PG 7 - Bucks Fall

[Brewhoopfan]

I'm not gonna argue with anyone that suggests we need to upgrade the roster on the fringes/bench, or that Bud needs to cut out his more annoying tendencies like playing guys he "trusts" over younger guys that could have provided more defensive resistance. Both fair points.

There's some stuff to glean from this series but at the end of the day, it essentially just boils down to Grayson/Wes/Hill not being able to even remotely replicate Middleton's 20/5/5 type production. Be mad that the coaching staff couldn't X's and O's away their lack of half-court shot creation if you want, but the personnel equivalent of turning water into wine is a pretty tall order for any team.

But it was almost enough. One tactical change might have been the difference (e.g. not letting useless Hill awaken Tatum, who was starting to make vacation plans).

why are you not giving any credit to all the tactical moves we did make that kept us in this series?

in the games we won celtics fans were freaking for how many "3's they were settling for"

every single guy besides horford was on the hot seat with boston fans over the course of this series and every time we had the lead the media, the fans, ime.... everybody wasnt suggesting they just need to shoot more 3's. IT WAS THE EXACT OPPOSITE!!!!!!!!

the entire discussion shouldnt be on the 3's they hit eventually at an expected rate. it should be on the fact we never had a single game, not one, where any of our guys outside of pat and giannis played even to their norm let alone above it offensively

tactically.... bud was picasso by giving us the lead 3 times in this series on the back of one amazing but horribly inefficient player in giannis. it was literally a defensive clinic we ran on them

That defensive tactic was called hope. As in, we're going to leave them open and hope they miss. It did work three times, and considering the personnel, it may have been the best strategy available. Probably not a title contending strategy, however.

The Celtics changed defensive philosophy after game 1 to limit Giannis's role as a facilitator. They stayed home, and in general, Giannis wasn't an efficient enough scorer to punish them and Jrue was abysmal. There was no plan B. I don't necessarily think it would have mattered as the Celts D was great and the Bucks talent on offense was dismal with the Middleton injury.

[BroncoBuck]

Tatum goes off like the other night, you tip your cap. Allowing garbage Grant Williams to shoot 18 completely wide open 3’s, you wonder what the hell is going on with defensive assignments.

Grant Williams was 2/14 from 3 the previous 4 games. He was in a massive slump and was able to shoot himself out of it.

Thanks to the numerous practice shots we graciously provided him.

He missed those same shots the previous games. The Bucks let White shoot all he wanted as well and his weren’t falling and he eventually stopped shooting the ball entirely (he had a wide open corner 3 and decided to drive on Brook instead at one point yesterday).

The Bucks concentrated on Tatum after what happened in game 6, in turn Grant Williams/PP finally hit the shots they had been missing all series.

If you’re an underdog playing a man down, (which the Bucks were) these are the types of gambles you have to make. You can’t let the superstars beat you. The Celtics essentially had the same gameplan, the difference was the Bucks couldn’t hit their shots.

[DrWood]

lots of really bad takes since the loss.

Which ones?

If you have to ask, it might include you.

[DingleJerry]

It's tough not to ask the question though of why, with some really good defenders like Giannis/Jrue out there almost the whole game, why we have such scrambling going on which leads to literally uncovered guys over and over. This does not seem to be a 'thing' for most teams yet we're having it over and over in spite of elite defenders like Giannis/Jrue out there. Have to think we're overdoing the helping/doubling/hedging on ball screens in some way

I mean just think of it this simply, we have a guy in Giannis that needs 2-3 defenders focused on him yet our other guys aren't literally uncovered.

[12 Point Buck]

Boys were tired from the whack Pandemic Schedule over the last 2+ yrs.. And Bud is just an AVG coach At Best. Nice for the team to get home with their loved ones and Get some real rest B4 running it back for another Ring.

[FrieAaron]

It's tough not to ask the question though of why, with some really good defenders like Giannis/Jrue, out there almost the whole game why we have such scrambling going on which leads to literally uncovered guys over and over. This does not seem to be a 'thing' for most teams yet we're having it over and over in spite of elite defenders like Giannis/Jrue out there. Have to think we're overdoing the helping/doubling/hedging on ball screens in some way

I mean just think of it this simply, we have a guy in Giannis that needs 2-3 defenders focused on him yet our other guys aren't literally uncovered.

Because it rated as #1 DEF RTG in the playoffs in 18-19, #4 in 19-20, #1 in 20-21, and even though our season is over is still #1 so far in 21-22.

[DingleJerry]

It's tough not to ask the question though of why, with some really good defenders like Giannis/Jrue, out there almost the whole game why we have such scrambling going on which leads to literally uncovered guys over and over. This does not seem to be a 'thing' for most teams yet we're having it over and over in spite of elite defenders like Giannis/Jrue out there. Have to think we're overdoing the helping/doubling/hedging on ball screens in some way

I mean just think of it this simply, we have a guy in Giannis that needs 2-3 defenders focused on him yet our other guys aren't literally uncovered.

Because it rated as #1 DEF RTG in the playoffs in 18-19, #4 in 19-20, #1 in 20-21, and even though our season is over is still #1 so far in 21-22.

I don't deny that. But again, we have likely the best G/perimeter defender (Bledsoe was right there too before) and the best overall defender in the league. You're going to get good results but it doesn't mean it can't be tweaked on the margins. If you watch the rest of the league, there is simply not guys left completely ignored and undefended as often as we do. My theory would be you'd still get much of the same results on the interior/rim/paint which is the emphasis even if you reduced mass helping on it that leads to the wide open guys. It's quite often a an extra guy is hanging around the handler/screen action that doesn't need to be. It happens quite a bit where you think why did you go running in there when you weren't needed, bing bang boom 2 passes later its a completely ignored/undefended player.

But to me the biggest thing is for sure the O/shooting, I'm all on board there. But it is quite out of the ordinary to completely ignore guys on D.

[th87]

I'm not gonna argue with anyone that suggests we need to upgrade the roster on the fringes/bench, or that Bud needs to cut out his more annoying tendencies like playing guys he "trusts" over younger guys that could have provided more defensive resistance. Both fair points.

There's some stuff to glean from this series but at the end of the day, it essentially just boils down to Grayson/Wes/Hill not being able to even remotely replicate Middleton's 20/5/5 type production. Be mad that the coaching staff couldn't X's and O's away their lack of half-court shot creation if you want, but the personnel equivalent of turning water into wine is a pretty tall order for any team.

But it was almost enough. One tactical change might have been the difference (e.g. not letting useless Hill awaken Tatum, who was starting to make vacation plans).

why are you not giving any credit to all the tactical moves we did make that kept us in this series?

in the games we won celtics fans were freaking for how many "3's they were settling for"

every single guy besides horford was on the hot seat with boston fans over the course of this series and every time we had the lead the media, the fans, ime.... everybody wasnt suggesting they just need to shoot more 3's. IT WAS THE EXACT OPPOSITE!!!!!!!!

the entire discussion shouldnt be on the 3's they hit eventually at an expected rate. it should be on the fact we never had a single game, not one, where any of our guys outside of pat and giannis played even to their norm let alone above it offensviely

tactically.... bud was picasso by giving us the lead 3 times in this series on the back of one amazing but horribly inefficient player in giannis. it was literally a defensive clinic we ran on them

What tactical moves were those? There was little departure from what we always do - play drop coverage, and on offense, let Giannis (and Jrue) bash into the wall and figure out what to do. Might work for a bit (we have Giannis after all) until good teams adjust and get comfortable open 3 pointers.

But still, to be fair, it almost worked. But it itself was fully sabotaged by playing Hill, who blew up the integrity of the drop by giving up easy shots to Tatum. If we leave him out, it's possible we take G4, and then have 3 more games to allow Boston to go cold and take the series.

I have to ask - why do you think they didn't play Carter at all? I get that he's undersized, but there is no way to know how he'd hold up unless he was out there. And when he was for G1, he did well. He couldn't be given 5 more minutes?

[yannisk]

Bud is an above average/good coach but we need a great coach. There is not enough talent on this team and it will be difficult to upgrade the roster, our roster will be probably worse next year with key guys on the declining side of their career. Maybe upgrading the coaching stuff with some new assistants to bring some new ideas would be enough but I think we need to roll the dice to try to find our own Nurse/Udoca/Spoelsta with the danger a change brings.

[blazza18]

Read on Twitter

It sucks he wore down and by the end it didn't matter but Giannis pulling this shot out of nowhere is the most Giannis thing ever.

We see glimpses of Giannis with touch every few games. It's gotta be so frustrating for him that he can't quite put it all together.

I kind of went numb at some point during the game and didn't notice if they did anything to take away his short roll? Felt like we were getting solid shots on those Jrue/Giannis PnRs and probably should have been spamming them if Boston didn't adjust.

Boston started to switch Brown on the play. He forced a turnover on Giannis and I don't think we went back to it.

[blazza18]

We're having the same Bud arguments again. His and the teams warts really come out when we lose.

[emunney]

If you were to rank all the players in that series, how long would it be before you got to the 3rd best Buck? Bud is not and was not perfect but losing this series can't be put on him.

I don't know if we'd have won with Khris. It's unknowable. But without Khris, we were far more competitive than I thought we could be. That's a testament to the preparation of the team, and the head coach has a huge hand in that.

[FrieAaron]

If you were to rank all the players in that series, how long would it be before you got to the 3rd best Buck? Bud is not and was not perfect but losing this series can't be put on him.

I don't know if we'd have won with Khris. It's unknowable. But without Khris, we were far more competitive than I thought we could be. That's a testament to the preparation of the team, and the head coach has a huge hand in that.

I had this exact same thought earlier. It's probably Pat, right? And when does he crack the list? I feel like 8th at best but I haven't actually gone through each player one by one.

[machu46]

If you were to rank all the players in that series, how long would it be before you got to the 3rd best Buck? Bud is not and was not perfect but losing this series can't be put on him.

I don't know if we'd have won with Khris. It's unknowable. But without Khris, we were far more competitive than I thought we could be. That's a testament to the preparation of the team, and the head coach has a huge hand in that.

Or put another way, Boston’s 3-5 are Horford, Smart, and Grant. Ours were Pat, Wes, and one of the big men?

I truly can’t believe we took them to 7, especially considering how horrific all of our players were on the offensive end.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[blazza18]

There's a lot to be unhappy about in regards to Bud's coaching style but that you could argue Jrue wasn't even a top 5 player in the series means there should probably be some leeway on how much criticism goes his way.

[greekbuck34]

Bobby Portis and Grayson Allen were two of our best shooters coming in this series and they shot worse than Giannis in less attempts than him in this series.

It was a miracle we went to 7 games with this kind of shooting and without Middleton.

[emunney]

There's a lot to be unhappy about in regards to Bud's coaching style but that you could argue Jrue wasn't even a top 5 player in the series means there should probably be some leeway on how much criticism goes his way.

At the same time I think it's very possible we win the series if Carter gets Hill's minutes, so I understand the criticism. But just because one mistake could have swung the series doesn't mean the person who made that mistake is solely to blame. Many things could have swung the series.

[Pachinko_]

After a night sleeping on it


I still hate the whiny bitchy baby floppers. Call me bitter...I am. They are shameful.

Yeah it is
To me it's equally frustrating to watch Giannis travel and palm the ball, I mean I cringe every time. And I know he does it on purpose to take full advantage of the NBA (lack of) rules, because as soon as he sets foot on European floors for the National Team he instantly becomes Mr fundamentals again. Players will always push the envelope as far as the system allows them... I've just accepted that the NBA is a bit of basketball and a bit of travelling circus and I enjoy it better like that. Otherwise it could drive me mad.

FIBA final 4 starts in a couple of days, The Battle of Titans (Mirotic Vs Exum). Pitiful star power but it will set my real basketball compass straight again.

[ExpatPack]

Pat Connaughton was one of the few bright spots off the bench. I hope they keep him but rumor is he's going to test the market.

Hill/Allen good riddance.

[paulpressey25]

Many things could have swung the series.

Agree 100%

Ask Philly, or heck, even ask Boston if they thought Al Horford had games 3 and 4 still in him. If he either plays to norm, or one of Grayson, Bobby or Jrue step up with better shooting, Bucks win that series.

Heck, TImelord's injury turned out to be a blessing for them. Who knew?