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The Bucks' last four victories have now come when either Redd or Mo didn't play. Overall, the Bucks are now 4-2 this season when either Redd or Mo are out. They are 3-1 without Redd and 1-1 without Mo.

Of the victories, only one - tonight's game - came against a team that was .500 or better going into the game.

Small sample size obviously but is it worth discussing?

Yes. Trade Redd, build around Bogut = Eastern Conference Contenders

I think they need to be split up, but I wouldn't move both because I like having a dynamic scorer who can also shoot the ball at the guard spot. I still move Redd because he's older, is costing us more, and we can get more for him. I think we still have enough scoring there with Mo/Bogut/whatever we get for Redd and then Yi + our draft pick (which will be in the 8-13 range most likely).

I move Redd, keep Mo. If we want to draft another PG like Collison in the draft that is fine, and we can have Bell backup the 2 spot.

Hate to pat myself on the back ...but I have said this for the past 1.5 years...when TJ was dealt. Hell, if Jeff Van Gundy had hair and was 1000 times better looking he could have been me, he said everything I have said before

It's clear that Mo and Redd are a poor fit together in the back court. That really can't be disputed.

Here's my deal.

1. This team is going nowhere with Redd as a #1. Anyone who has watched the last 5 years will not dispute this.

2. This team cannot afford to pay a guy who is not a #1 15-18 million. Shelling out max dollars for a designated second scorer in Milwaukee is insane.

3. Mo can be a marginally worse second scorer while bringing PG skills, leadership qualities, chemistry with Bogut, no alpha dog mentality, etc...

4. Mo makes about 1/2 of Redd and is several years younger.



Redd needs to go.

LUKE23 wrote:I think they need to be split up, but I wouldn't move both because I like having a dynamic scorer who can also shoot the ball at the guard spot. I still move Redd because he's older, is costing us more, and we can get more for him. I think we still have enough scoring there with Mo/Bogut/whatever we get for Redd and then Yi + our draft pick (which will be in the 8-13 range most likely).

I move Redd, keep Mo. If we want to draft another PG like Collison in the draft that is fine, and we can have Bell backup the 2 spot.

Agree with everything said.

I dislike the backcourt for defensive purposes.

If Mo can show that he can even become an AVERAGE defender at the PG spot, I deal Redd and don't look back.

Otherwise I just don't know what to do.

There's no way to know if this trend will continue. We don't know if Mo or Redd will miss any more time. But for the sake of dicussion, if we are going to use six games and draw definitive conclusions from them I think what these six games would show us is that either Redd or Mo could be dealt. The Bucks' only win against a playoff-caliber team came without Mo. The Bucks had a nice winning streak without Redd.

Of course, something else to keep in mind is two games against playoff-caliber teams without either Mo or Redd resulted in humiliating defeats. The Pistons embarrassed the Bucks badly without Mo and the Wizards demolished the Bucks without Redd.

So while the Bucks are 4-2 without Redd or Mo, they are also 1-2 against teams with .500 records or better when one of them sits. So it may not be as cut and dried as it first appears.

Again, I'm not sure six games is enough to draw definitive conclusions (and I say that having been on record for some time that a Mo-Redd backcourt was not a smart move), but this could be an indication that either one could be traded. And if that's the case, that expands the possibilities the team will have to try and make a move for improvement.

I don't think that we need to get a great player for Redd either. We just need the right player. I'll keep pushing that if we add Ronnie Brewer and Paul Milsap for Redd, we'd be an improved team.

REDDzone wrote:I dislike the frontcourt for defensive purposes.

If Mo can show that he can even become an AVERAGE defender at the PG spot, I deal Redd and don't look back.

Otherwise I just don't know what to do.

On the contrary, I think the opposite of our defense in the frontcourt. Yi is already great at bothering shots, getting out on screens, etc, and Bogut can block shots/take charges. I could see them averaging 4 bpg very soon combined.

Like I said in the post-game thread, if we think Bogut/Yi are the future of this team, a major criteria for deciding who to keep should be who plays better/has better chemistry with those two.

IMO its Mo but its been hard to draw any conclusions since the offense has genrally been centered around Mo and Redd... if Bogut keeps playing at this level it will be easier to see who adjusts better between Mo and Redd to not being the primary scorers on the team.

You watch a game like tonight and see our defense and you think maybe Mo is the bigger problem between the two.....

Maybe it was me, but it seemed like our front line was able to stay home and defend and rebound a lot better because they weren't having to go out to the perimeter to make up for Mo's mess out there.

Mo for Marvin Williams......make do with Ivey and Bell at PG.

LUKE23 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



On the contrary, I think the opposite of our defense in the frontcourt. Yi is already great at bothering shots, getting out on screens, etc, and Bogut can block shots/take charges. I could see them averaging 4 bpg very soon combined.

Sorry Luke I meant backcourt. I'll change that.

midranger wrote:I don't think that we need to get a great player for Redd either. We just need the right player. I'll keep pushing that if we add Ronnie Brewer and Paul Milsap for Redd, we'd be an improved team.

I'd be happy with a Redd for Brewer/Milsap/filler trade.

paulpressey25 wrote:Mo for Marvin Williams......make do with Ivey and Bell at PG.

I'd make that deal without hesitation. Williams may never be a great player but he's looking like he could develop into at least a solid one. And he'd be a major upgrade at SF. I've heard rumblings the Hawks might be thinking about trying to acquire a PG (Andre Miller is the name who keeps coming up). The Hawks had zero interest in Mo in the summer and they may not want him now but it wouldn't hurt to float his name to them and see what they think.

paulpressey25 wrote:Mo for Marvin Williams......make do with Ivey and Bell at PG.

I like Mo but I'd certainly do that deal. Odds of us making the playoffs are slim and we could pick up a PG in the draft with our lottery pick.

Tough to talk about which to trade not knowing what their respective trade values are.

paulpressey25 wrote:You watch a game like tonight and see our defense and you think maybe Mo is the bigger problem between the two.....

Maybe it was me, but it seemed like our front line was able to stay home and defend and rebound a lot better because they weren't having to go out to the perimeter to make up for Mo's mess out there.

Mo for Marvin Williams......make do with Ivey and Bell at PG.

Agreed, like I said in the post game thread, It's no coincidence that are team went to the playoff's both year's TJ was healthy. TJ was a pass first PG who always got everyone else involved and consistenly penatrated, (Which got our bigs, Smith & Skinner & Bogut & Maglorie alot of easy dunks) also which this team severly lacks, Plus he played better defense then Mo'. Opposing PG's never killed us or penatrated our defense as much when TJ played and he was an average defender at best.

I agree that we should trade Mo' to Atlanta for either Marvin Williams, Josh Smith or Josh Childress, and make due with Ivey & Bell until Sessions is ready to take over next year.

Mo/Gadz for Marvin/Claxton

Claxton's deal is terrible given his lack of talent but it ends sooner than Gadz's and gives the Bucks at least another body at PG if they need one.

paulpressey25 wrote:Mo for Marvin Williams......make do with Ivey and Bell at PG.

europa wrote:Mo/Gadz for Marvin/Claxton

Claxton's deal is terrible given his lack of talent but it ends sooner than Gadz's and gives the Bucks at least another body at PG if they need one.

I believe Claxton is out for the year.