Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - Joe Johnson workout, pg 97

[StickeeFingaz]

Zach Lowe emphasizing that the Bucks will make an effort to find a 6th/7th man upgrade. Simmons mentions, what about a 4th/5th man upgrade? Both agree that if your closing playoff lineup, with Giannis at center, includes Donte & Pat then you’re in trouble and I tend to agree.

Unfortunately we’re in a very difficult spot to try and upgrade the 4th/5th guy.

I do think now would be the time to include Donte in a trade for a player who you have more trust in during a playoff series. Donte was terrible last year until the last game or two, when we were already dead in the water.

Did they think pat was our 5th guy, because by upgrading our 6/7th spot we may very possibly be replacing pat in the closing 5, and we’d no longer trot out both Donte & pat. Or were they saying that neither of those two should be in a closing 5?

That comment was based on the current roster and that neither are comfortable with Donte and Pat in the closing small ball five, and I don’t disagree.

[Prez]

I’m not concerned with Donte as a closer. We just need someone as good or better than him to be that other guy. Brook, Pat, etc aren’t cutting it.

[StickeeFingaz]

I’m not concerned with Donte as a closer. We just need someone as good or better than him to be that other guy. Brook, Pat, etc aren’t cutting it.

I don’t want to be but I’m just uneasy thinking about a playoff game and Donte is the open guy taking a three or deciding to drive & finish after good perimeter ball movement.

Maybe that opportunity never presents itself or maybe Donte makes the right play, just uneasy about it right now. I also understand that it’s not realistic for us to have the perfect lineup in which we’re comfortable with every player on the floor.

[WRau1]

I’m not concerned with Donte as a closer. We just need someone as good or better than him to be that other guy. Brook, Pat, etc aren’t cutting it.

I don’t want to be but I’m just uneasy thinking about a playoff game and Donte is the open guy taking a three or deciding to drive & finish after good perimeter ball movement.

Maybe that opportunity never presents itself or maybe Donte makes the right play, just uneasy about it right now. I also understand that it’s not realistic for us to have the perfect lineup in which we’re comfortable with every player on the floor.

Almost

[Prez]

I’m not concerned with Donte as a closer. We just need someone as good or better than him to be that other guy. Brook, Pat, etc aren’t cutting it.

I don’t want to be but I’m just uneasy thinking about a playoff game and Donte is the open guy taking a three or deciding to drive & finish after good perimeter ball movement.

Maybe that opportunity never presents itself or maybe Donte makes the right play, just uneasy about it right now. I also understand that it’s not realistic for us to have the perfect lineup in which we’re comfortable with every player on the floor.

Well let me phrase it this way - I’m no more concerned with Donte as one of our 5 guys than I would be with KCP, Jeff Green/DJ, Seth Curry, PatBev/Batum, Theis/Thompson, etc.

Like you were suggesting, teams like the 19 Raptors or 17 Warriors with insane closing lineups aren’t the norm, you’re going to have some inconsistencies in the lineup and Donte is right there with the complementary guys on most other contenders.

[Prez]

Also if we go past just scoring, Donte > Bogdan.

[German Athens]

Does anyone think bogdan could potentially be had in the off-season while still keeping Donte? It seems like bogdan s value has likely cratered this season so far. Not that I would really want him at 18m per year, but I’d guess a trade of our first and salary filler could potentially do it.

[Siefer]

I'm back on my **** again. Crunch time smallball lineup: Rubio, DDV, Holiday, Middleton, Giannis.



I believe moving DJA also gives us a bit more wiggle room on the hard cap for a couple of buyout guys.

[crowhead76]

I’m not concerned with Donte as a closer. We just need someone as good or better than him to be that other guy. Brook, Pat, etc aren’t cutting it.

I don’t want to be but I’m just uneasy thinking about a playoff game and Donte is the open guy taking a three or deciding to drive & finish after good perimeter ball movement.

Maybe that opportunity never presents itself or maybe Donte makes the right play, just uneasy about it right now. I also understand that it’s not realistic for us to have the perfect lineup in which we’re comfortable with every player on the floor.

I could be mistaken, but I thought that I had heard that up until the last few games, Donte led the team in 4th quarter field goal percentage.

[skones]

I'm back on my **** again. Crunch time smallball lineup: Rubio, DDV, Holiday, Middleton, Giannis.



I believe moving DJA also gives us a bit more wiggle room on the hard cap for a couple of buyout guys.

This doesn't work. We're hardcapped. We are sending out 13.6, and bringing in 17. We cannot bring in more than we send out. Plus, Rubio has been an embarrassment this season. We shouldn't be adding things like 2nds, or Forbes for that matter.

[SupremeHustle]

Put Donte in trades you cowards.

[Siefer]

I'm back on my **** again. Crunch time smallball lineup: Rubio, DDV, Holiday, Middleton, Giannis.



I believe moving DJA also gives us a bit more wiggle room on the hard cap for a couple of buyout guys.

This doesn't work. We're hardcapped. We are sending out 13.6, and bringing in 17. We cannot bring in more than we send out. Plus, Rubio has been an embarrassment this season. We shouldn't be adding things like 2nds, or Forbes for that matter.

Are we still hardcapped if we sent DJA out? Anyways TradeNBA is usually decent about navigating the cap and prompted me about the Bucks being hardcapped a few times. IDK, man. Anyways, Forbes is very bad, and Rubio is stuck in hell. I think he'd great here.

Edit: Okay, so TradeNBA isn't factoring in the ~$4 million in possible bonuses on Jrue's contract that is causing us to be so pinched.

[Frank Nova]

Zach Lowe emphasizing that the Bucks will make an effort to find a 6th/7th man upgrade. Simmons mentions, what about a 4th/5th man upgrade? Both agree that if your closing playoff lineup, with Giannis at center, includes Donte & Pat then you’re in trouble and I tend to agree.

Unfortunately we’re in a very difficult spot to try and upgrade the 4th/5th guy.

I do think now would be the time to include Donte in a trade for a player who you have more trust in during a playoff series. Donte was terrible last year until the last game or two, when we were already dead in the water.

Donte was above average when there was no pressure in the playoffs last year. We will need huge series’ from him, not just games come playoff time. The inconsistency between Pat and DD is what kills them. You just never know who’s gonna show up and that’s not gonna cut it against Brooklyn or even Philly/Boston realistically.

[skones]

Are we still hardcapped if we sent DJA out? Anyways TradeNBA is usually decent about navigating the cap and prompted me about the Bucks being hardcapped a few times. IDK, man. Anyways, Forbes is very bad, and Rubio is stuck in hell. I think he'd great here.

We were hard-capped for the entire season as soon as we used more than the tax-payer MLE. Sending out DJA does nothing to change that. Forbes is a dirt cheap flame thrower of a shooter. Those are a commodity in this league regardless of whether they do anything else well. If you're shooting 45% on volume from distance, you're elite company. That equals positive value.

Re: Rubio. He's been stuck in hell for the majority of his career. It doesn't excuse his play.

[theFireBlanket]

Don't trade Donte eVer again, pls.

[paulpressey25]

Put Donte in trades you cowards.

Donte ($3mm), DJ Wilson ($4.5mm) and Dj Augustin($6.6mm) for JJ Redick ($13mm), Sign Ersan and some other FA or buyout guard with the $1mm in salary flexibility we'd gain under the hard cap.

There, how's that?

[ShootingtheJ]

Zach Lowe emphasizing that the Bucks will make an effort to find a 6th/7th man upgrade. Simmons mentions, what about a 4th/5th man upgrade? Both agree that if your closing playoff lineup, with Giannis at center, includes Donte & Pat then you’re in trouble and I tend to agree.

Unfortunately we’re in a very difficult spot to try and upgrade the 4th/5th guy.

I do think now would be the time to include Donte in a trade for a player who you have more trust in during a playoff series. Donte was terrible last year until the last game or two, when we were already dead in the water.

Donte was above average when there was no pressure in the playoffs last year. We will need huge series’ from him, not just games come playoff time. The inconsistency between Pat and DD is what kills them. You just never know who’s gonna show up and that’s not gonna cut it against Brooklyn or even Philly/Boston realistically.

Elimination games are no pressure games? Wow, that's a real reach.

Donte started slow and got better during the bubble, and was dynamic at the end.

[Siefer]

Forbes is a dirt cheap flame thrower of a shooter. Those are a commodity in this league regardless of whether they do anything else well. If you're shooting 45% on volume from distance, you're elite company. That equals positive value.

Look at the the lineup data. He's killing them out there outside of a couple narrow groups. I want to more optimistic that we can find 5-10 positive minutes for him, because yes, he's an elite three-point shooter, but he's been a negative so far this season. He can't defend worth a lick, and makes too many bad decisions on offense given what we're asking him to do. The amount of times he's dribbled out of a three into a pull up 18-footer is bewildering.

Edit: I should be clear, I'd be much happier if he was our 10th guy, and we could cherry pick his situations better.

[SupremeHustle]

Put Donte in trades you cowards.

Donte ($3mm), DJ Wilson ($4.5mm) and Dj Augustin($6.6mm) for JJ Redick ($13mm), Sign Ersan and some other FA or buyout guard with the $1mm in salary flexibility we'd gain under the hard cap.

There, how's that?

I like the players you have going out, but let me fix the other part for you.

[skones]

Forbes is a dirt cheap flame thrower of a shooter. Those are a commodity in this league regardless of whether they do anything else well. If you're shooting 45% on volume from distance, you're elite company. That equals positive value.

Look at Forbes's splits, and the lineup data. He's killing them out there. I want to more optimistic that we can find 5-10 positive minutes for him, because yes, he's an elite three-point shooter, but he's been a negative so far this season. He can't defend worth a lick, and makes too many bad decisions on offense given what we're asking him to do. The amount of times he's dribbled out of a three into a pull up 18-footer is bewildering.

I don't need to look at the lineup data. I'm more than familiar with it. He costs 2.3 million dollars and will cost under 2.5 next year. That's it. Full stop. Elite shooter, 2.3 million. That's all you need to know to put him in the positive value category.