OT: Investing - Stocks/Mutual Funds/Bonds/Crypto

[RedMosquito76]

A lot of the industry is saying the market correction is another year out. That being said, you aren't going to be able to time it. In the age of algorythmic trading and instant information, when it happens it is going to be too quick to react to in any meaningful way. Smart long term money is to keep doing what you should always be doing - dollar cost averaging in produtcs within your risk tolerance. On the shorter end, try to put yourself into position to take advantage of a downturn and put some cash together to get in on the cheap end of the cycle.

Given all that, there are some TPMM's out there with some pretty interesting tactical management strategies. You'll pay a little more in fees, but limit your downside. Otherwise, if liquidity isn't high on your list of priorities and you are comfortable with alternatives, there are some good NT REITS paying 6% that might be a good place to park and ride it out.

[sidney lanier]

Yeah, so much emphasis on when/what to buy that many people put little thought into when/what to sell. Selling too early/late is as big of a factor as buying too early/late. Generally if a stock I have goes up I'll take some profit along the way and, depending on the situation, buy more on the dips. I like to lock in some profit and then ride the rest.

I sold my Apple stock in 1995 when Windows 95 came out, figuring that was the end for the Cupertino boys. Is that what you mean by knowing when to sell?

Best to go in with an exit strategy, I agree, and you can't kick yourself for lost opportunities. If you invest, you're going to be confronted with the "what if" question and just have to deal with it. I do what MD does and like to lock in a profit and ride the rest. A while ago I bought a bunch of LUV when it was under $10. It immediately went up and I sold half at around $16. I still have a lot, but it's human nature to think about how much I left on the table, every time you see the current price, which this morning is $65.13.

With AAPL, one of the three or four Maseratis I could have bought with the money I threw away would probably have killed me anyway.

[HaroldinGMinor]

One of the biggest mistakes I see is not taking advantage of your company's 401k match ( if they have one). While this varies, typically a company will match 50% of what you put in up to 6%. So they'll put in 3% if you put in 6% or higher. That's free money. Take it.

Agree. My company matches up to 11% and I take full advantage, but I realize that's mostly unheard of.

Wow that's great. My company is 4% match and you're immediately vested which is great but not 11% great.

[chile]

I am in stocks all the time too. I never stop putting money in. As for individual stocks, I mostly buy Google, Amazon, and Facebook. I also put some money in other companies I like such as Home Depot and Verizon. I also have two guys managing some other money (our 401k guy and a Merrill lynch guy through my bank) which ends up going in a much larger variety of stocks and mutual funds.

I also flip houses so I have money constantly in real estate. I feel like I am super diversified but I have been hesitant about bitcoin or other similar currencies. Some of my friends and business partners are in but no one I know is going in with more than basically play money to them. I have no doubt it will be a thing but the rate at which it increased in value screams bubble so I haven’t pulled the trigger on buying in.

Two other things I am looking at are refinancing school loans as a conservative investment. I know a guy doing this now and you basically can get a 10% guaranteed rate of return but no potential for more. I have also looked into getting into the marijuana business quite a bit. The more I research it though the more it feels like the Wild West and at some point why wouldn’t Marlboro come in and murder the small time dispensaries and grow houses?

So for now, stocks, mutual funds, and real estate are my go to’s.

I am all ears if you have something getting 10% back with nothing more/less.

[HaroldinGMinor]

I look at cryptocurrency like the advent of the internet. Back in the mid 90's you had all these players (Netscape, Alta Vista, etc.) and all their stocks were shooting through the roof. Then the bubble burst and a lot of people lost money - but we still have the internet and tech that we all use. I could see almost all the alt-currencies going by the way side and a few players remain. This bubble is starting to remind me of the mortgage crisis. When I see random Facebook friends that have zero financial background touting their investing acumen and bragging about the money they've made in cryptocurrencies, it's time to get out.

[M-C-G]

Can someone give me a quick gist of what this cryptocurrency is? I just read an article explaining it and it basically seems like fake money. I'm not understanding the business model what so ever

[averageposter]

I think with Crypto you have to play people as much as the coins, the increased interest has driven the price up and up as we all know. Litecoins bump is likely do to its increased utility to a degree, but more so do to the ease of purchase. Because its on Coinbase, because you can easily buy smaller amounts with only a credit card the masses have flocked to it and its value has risen accordingly. The trick will be identifying which alt coins get added to these easy to use exchanges and buy them before they do. Ripple appears to be the next most likely add to coinbase, at least that is the chatter.

I do think with bitcoin basically taking a years worth of electricity operating a $5K dedicated miner to hash the math that defines it currently and obviously more with each discovered coin, there is an established value to the production of its Encryption, that is still far from its trading value but I don't think it's accurate to say there is no inherent value in the currency as its security is produced in a manner of speaking.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

Yeah, so much emphasis on when/what to buy that many people put little thought into when/what to sell. Selling too early/late is as big of a factor as buying too early/late. Generally if a stock I have goes up I'll take some profit along the way and, depending on the situation, buy more on the dips. I like to lock in some profit and then ride the rest.

I think people just over think it too much. Unless you are maxing out your tax advantage accounts, which I guess 95% of the population is not, you shouldn't be buying and selling investments. Buy and hold should be your strategy IMO.

[M-C-G]

Yeah, so much emphasis on when/what to buy that many people put little thought into when/what to sell. Selling too early/late is as big of a factor as buying too early/late. Generally if a stock I have goes up I'll take some profit along the way and, depending on the situation, buy more on the dips. I like to lock in some profit and then ride the rest.

I think people just over think it too much. Unless you are maxing out your tax advantage accounts, which I guess 95% of the population is not, you shouldn't be buying and selling investments. Buy and hold should be your strategy IMO.

Ugh, I had some ROK stock at like 15, sold at something 65 and was able to eliminate all my debt and have a nice little nest egg on top. I was thrilled at the time, but that stock two weeks ago was over 200 with that Emerson bid. But thems the breaks.

[bizarro]

Can someone give me a quick gist of what this cryptocurrency is? I just read an article explaining it and it basically seems like fake money. I'm not understanding the business model what so ever

it’s just as real as paper money (which is solely backed by faith, if you really look at it) in that it is a highly traded and invested-in commodity. The main difference entirely in crypto’s case is the core tenet of open source. Every transaction, every fork, and every hard fork are recorded in a public ledger for verification. You’ll hear quite a lot of talk about ‘block chain technology’ - this is the backbone of Bitcoin and from this origin many many an offshoot coin are born (map of coins is a great website to see derivative and birth coins). The coins are generally the currency used as, well, currency within a configuration/technology etc. In bitcoin’s case, a single bitcoin is the result of ‘mining’ by computers. It is entirely and has always been cryptographic. So, there is a finite amount of coin within this particular blockchain, the cryptographic problems become more difficult to solve as more coin is mined and hence computers need more energy expended as the source becomes more finite (this is a whole conversation in itself as to what will happen as the last Bitcoin is mined. It won’t just stop).

It’s easiest, imho, to look at the difference between ‘Proof of Work’ and ‘Proof of Stake’. Bitcoin is POW - the ledger confirms the computer(s) completed the problem or work. POS, on the other hand, is more indicative of a widely scattered and completely decentralised network of computers whose involvement is the ‘Proof of Stake’. Far less energy is consumed here. These are far more intriguing to me in the grand scheme of things due to the nature of excessive energy consumption as mining becomes more and more difficult.

The most important thing for anyone doubting this form of technology, participation, and currency is to realize the majority of the world does not have the access or the priviledge we do. They can’t pay the banking fees they can’t trust the banks or they don’t have access to the banks anyhow - maybe they fear a dictator etc. The idealized vision of this technology is completely global and participatory open source economy. AND, it is an extremely young technology and phenomenon. The potential ‘returns’ are huge as are the risks of not knowing what you are doing, who or what you’re investing in etc. The analogy of the ‘Wild West’ is very accurate in a sense. Personally, I have investment money to play with and I firmly believe this is most definitely not a fad but a natural evolution within the realm of internet and techno evolution reality. There are already Bitcoin ATM’s all over most modern cities. It’s a matter of time before Bitcoin hardware wallets are a common household item.

[tski1972]

I do whatever my guy at Edward Jones believes is best.

[bizarro]

And to the end of Open Source is my poet laureate:

Coinbase charges excessive fees imho for wallet transfers. Gdax uses their same verification hardware but the fees are less in my experience. I then prefer to trade on Bittrex. I will occasionally use Binance. I keep what i am actively investing in bittrex. Otherwise, I have a Ledger Blue to keep all my saved in estment entirely offline.


A few very interesting plays in my research of the people and technologies involved: Waves, Lisk, Ripple (mentioned above and currently trading at $0.7-), and the Japanese version of a better Ethereum ‘Cardano’.

[M-C-G]

Can someone give me a quick gist of what this cryptocurrency is? I just read an article explaining it and it basically seems like fake money. I'm not understanding the business model what so ever

it’s just as real as paper money (which is solely backed by faith, if you really look at it) in that it is a highly traded and invested-in commodity. The main difference entirely in crypto’s case is the core tenet of open source. Every transaction, every fork, and every hard fork are recorded in a public ledger for verification. You’ll hear quite a lot of talk about ‘block chain technology’ - this is the backbone of Bitcoin and from this origin many many an offshoot coin are born (map of coins is a great website to see derivative and birth coins). The coins are generally the currency used as, well, currency within a configuration/technology etc. In bitcoin’s case, a single bitcoin is the result of ‘mining’ by computers. It is entirely and has always been cryptographic. So, there is a finite amount of coin within this particular blockchain, the cryptographic problems become more difficult to solve as more coin is mined and hence computers need more energy expended as the source becomes more finite (this is a whole conversation in itself as to what will happen as the last Bitcoin is mined. It won’t just stop).

It’s easiest, imho, to look at the difference between ‘Proof of Work’ and ‘Proof of Stake’. Bitcoin is POW - the ledger confirms the computer(s) completed the problem or work. POS, on the other hand, is more indicative of a widely scattered and completely decentralised network of computers whose involvement is the ‘Proof of Stake’. Far less energy is consumed here. These are far more intriguing to me in the grand scheme of things due to the nature of excessive energy consumption as mining becomes more and more difficult.

The most important thing for anyone doubting this form of technology, participation, and currency is to realize the majority of the world does not have the access or the priviledge we do. They can’t pay the banking fees they can’t trust the banks or they don’t have access to the banks anyhow - maybe they fear a dictator etc. The idealized vision of this technology is completely global and participatory open source economy. AND, it is an extremely young technology and phenomenon. The potential ‘returns’ are huge as are the risks of not knowing what you are doing, who or what you’re investing in etc. The analogy of the ‘Wild West’ is very accurate in a sense. Personally, I have investment money to play with and I firmly believe this is most definitely not a fad but a natural evolution within the realm of internet and techno evolution reality. There are already Bitcoin ATM’s all over most modern cities. It’s a matter of time before Bitcoin hardware wallets are a common household item.

I appreciate the response, but I am still struggling with understanding what this business model is. Computers mine for coins and then get them. Where are profits made? I know I am speaking out of pure ignorance but the concept seems like pet rocks to me.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

Can someone give me a quick gist of what this cryptocurrency is? I just read an article explaining it and it basically seems like fake money. I'm not understanding the business model what so ever

it’s just as real as paper money (which is solely backed by faith, if you really look at it) in that it is a highly traded and invested-in commodity. The main difference entirely in crypto’s case is the core tenet of open source. Every transaction, every fork, and every hard fork are recorded in a public ledger for verification. You’ll hear quite a lot of talk about ‘block chain technology’ - this is the backbone of Bitcoin and from this origin many many an offshoot coin are born (map of coins is a great website to see derivative and birth coins). The coins are generally the currency used as, well, currency within a configuration/technology etc. In bitcoin’s case, a single bitcoin is the result of ‘mining’ by computers. It is entirely and has always been cryptographic. So, there is a finite amount of coin within this particular blockchain, the cryptographic problems become more difficult to solve as more coin is mined and hence computers need more energy expended as the source becomes more finite (this is a whole conversation in itself as to what will happen as the last Bitcoin is mined. It won’t just stop).

It’s easiest, imho, to look at the difference between ‘Proof of Work’ and ‘Proof of Stake’. Bitcoin is POW - the ledger confirms the computer(s) completed the problem or work. POS, on the other hand, is more indicative of a widely scattered and completely decentralised network of computers whose involvement is the ‘Proof of Stake’. Far less energy is consumed here. These are far more intriguing to me in the grand scheme of things due to the nature of excessive energy consumption as mining becomes more and more difficult.

The most important thing for anyone doubting this form of technology, participation, and currency is to realize the majority of the world does not have the access or the priviledge we do. They can’t pay the banking fees they can’t trust the banks or they don’t have access to the banks anyhow - maybe they fear a dictator etc. The idealized vision of this technology is completely global and participatory open source economy. AND, it is an extremely young technology and phenomenon. The potential ‘returns’ are huge as are the risks of not knowing what you are doing, who or what you’re investing in etc. The analogy of the ‘Wild West’ is very accurate in a sense. Personally, I have investment money to play with and I firmly believe this is most definitely not a fad but a natural evolution within the realm of internet and techno evolution reality. There are already Bitcoin ATM’s all over most modern cities. It’s a matter of time before Bitcoin hardware wallets are a common household item.

I appreciate the response, but I am still struggling with understanding what this business model is. Computers mine for coins and then get them. Where are profits made? I know I am speaking out of pure ignorance but the concept seems like pet rocks to me.

I could be wrong, but I thought high level you mine to maintain a transactional history and paid in bitcoin. This will go on for a decade or so until they transfer fees will pay for this transactional history. It's way over my head but that's how I understood it

[bizarro]

it’s just as real as paper money (which is solely backed by faith, if you really look at it) in that it is a highly traded and invested-in commodity. The main difference entirely in crypto’s case is the core tenet of open source. Every transaction, every fork, and every hard fork are recorded in a public ledger for verification. You’ll hear quite a lot of talk about ‘block chain technology’ - this is the backbone of Bitcoin and from this origin many many an offshoot coin are born (map of coins is a great website to see derivative and birth coins). The coins are generally the currency used as, well, currency within a configuration/technology etc. In bitcoin’s case, a single bitcoin is the result of ‘mining’ by computers. It is entirely and has always been cryptographic. So, there is a finite amount of coin within this particular blockchain, the cryptographic problems become more difficult to solve as more coin is mined and hence computers need more energy expended as the source becomes more finite (this is a whole conversation in itself as to what will happen as the last Bitcoin is mined. It won’t just stop).

It’s easiest, imho, to look at the difference between ‘Proof of Work’ and ‘Proof of Stake’. Bitcoin is POW - the ledger confirms the computer(s) completed the problem or work. POS, on the other hand, is more indicative of a widely scattered and completely decentralised network of computers whose involvement is the ‘Proof of Stake’. Far less energy is consumed here. These are far more intriguing to me in the grand scheme of things due to the nature of excessive energy consumption as mining becomes more and more difficult.

The most important thing for anyone doubting this form of technology, participation, and currency is to realize the majority of the world does not have the access or the priviledge we do. They can’t pay the banking fees they can’t trust the banks or they don’t have access to the banks anyhow - maybe they fear a dictator etc. The idealized vision of this technology is completely global and participatory open source economy. AND, it is an extremely young technology and phenomenon. The potential ‘returns’ are huge as are the risks of not knowing what you are doing, who or what you’re investing in etc. The analogy of the ‘Wild West’ is very accurate in a sense. Personally, I have investment money to play with and I firmly believe this is most definitely not a fad but a natural evolution within the realm of internet and techno evolution reality. There are already Bitcoin ATM’s all over most modern cities. It’s a matter of time before Bitcoin hardware wallets are a common household item.

I appreciate the response, but I am still struggling with understanding what this business model is. Computers mine for coins and then get them. Where are profits made? I know I am speaking out of pure ignorance but the concept seems like pet rocks to me.

I could be wrong, but I thought high level you mine to maintain a transactional history and paid in bitcoin. This will go on for a decade or so until they transfer fees will pay for this transactional history. It's way over my head but that's how I understood it

This is where releasing ideas of convention is wise.
The business model is more the co-created reality. The ‘income’ is an offshoot. The value is increasing preposterously right now due to the immense amount of participation ‘versus’ a finite amount of Bitcoin. This will regulate over time - how much it will regulate or to what degree is unknown as Bitcoins value is not dictated by inflation. The core business model, imho, is this: billions of people across the planet see a distinct value in an anonymous, decentralized, inflation-resistant system ,devoid of government autocracy that has employed Blockchain for its core technical requirements. This is the beginning. Already, Iota is working toward the Tangle - for example.

[sidney lanier]

This is where releasing ideas of convention is wise.
The business model is more the co-created reality. The ‘income’ is an offshoot. The value is increasing preposterously right now due to the immense amount of participation ‘versus’ a finite amount of Bitcoin. This will regulate over time - how much it will regulate or to what degree is unknown as Bitcoins value is not dictated by inflation. The core business model, imho, is this: billions of people across the planet see a distinct value in an anonymous, decentralized, inflation-resistant system ,devoid of government autocracy that has employed Blockchain for its core technical requirements. This is the beginning. Already, Iota is working toward the Tangle - for example.

So do you think those of us not brave enough to make the cryptocurrency leap should be looking at investment opportunities in the underlying blockchain technology?

[MickeyDavis]

For those unfamiliar with Blockchain technology, here is a pretty good, simple video. There are many others.

Watch on YouTube

[MickeyDavis]

Watch on YouTube

[HaroldinGMinor]

This is where releasing ideas of convention is wise.
The business model is more the co-created reality. The ‘income’ is an offshoot. The value is increasing preposterously right now due to the immense amount of participation ‘versus’ a finite amount of Bitcoin. This will regulate over time - how much it will regulate or to what degree is unknown as Bitcoins value is not dictated by inflation. The core business model, imho, is this: billions of people across the planet see a distinct value in an anonymous, decentralized, inflation-resistant system ,devoid of government autocracy that has employed Blockchain for its core technical requirements. This is the beginning. Already, Iota is working toward the Tangle - for example.

So do you think those of us not brave enough to make the cryptocurrency leap should be looking at investment opportunities in the underlying blockchain technology?

I would say this is like investing in Cisco instead of Netscape. So yeah if you can determine who the players will be it's probably a good move and more than likely a safer move.

[Nowak008]

I've got the best investment strategy you guys.

Marry someone who makes a lot of money. The end.


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