Vecsey: Plenty Of Interest In Redd But He Won't Be Traded

[steger_3434]

I believe Hammond is smart enough to know that this city is not going to lure any big time free agent

Hammond is also smart enough to know that cap space isn't just about free agents. He found that out first hand this offseason when he tried to get Camby, but didn't have the cap space to absorb his salary.

That is true to a certain extent, but Camby is a piece that puts you over the top, not piece to build around, this team is not close to being put over the top, especially if you give away Redd or RJ. Do you think this team, minus any guards who can score would do anything? I would love the frontcourt of Bogut and Camby but there would be no one else on the perimeter......I am not much of a fan of Redd or RJ, but Hammond views them as valuable chips and won't give them away for crap, that makes no sense just because you don't see there value.

What value does RJ have? We all laughed at NJ for taking a PF that is old and most here call a bust and a guy without legs. Meanwhile the wiretap says teams are offering garbage for Redd. Maybe these guys just don't have any value.

EDIT: Besides, since we like to pimp Hammond as a good GM, Rod Thorn in NJ has proven he is a very good GM. Here's a guy that fleeced PHO for Kidd, got rid of KMart at the perfect time, fleeced Dallas for Harris and now has traded RJ. All the while his teams for the most part have been very very good. What would lead anyone to think he didn't fleece us with the RJ trade?

[midranger]

I hate to break it to people, but he did.

[EastSideBucksFan]

Hammond knows that Redd is not an attractive trading chip right now because of what is left on his contract. In my opinion, Redd's value, as long as his play doesn't completely fall off the cliff or he has a career changing injury, is only going to increase as his contract grows shorter.

So, when teams have more of a chance to move things around in the offseason and they can make a 2 year acquisition of Redd, he will be able to bring back a better package than the Redd with 3 years left.

Teams are lowballing Hammond because of the length of Redds deal and maybe cause everyone around the league knows he could be had. We're going for the playoffs this year, Hammond and Skiles aren't going to ship him out for draft picks and expiring contracts or marginal young players. If we move him, its because we think we're getting a guy who can come in and make more of an impact than Redd can right now.

Not to mention I think the Sessions/JA for Conley deal that was floating around kind of made Hammond look a little stupid to other GM's. First not only does he make a mistake in drafting, but then he's going to make him a throw in on a trade that does not acquire an impact player that could contribute right away. I mean, I can understand the upside for Conley, but this is a very shaky trade. It could really go either way as far as us completely blowin it by bringing in a guy who has looked like a very disappointing lottery pick (Conley) by giving away a guy who looks like a very disappointing lottery pick, at this point at least.

I'm fine with Kohl nixing the deal. I mean, Hammond comes into Kohls office and tells him that he blew it on the draft pick and now he wants to give the guy away. Kohl says, hang on just a second, if you blew it before with the pick, why should I trust you to fix it with a trade and especially this trade. He's making him hold on before we blow our wad before the deadline. Wait until you see everything that is really on the table before making a decision. If we're really going to acquire some help for this year and I am positive that is the plan as we are a 7th seed right now, then we are going to need Sessions and JA as chips around the deadline when there will surely be plenty of movement.

[EastSideBucksFan]

I hate to break it to people, but he did.

I know RJ hasn't blown everyone away yet, but I think his true value will come thru if/when we make the playoffs. The guy has more playoff experience than our whole team practically except for maybe Lue or Elson.

I don't think you can say he fleeced us. What does Rod Thorn have to show right now for himself? Yi is a 25 year old soft PF who has already made overtures he would like to be traded to the Bay Area and his ceiling is a very marginal starter who will always have so many headaches with his trade demands, age issues and playing for China that he is really more of a headache than hes really worth. Then there's Bobby Simmons who Thorn is already trying to move. Maybe he gets Larry Hughes for him, who doesn't end up being anywhere for too long cause the guy is a locker room cancer and not even a big time contributor anymore.

For all his faults and shortcomings for what people thought RJ was going to be when he got here, he's still a helluva lot more valuable than YI and Bobby Simmons. And theres no way I would take that trade back if given the chance. RJ has helped to change the attitude here and thats just not something that shows up in box scores.

[TheMachine]

[What does our team do better when RJ is playing?

RJ's numbers during those games Redd was out were better. Ppg, shooting percentage, etc. Redd and RJ haven't yet complimented each other.

Just like the Redd-ites feel trading Redd means we are giving up on this year, I think trading RJ is giving up on this year. Send RJ out only if Redd is going as well.

I'm willing to take the heat CBQ did regarding CV, I'm ready to trade Redd for "Cash" because the salary cap space we get is ridiculously meaningful versus the inconsequential $3.5mm we pick up by dumping CV. Think about it, if we got nothing back for Redd, we've freed up $35 million of future salary that can be used elsewhere.

At least RJ is somebody new to watch who seems to show intensity out there, shows leadership and has a much more well rounded all-around game. I think he fits Skiles system better. I just don't see the world falling apart without Redd. And let's say you did get back a Martell Webster in the deal. Outstanding.

I agree with you PP on this. I do not see RJ being traded before Redd. RJ was brought in as a veteran leader where Redd has failed miserably in the past. I am not a big RJ fan, but if only one could stay, I would definitely rather have RJ stay over Redd. Statistically RJ is a better 3 pt % shooter than Redd, as RJ shoots 40% and Redd shoots 37%. RJ is a better rebound with a 5 to 3 rebound advantage over Redd. He is also a better defender and more athletic than Redd. As I mentioned, he does provide some veteran leadership that Redd has not. RJ has also played a major role on winning teams. Redd has never won.

To get rid of RJ and keep Redd would be reverting back to the old Bucks. Redd's era with the Bucks has been synonymous with a losing, selfish, soft, no defense, and overpaid culture.

I believe that Skiles and Hammond are trying to change the the Bucks culture to one of winning, defense, team oriented, tough, getting down on the floor, diving for loose balls, and at least coming close to earning your salary. Mike Redd does none of these things. RJ at least provides these things to some degree.

That being said, I don't believe that Redd or RJ will be traded this season. There are no takers for Redd (think about it, what GM that wants to keep his job would pay 51 mill for a 37% 3 pt s hooter who does nothing else at least average?) I don't even think the Bucks could even get back expirings for Redd. I am sure that Hammond is trying though.

[europa]

EDIT: Besides, since we like to pimp Hammond as a good GM, Rod Thorn in NJ has proven he is a very good GM. Here's a guy that fleeced PHO for Kidd, got rid of KMart at the perfect time, fleeced Dallas for Harris and now has traded RJ. All the while his teams for the most part have been very very good. What would lead anyone to think he didn't fleece us with the RJ trade?

I've seen Yi and Simmons play this season. I'd much rather have RJ even though he hasn't played as well as he's capable.

[raferfenix]

I think it's interesting the teams "deep dish" specifically listed as interested in Redd (but not offering enough...yet): Spurs, Mavs, Blazers.

We've talked about Blazers and Mavs deals ad naseum. If This report is right that means that Europa would be vindicated in that our team is actively REJECTING a cap space related trade in which we'd get back at least one of their young guys probably. The Mavs deal would presumably also offer cap space in the form of Jerry Stackhouse, but I'm unsure if Jason Terry or Josh Howard would be involved (it'd be dramatically harder to reject a deal with Howard I think).

The Spurs, however, are seldom mentioned on this board as a destination for Redd. They never take on big salary guys, but their team is aging poorly and maybe they think he'd be such a good fit that htey'd risk it? Anyways, a deal including Bruce Bowen and Kurt Thomas and change could work financially, but I'm not sure we do that despite how much better it'd make our defense since those guys are on their last legs and then some. In a perfect world we'd be able to snag Ginobili somehow, but I'm not sure it's worth daring to dream on that front.

[xTitan]

No team in contention is going to offer anything of value, that would make no sense. That is why Redd will be dealt in this offseason most likely.

[europa]

No team in contention is going to offer anything of value, that would make no sense. That is why Redd will be dealt in this offseason most likely.

It makes sense for the Bucks too. Redd can help the Bucks get to the playoffs this season which is critical in terms of improvement. Then in the offseason, Hammond can continue molding the team the way he wants, using Redd as trade bait.

[raferfenix]

No team in contention is going to offer anything of value, that would make no sense. That is why Redd will be dealt in this offseason most likely.

It makes sense for the Bucks too. Redd can help the Bucks get to the playoffs this season which is critical in terms of improvement. Then in the offseason, Hammond can continue molding the team the way he wants, using Redd as trade bait.

Do you think it is impossible that Hammond/Skiles think energetic young players and/or defensive minded role players would help us win more this season (and beyond) than Redd?

There are of course deals you've said you'd do that follow this qualification, but I think you overrate some the return we'd need to make our team better.

[Max Green]

All things considered, i'd rather have RJ on this team then Yi and Bobby this year.

[xTitan]

Do you think it is impossible that Hammond/Skiles think energetic young players and/or defensive minded role players would help us win more this season (and beyond) than Redd?

There are of course deals you've said you'd do that follow this qualification, but I think you overrate some the return we'd need to make our team better.

My question is how many energetic young teams usually win anything? Portland is a good young team but most young teams are pretty poor..............I am not opposed to dealing Redd but I have not heard of any deals that seem decent at this point.

[europa]

No team in contention is going to offer anything of value, that would make no sense. That is why Redd will be dealt in this offseason most likely.

It makes sense for the Bucks too. Redd can help the Bucks get to the playoffs this season which is critical in terms of improvement. Then in the offseason, Hammond can continue molding the team the way he wants, using Redd as trade bait.

Do you think it is impossible that Hammond/Skiles think energetic young players and/or defensive minded role players would help us win more this season (and beyond) than Redd?

There are of course deals you've said you'd do that follow this qualification, but I think you overrate some the return we'd need to make our team better.

I don't think I am. I think it boils down to my belief that Redd's value is probably greater to the Bucks at the present time than it is to another team. So that, combined with his contract, makes bringing back equal or close to equal value difficult.

[steger_3434]

All things considered, i'd rather have RJ on this team then Yi and Bobby this year.

However, next year would you rather have RJ or Yi, CV, and Sessions?

I quick look would certify this, but I'm to lazy. The above is assuming Simmons is an expiring. If not I stand corrected.

[xTitan]

All things considered, i'd rather have RJ on this team then Yi and Bobby this year.

However, next year would you rather have RJ or Yi, CV, and Sessions?

I quick look would certify this, but I'm to lazy. The above is assuming Simmons is an expiring. If not I stand corrected.

don't want YI at all, have no desire to pay CV any kind of big money, that will just be another bad contract everyone will bitch about....but I would like to keep Ramon.

[El Duderino]

I don't really care much if Hammond trades either or both of Redd/RJ in the offseason or before the deadline just so as we aren't back next year with 32 million dollars tied yet again into a pair of nothing special wings that won't lead this franchise anywhere simply because they just aren't good enough to do so.

I can't wait for the day when the Bucks franchise isn't being held hostage by multiple bad contracts that limit any real flexibility, even if that means some struggling. Many things have contributed to the Bucks either sucking or being mediocre at best for awhile now, but right at the top of the list is handing out or trading for so many overpaid players that thus boxed in the franchise.

[europa]

All things considered, i'd rather have RJ on this team then Yi and Bobby this year.

However, next year would you rather have RJ or Yi, CV, and Sessions?

I quick look would certify this, but I'm to lazy. The above is assuming Simmons is an expiring. If not I stand corrected.

don't want YI at all, have no desire to pay CV any kind of big money, that will just be another bad contract everyone will bitch about....but I would like to keep Ramon.

That's where I'm at too.

[raferfenix]

I don't think I am. I think it boils down to my belief that Redd's value is probably greater to the Bucks at the present time than it is to another team. So that, combined with his contract, makes bringing back equal or close to equal value difficult.

See, I think you may be underrating Hammond here. Or I'm just being far too confident in him (especially due to the Moute pick), but I think he'll pull off a deal where we improve our athleticism and defense for Redd.

Redd's pure ability to score is only so dramatically important because our team almost never gets fast break points and our defense is still not that great (although it is much improved). Redd doesn't even score well in the 4th quarter, and I just think there are more valuable components to the game for our team, as other players would pick up at least some of the offensive slack in addition to this too.

[europa]

I don't think I am. I think it boils down to my belief that Redd's value is probably greater to the Bucks at the present time than it is to another team. So that, combined with his contract, makes bringing back equal or close to equal value difficult.

See, I think you may be underrating Hammond here. Or I'm just being far too confident in him (especially due to the Moute pick), but I think he'll pull off a deal where we improve our athleticism and defense for Redd.

I think when he trades Redd it will be a move that improves the team. His trades have worked out terrific for the team so far in my opinion.

[AussieBuck]

If Hammond is any good at all as a GM trading Redd for expirings lets him have 17 million a year to improve the team. Too easy.