2017 RealGM Bucks Board Re-Draft: ElPeregrino Is The Champion!

gbmb34 · Post #81 » by **gbmb34** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 2:15 am

Remember when everyone at the top of the draft complained about the snaking of the rest of the rounds?

The two teams in the Finals are just the 2 teams with the 2 best players.

Nowak008 · Post #82 » by **Nowak008** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 2:26 am

gbmb34 wrote:Remember when everyone at the top of the draft complained about the snaking of the rest of the rounds?

The two teams in the Finals are just the 2 teams with the 2 best players.

We shouldn't have had this on the player comparision board. No way these are the 2 best teams. One team has 2 rookies on it and the Lebron team is a poop sandwich.

gbmb34 · Post #83 » by **gbmb34** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 3:23 am

Nowak008 wrote:
gbmb34 wrote:Remember when everyone at the top of the draft complained about the snaking of the rest of the rounds?

The two teams in the Finals are just the 2 teams with the 2 best players.

We shouldn't have had this on the player comparision board. No way these are the 2 best teams. One team has 2 rookies on it and the Lebron team is a poop sandwich.

I don't necessarily disagree, but when was the last time the Finals didn't include a team with at least a top 5 player on it?

FlagsFlyForever · Post #84 » by **FlagsFlyForever** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 3:31 am

If people don't like the PC board, what would be a better way of voting?

Nowak008 · Post #85 » by **Nowak008** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 3:31 am

gbmb34 wrote:
Nowak008 wrote:
gbmb34 wrote:Remember when everyone at the top of the draft complained about the snaking of the rest of the rounds?

The two teams in the Finals are just the 2 teams with the 2 best players.

We shouldn't have had this on the player comparision board. No way these are the 2 best teams. One team has 2 rookies on it and the Lebron team is a poop sandwich.

I don't necessarily disagree, but when was the last time the Finals didn't include a team with at least a top 5 player on it?

The Curry and Kawhi teams were much better imo. The Kawhi team in particular didn't make a lot of sense to me why it didn't go further.

Post #86 » by **humanrefutation** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 5:18 am

gbmb34 wrote:Remember when everyone at the top of the draft complained about the snaking of the rest of the rounds?

The two teams in the Finals are just the 2 teams with the 2 best players.

This is a good point, but that might be the right result.

There were a couple teams I thought would go further than they did, and a couple teams I thought went further than they should.

But this league IS star driven, as we've always known. I suspect that the way this draft helped to spread the talent around more evenly across 30 teams made it harder, in some ways, to build great rosters that counteracted the advantage a few posters had from having supremely great stars. It especially made it harder to beat a team led by one of the two best players in the NBA.

To be fair, isn't to discredit Bi6 or ElP. They were fairly voted into the final, beating some good teams along the way.

I'd love to think of other ways to do this in the future. A post-season evaluation of some kind would be interesting and would help reward some shrewd drafting.

Either way, props to everyone involved.

Fotis St · Post #87 » by **Fotis St** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 8:35 am

gbmb34 wrote:
Nowak008 wrote:
gbmb34 wrote:Remember when everyone at the top of the draft complained about the snaking of the rest of the rounds?

The two teams in the Finals are just the 2 teams with the 2 best players.

We shouldn't have had this on the player comparision board. No way these are the 2 best teams. One team has 2 rookies on it and the Lebron team is a poop sandwich.

I don't necessarily disagree, but when was the last time the Finals didn't include a team with at least a top 5 player on it?

All the Spurs Championships and Finals

gbmb34 · Post #88 » by **gbmb34** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 9:48 am

Fotis St wrote:
gbmb34 wrote:
Nowak008 wrote:
We shouldn't have had this on the player comparision board. No way these are the 2 best teams. One team has 2 rookies on it and the Lebron team is a poop sandwich.

I don't necessarily disagree, but when was the last time the Finals didn't include a team with at least a top 5 player on it?

All the Spurs Championships and Finals

Duncan is a top 10 NBA player all time. You don't think he was top 5 during that run (maybe not the last one)

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Post #89 » by **paulpressey25** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 10:57 am

I think we should have Dutchman do his six divisions playoff on the general board now. Randomly pull Six groupings of five teams. Have the general board guys vote two teams out of each five team grouping for round one versus head to head.

All that said Fotis, I think your team went as far as it could. When it comes up against LeBron and Durant teams, it wasn't going to make it.

The playoff seeding done on here was misleading because the poll simply asked for the 16 best teams. I was third seed in that grouping, yet I knew that was more a result of my team likely being able to win 46-52 games versus it being a true contender. My team got that seed only because most everyone thought it would be a good team, but not necessarily a great team.

bizarro · Post #90 » by **bizarro** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 4:36 pm

Nowak008 wrote:
gbmb34 wrote:
Nowak008 wrote:
We shouldn't have had this on the player comparision board. No way these are the 2 best teams. One team has 2 rookies on it and the Lebron team is a poop sandwich.

I don't necessarily disagree, but when was the last time the Finals didn't include a team with at least a top 5 player on it?

The Curry and Kawhi teams were much better imo. The Kawhi team in particular didn't make a lot of sense to me why it didn't go further.

What was the Kawhi team again? I failed to vote Round 1 but I have to say I remained fairly surprised consistently from the quarters on. I also was a tad biased against G. Hill and Favors even though - in a vacuum - that team had more talent when healthy. I still remain shocked PP wasn't awarded a round 1 victory. He had a nice squad. And, I must say, a lot of the results felt like an All Star vote...

SickMother · Post #91 » by **SickMother** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 5:07 pm

bizarro wrote:What was the Kawhi team again?

Patrick Beverley, Eric Gordon, Kawhi, Kelly Olynyk & Kyle O'Quinn starting with Austin Rivers, Little Big Dog & Alex Len off the bench.

No one on my team is 30 with PB & EG playing their age 29 seasons in 2017-18. This team graded out average or better across the board in most of the box score categories in 2016-17 (viewtopic.php?p=58798565#p58798565) with their biggest weakness probably being a lack of a true PG.

This was part of my attempt to vote grub in my matchup with Bucks in 6/LBJ...

My starting five features a pair of ALL NBA defenders (Kawhi & Beverly) plus a solid rebounding/shot blocking big in KOQ...

Extreme ball movement despite no true ball dominant facilitator (2016-17 AST%'s: Kawhi: 18.9, Beverley: 18.8, Olynyk: 15.2, KOQ: 14.8, Gordon: 12.3)...

Plenty of spacing with three above average 3P shooters (Kawhi: .387 on 380 attempts, Gordon: .372 on 661 attempts & Beverly: .382 on 288 attempts) plus a fourth average 3P shooter (Olynyk: .354 on 192 attempts)...

& a bench which features three youngsters who have already proven capable at the NBA level with room for potential growth in Austin Rivers who can facilitate (15.0 AST %) & hit some threes (.371 on 299 attempts), Little Big Dog who can hit from two (.512 on 213 attempts) & three (.392 on 125 attempts) plus another young rebounding/shot blocking big in Alex Len to protect the rim.

coolhandluke121 · Post #92 » by **coolhandluke121** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 6:17 pm

Both these teams are terrible and barely deserved to be in the playoffs, let alone the finals. I guess most people completely missed the point as to why superstars so often end up having the best teams. It's because other players want to play with them, the best coaches want to coach them, they find their way to cities where other good players want to play, and their max contracts are hardly more expensive than guys like Lowry or Conley so there's no opportunity cost to having them on your payroll. In other words, for a whole bunch of reasons that weren't factors here. In the real world it's much easier to build a really good supporting cast if you have an elite superstar. However, in this format, it was by design much, much harder to build a good supporting cast around Lebron or KD than Lowry. What works as a heuristic in the real world doesn't work at all here. Most of Lebron's or KD's matchups here would end a lot like Lebron's first trip to the finals or KG's numerous first-round exits with the Wolves.

Another problem is that this was supposed to be a regular season contest. No way Lebron or KD can carry those teams to a better regular season than at least 10-12 other teams that were in this competition. Those superstars can play 42 mpg in a 7-game series and close the gap a little, but that wasn't part of the deal here.

Post #93 » by **Prez** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 6:24 pm

So what's the deal with like freak season ending injuries? Am I just stuck with a dead roster spot with Exum likely done for the year before the season even started or am I allowed to pick an undrafted guy as a replacement?

Nowak008 · Post #94 » by **Nowak008** » Sat Oct 7, 2017 7:09 pm

bizarro wrote:

What was the Kawhi team again? I failed to vote Round 1 but I have to say I remained fairly surprised consistently from the quarters on. I also was a tad biased against G. Hill and Favors even though - in a vacuum - that team had more talent when healthy. I still remain shocked PP wasn't awarded a round 1 victory. He had a nice squad. And, I must say, a lot of the results felt like an All Star vote...

Bev/Gordon/Kawhi/Oly/Oquin with Rivers/GR3/Len off the bench. If he woulda just taken short at Or R Lopez it would have been game over.

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emunney · Post #95 » by **emunney** » Sun Oct 8, 2017 3:49 am

ElPeregrino wrote:If people don't like the PC board, what would be a better way of voting?

Here would have been better. Nothing would have been good.

emunney · Post #96 » by **emunney** » Sun Oct 8, 2017 3:50 am

Prez wrote:So what's the deal with like freak season ending injuries? Am I just stuck with a dead roster spot with Exum likely done for the year before the season even started or am I allowed to pick an undrafted guy as a replacement?

Think you guys should do a supplemental draft after the season. Another 4 rounds. Then run the sims.

DutchManDanFan · Post #97 » by **DutchManDanFan** » Sun Oct 8, 2017 10:16 am

Since the last players on rosters shouldn't make the difference, every teams can be completed with the same 5 players, to make it 13 man rosters. I suggest these 5: GPII, Vaughn, Beasley, Teletovic and Henson.
I think a new poll should be done half way this season so we know more about the rookies.

Post #98 » by **humanrefutation** » Sun Oct 8, 2017 10:37 pm

The results of the final are in.

#9 ElPeregrino OVER #4 Bucks in 6, 19-12. ***UPSET***

The Champion

ElPeregrino

PG: Elfrid Payton (139) / Malik Monk (201) / Lou Williams
SG: Lou Williams (118) / Manu Ginobili (158) / Malik Monk
SF: Kevin Durant (3) / Manu Ginobili
PF: Al Horford (58) / Kevin Durant / John Collins (232)
C: Pau Gasol (88) / Al Horford / John Collins

Post #99 » by **humanrefutation** » Sun Oct 8, 2017 10:46 pm

Thanks to everyone who drafted, voted, helped to manage the event, and otherwise participated. We began this on September 2nd and wrapped it up over a month later. Even if you didn't make the playoffs, being a pat of this required hours of research and thought and participation. Thank you for being willing to do so, because it helped to make this an interesting and engaging experience during an otherwise dead portion of the offseason.

I look forward to any future preseason or postseason evaluations of the teams we've drafted, and hopefully we can reach a consensus on an annual redraft of some kind on this board. 8-)

FlagsFlyForever · Post #100 » by **FlagsFlyForever** » Sun Oct 8, 2017 11:38 pm

This was fun. Thank you to everybody who participated. I look forward to the tournament in the postseason with these same teams. The postseason results will certainly be different and it will be interesting to see how the results change.

I believe I built a great team that would compliment each other perfectly. Others have expressed that they disagree. There's one thing that we can all agree on. Go Bucks!