I am always skeptical on UW recruiting, but they should be able to get some good players in that 2019 class because those guys will know that there are starting minutes available.

I'm not saying Herro was scared away but not being able to start because guys like him shouldn't be, but right now, anyone you recruit for 2018 will have a team with like 5 seniors and a ton of experienced sophomores/juniors when you arrive on campus. It's hard to get 4-star guys if they have no path to early playing time, even if guys like Thomas, Illikainen, etc. are more of bench scrubs, they still probably see the court a bit so minutes are not easy to come by your freshman year. The 2019 class will step in and half of those guys may enter the rotation right away.

[DingleJerry]

Yea as of now it looks like they got one good recruiting class out of those FF runs. I'm not saying they won't get anyone, they always have gotten guys. Just that all 6-7 spots aren't going to be top 120ish guys like they got with the last class and expected with top 50s Herro/Hauser, etc in this one.

If anything this year should make them cast a bit wider net, don't put all your eggs in Matt Hurt, Jalen Johnson type baskets. Focus on the 50-120 area rather than the top guys that know they're 3-5 year guys and fit the system. If a Dekker type shows that you know is all in on UW so be it but the last 5 years have shown it's kind of futile to try and win the battles for the top guys. Unless of course something drastic changes with the FBI stuff and the 1 and done rule.

[Kerb Hohl]

Yea as of now it looks like they got one good recruiting class out of those FF runs. I'm not saying they won't get anyone, they always have gotten guys. Just that all 6-7 spots aren't going to be top 120ish guys like they got with the last class and expected with top 50s Herro/Hauser, etc in this one.

If anything this year should make them cast a bit wider net, don't put all your eggs in Matt Hurt, Jalen Johnson type baskets. Focus on the 50-120 area rather than the top guys that know they're 3-5 year guys and fit the system. If a Dekker type shows that you know is all in on UW so be it but the last 5 years have shown it's kind of futile to try and win the battles for the top guys. Unless of course something drastic changes with the FBI stuff and the 1 and done rule.

I think the Hauser thing was a bit one-off. They had one scholarship left and a pretty loaded group of depth for 3 years. If they didn't get Hauser, you still had a year of Happ (and a bunch of other seniors), then King, Reuvers, Davison, Pritzl, Trice, Herro (assumed), and maybe Ford turns into something. At worst, you've got a tournament team out of that group for a few years. Why not wait out Hauser, even if unlikely? They are one of the programs that is honorable (depending on your opinions) and doesn't over-recruit/over-sign so they kept a spot for the guy they thought would be the best final piece.

Beyond that, I doubt they're making plans about having Jalen Johnson or Matt Hurt ever commit. You might as well recruit them early on, but they're focusing on plenty of other guys.

The Herro situation was somewhat similar to Sam Dekker and/or Koenig and they held on to those guys. Gotta try to do it.

[DingleJerry]

Looney, Tokoto, Stone, Hauser, Herro, Ellenson, and I think I'm forgetting one or two. Can find one off and excuses for all but there's a trend here. Dekker is the only one that worked and he was clearly all-in right away, if you get that take it. Koenig had his UNC offer but he was still in the 50-70 range like I'm talking about targeting. Seems to me our bread and butter should be the guys just below that level just like Reuvers, Davison, King. They know they're not immediate NBA guys and you also get more bang for you buck as you're getting 3 years at least from them.

[Kerb Hohl]

Looney, Tokoto, Stone, Hauser, Herro, Ellenson, and I think I'm forgetting one or two. Can find one off and excuses for all but there's a trend here. Dekker is the only one that worked and he was clearly all-in right away, if you get that take it. Koenig had his UNC offer but he was still in the 50-70 range like I'm talking about targeting. Seems to me our bread and butter should be the guys just below that level just like Reuvers, Davison, King. They know they're not immediate NBA guys and you also get more bang for you buck as you're getting 3 years at least from them.

That's...exactly what they're already doing. Bo Ryan tried to get all of the guys you listed that aren't recent (Gard) recruits and then fell back to the Davison, King, Koenig, Reuvers, Illikainen (oops), Hayes grouping.

This is just an odd year where two things blew up in their face and the Herro one was a public event. Both Gard and Bo have been crafty with getting guys like Trevor Anderson, Showy, Trice, Gasser, etc. in the program so you have a safety net when your "aim high" fails if you can't fall back to the next range you speak of. But 40-50% of their recruits are in the range that you are speaking of. Herro was in that group before he climbed the charts later in the process. They'll get plenty more fringe-top 100 guys after this. They won't be able to fill their entire roster with them, though, so a few scholarships will go to guys like Hedstrom.

[buckboy]

Also "eat a dick" for talking about bringing his faith into the picture while making this decision? Wow, how righteous you must be! GO BUCKY!!!

Fine. You can eat the dick instead.

NOM NOM NOM! Take the L and save yourself the disgrace, Bucky.

Haha. Keep it classy, dentists.

Edit: Also, I'll echo everyone else's sentiments. Timing sucks, but he's 18. Whatever.

I also think he's a lead pipe lock for North Carolina.