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POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs

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Grade The Trade

A
45
25%
B
91
51%
C
34
19%
D
6
3%
F
3
2%
 
Total votes: 179

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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#741 » by LUKE23 » Sat Mar 20, 2021 5:55 pm

ShootingtheJ wrote:The only thing we've really accomplished is we got under the tax, but the was goal #1 for Lasry.


This really isn't true. No matter how you view Tucker, he's clearly going to give us better defensive minutes than Augustin, and in many matchups, Lopez.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#742 » by ShootingtheJ » Sat Mar 20, 2021 6:06 pm

LUKE23 wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:The only thing we've really accomplished is we got under the tax, but the was goal #1 for Lasry.


This really isn't true. No matter how you view Tucker, he's clearly going to give us better defensive minutes than Augustin, and in many matchups, Lopez.


And sadly, he's actually way worse offensively. Tucker basically replaces Craig and Thanasis. This will increase Forbes role, and the Bucks tank when Forbes is on the floor. Much work to do yet.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#743 » by LUKE23 » Sat Mar 20, 2021 6:13 pm

ShootingtheJ wrote:And sadly, he's actually way worse offensively. Tucker basically replaces Craig and Thanasis. This will increase Forbes role, and the Bucks tank when Forbes is on the floor. Much work to do yet.


Nah, it really won't. It will increase DDV's minutes, which is a good thing.

Augustin played 19 minutes per game.

DDV is currently at 27 mpg, think he will bump up to 33-34. Tucker takes the other 12. In terms of Tucker getting another 12-13 minutes, that will come from a variety of lessening Pat/Portis/Lopez minutes, depending on the matchup.

This move in no way, shape, or form increases Forbes role. He's the designated bench gunner and is going to play sparingly based on game situations and/or matchups in the playoffs.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#744 » by engelmartin » Sat Mar 20, 2021 6:39 pm

Did we get a TPE from this deal? How's all that work? The thread is pretty long and I'm lazy
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#745 » by ShootingtheJ » Sat Mar 20, 2021 7:04 pm

LUKE23 wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:And sadly, he's actually way worse offensively. Tucker basically replaces Craig and Thanasis. This will increase Forbes role, and the Bucks tank when Forbes is on the floor. Much work to do yet.


Nah, it really won't. It will increase DDV's minutes, which is a good thing.

Augustin played 19 minutes per game.

DDV is currently at 27 mpg, think he will bump up to 33-34. Tucker takes the other 12. In terms of Tucker getting another 12-13 minutes, that will come from a variety of lessening Pat/Portis/Lopez minutes, depending on the matchup.

This move in no way, shape, or form increases Forbes role. He's the designated bench gunner and is going to play sparingly based on game situations and/or matchups in the playoffs.


I hope you're right, but all I see we did was sacrifice offense for defense. It's net neutral. Another deal needed.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#746 » by tski1972 » Sat Mar 20, 2021 7:06 pm

engelmartin wrote:Did we get a TPE from this deal? How's all that work? The thread is pretty long and I'm lazy


$4.8M TPE
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#747 » by ShootingtheJ » Sat Mar 20, 2021 7:09 pm

engelmartin wrote:Did we get a TPE from this deal? How's all that work? The thread is pretty long and I'm lazy


Yes, Horst snuck that in there by doing the trade as 2 separate deals. We can now absord a contract worth up to $4.88 million. However, the hard cap prevents us from using the hole thing now, but we retain the TPE for a full year.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#748 » by Prez » Sat Mar 20, 2021 7:11 pm

I’m literally just hoping he’s a great assistant coach/leader and gets our other guys sharper with switching given how awesome a communicator he is/was in Houston’s awesome switching defense, and hoping he holds guys accountable (*cough* Khris *cough*). If he actually provides any on court value himself that’s just a bonus for me.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#749 » by engelmartin » Sat Mar 20, 2021 7:41 pm

Does PJ give anyone else Scott Williams vibes?
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#750 » by raferfenix » Sat Mar 20, 2021 7:41 pm

Tucker is going to help us if only in short spurts in key moments.

He was a major contributor in the playoffs 6 months ago. And he does not have a serious injury history or a reliance on sheer athleticism.

For that matter I’m thinking less about whether we overpaid in the trade for PJ as opposed to if he can live up to the extension we are likely going to offer.

Part of why Tucker was so upset at the Rockets was their refusal to pay him what he felt he was worth. Bucks probably already indicated to his agent we’d make the most of his bird rights if he put us on top of his trade request list.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#751 » by coolhandluke121 » Sat Mar 20, 2021 8:53 pm

raferfenix wrote:
For that matter I’m thinking less about whether we overpaid in the trade for PJ as opposed to if he can live up to the extension we are likely going to offer.

Part of why Tucker was so upset at the Rockets was their refusal to pay him what he felt he was worth. Bucks probably already indicated to his agent we’d make the most of his bird rights if he put us on top of his trade request list.


I couldn't be less concerned about this. Nobody would have been stupid enough to pay PJ what he was asking for, and at this point nobody would even be stupid enough to offer anywhere near as much as Houston actually did offer. Nobody was stupid enough to give Houston anywhere near what they were asking for in the trade either, as this trade proves. He's almost certainly getting the vet min next year.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#752 » by LuessiT » Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:02 pm

coolhandluke121 wrote:
raferfenix wrote:
For that matter I’m thinking less about whether we overpaid in the trade for PJ as opposed to if he can live up to the extension we are likely going to offer.

Part of why Tucker was so upset at the Rockets was their refusal to pay him what he felt he was worth. Bucks probably already indicated to his agent we’d make the most of his bird rights if he put us on top of his trade request list.


I couldn't be less concerned about this. Nobody would have been stupid enough to pay PJ what he was asking for, and at this point nobody would even be stupid enough to offer anywhere near as much as Houston actually did offer. Nobody was stupid enough to give Houston anywhere near what they were asking for in the trade either, as this trade proves. He's almost certainly getting the vet min next year.


Pretty sure that not. I have him getting at least BAE money even if he flops here. And if he's reasonably successful he'll get MLE money.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#753 » by raferfenix » Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:08 pm

Tucker isn’t going back to Europe like Mirotic or retiring like Marvin or Pau.

Bucks pursued PJ for a while too.

No way either party is planning for this to be a few month partnership.

I don’t see much chance of a chemistry fissure. It’d have to fail pretty egregiously on the court for the Bucks to not match Tucker’s best offer in free agency.

The fact we can use bird rights to resign him is especially valuable to a team like ours that has such limited means to acquire outside talent.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#754 » by Siefer » Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:13 pm

ShootingtheJ wrote:
Siefer wrote:I said this earlier, but I think the floor of this deal is pretty high, even if Tucker is washed. Clearing DJA's contract, getting below the tax, and opening room to add a buyout guy or two is worth moving back 5-10 spots in the draft. If Tucker can give us 15-20 good minutes a night, this trade becomes very good.


We were going to have the option for a buyout guy either way. Now we'll do it but still stay with a 14 man roster, and we still haven't added a decent backup guard.

The only thing we've really accomplished is we got under the tax, but the was goal #1 for Lasry.


I'm concerned about the lack of a true backup PG as well, but I believe we've moved our buyout timeline up multiple weeks due to how prorated contracts work out.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#755 » by jakecronus8 » Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:27 pm

I love the trades but the more I look at it, it feels like there’s a follow up move to be made.

P.S. Thank god our billionaires got under the tax again. I wouldn’t be able to sleep at night knowing they had to pay it.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#756 » by LittleRooster » Sat Mar 20, 2021 10:01 pm

engelmartin wrote:Does PJ give anyone else Scott Williams vibes?

I hadn’t thought about that before, but I could see it. I hope so!


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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#757 » by ShootingtheJ » Sat Mar 20, 2021 10:48 pm

raferfenix wrote:Tucker isn’t going back to Europe like Mirotic or retiring like Marvin or Pau.

Bucks pursued PJ for a while too.

No way either party is planning for this to be a few month partnership.

I don’t see much chance of a chemistry fissure. It’d have to fail pretty egregiously on the court for the Bucks to not match Tucker’s best offer in free agency.

The fact we can use bird rights to resign him is especially valuable to a team like ours that has such limited means to acquire outside talent.


He was acquired as a means to get under the tax. He won't be here next year. Either we win it, and then we don't need the leadership, or we lose, because he wasn't good enough.

If other teams want to overpay him, let them.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#758 » by M-C-G » Sat Mar 20, 2021 10:57 pm

ShootingtheJ wrote:
raferfenix wrote:Tucker isn’t going back to Europe like Mirotic or retiring like Marvin or Pau.

Bucks pursued PJ for a while too.

No way either party is planning for this to be a few month partnership.

I don’t see much chance of a chemistry fissure. It’d have to fail pretty egregiously on the court for the Bucks to not match Tucker’s best offer in free agency.

The fact we can use bird rights to resign him is especially valuable to a team like ours that has such limited means to acquire outside talent.


He was acquired as a means to get under the tax. He won't be here next year. Either we win it, and then we don't need the leadership, or we lose, because he wasn't good enough.

If other teams want to overpay him, let them.


I don't know, I mean, I think that could be likely, but part of me thinks, hmm what if it ends up being a great fit, reinvigorates Tucker, fixes a massive hole in our defense AND he hits those corner threes come playoff time. If all that happens, well, maybe you do what it takes to bring him back. You seem to think that is a 0 in 10 chance, I think it is closer to 4 in 10.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#759 » by rilamann » Sat Mar 20, 2021 11:13 pm

engelmartin wrote:Does PJ give anyone else Scott Williams vibes?

He does to me, I was actually just saying this to someone yesterday. From a toughness and leadership prospetive, absolutely. Tucker brings the intangibles that this Bucks team desperately needs. And if his play on the court is rejuvinated, double bonus.
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Re: POLL ADDED: Bucks Deal Augustin, Wilson, 2 1sts for Own 22 1st, 21 2nd, PJ Tucker, Kurucs 

Post#760 » by EUROBUCK » Sat Mar 20, 2021 11:24 pm

I haven't seen him play but I'm afraid PJ may affect our motion in offense. Idk but he feels too stiff for an offense that needs to move and create space for giannis.

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