47% / 37% / 77%

[jeremyd236]

If you play serious fantasy basketball, you may know these marks as targets for FG%, 3pt%, and FT% respectively. If you hit those standards, for the most part you can expect to be in the mix for those categories.

Why do I bring this up? Well, after a (very) slow shooting start to the season, CV has been raising his FG% rapidly. He's now averaging...

FG - 46.0%
3pt - 37.9%
FT - 86.5%

...on the year.

Compare those percentages to a certain "elite scorer" and "pure shooter" on this team making 17 million dollars per year...

FG - 45.5%
3pt - 36.7%
FT - 81.4%

The point is, we need to be looking at CV as an efficient and versatile offensive weapon. He's every bit the scorer Redd is. If we can lock him up at a fair or below market deal, we have to do it. The only thing we can't do is overpay him by 6 million dollars per year like we did with Redd.

It'd be interesting if you used Redd's post-injury numbers.

[paul]

What I find interesting is that there's a guy on our team who most are desperate to trade for an expiring or a bag of sand who's putting up 17.5ppg on 43% / 40% / 78% while actually playing some defense. Perception around here is a very interesting thing.

It has nothing to do with perception and all to do with "cash"

I'd agree with that if I didn't read "It's amazing how much of a bum RJ is" 6 times a game thread.

[midranger]

It's about money and expectation.

CV is cheap on on the uptick of his career. RJ is very expensive and can't really be classified as anything but a disappointment thus far.

If CV gets a near max deal and his play stagnates, we'd all hate on him next year.

[paul]

It's about money and expectation.

CV is cheap on on the uptick of his career. RJ is very expensive and can't really be classified as anything but a disappointment thus far.

If CV gets a near max deal and his play stagnates, we'd all hate on him next year.

Yeah I know and I agree, it's just interesting how the perception of players change depending on whether they are on a rookie contract or not.

It's a side note but I posted somewhere else that RJ's last 5 games are something like 21.5/5/3 on 50% / 50%, those are outstanding numbers. It could be a mirage but I feel like he's getting his game back after a slow start and could be very good for us. Again I may be wrong but I think we'll regret trading him for an expiring if that's what we end up doing.

[AussieBuck]

What I find interesting is that there's a guy on our team who most are desperate to trade for an expiring or a bag of sand who's putting up 17.5ppg on 43% / 40% / 78% while actually playing some defense. Perception around here is a very interesting thing.

It has nothing to do with perception and all to do with "cash"

I'd agree with that if I didn't read "It's amazing how much of a bum RJ is" 6 times a game thread.

If CV was on $14 mil right now we would've all been roasting him for getting lit up by Scola/Landry. Although I do agree with you that some of the RJ hate gets out of hand.

[El Duderino]

What I find interesting is that there's a guy on our team who most are desperate to trade for an expiring or a bag of sand who's putting up 17.5ppg on 43% / 40% / 78% while actually playing some defense. Perception around here is a very interesting thing.

It has nothing to do with perception and all to do with "cash"

I'd agree with that if I didn't read "It's amazing how much of a bum RJ is" 6 times a game thread.

That also has to do with cash

Nobody is going to get overly pissed off when say Elson plays poorly, he's making pocket change. What frustrates most fans i think is we are paying guys like Redd and now Jefferson star money or close to star money and to often ge`t overall production worth much less than their paychecks.

That goes on in any sport. When say a very highly paid baseball player on your team is is hitting decently, but nothing special, he'll always get more flack from fans than the guy hitting roughly the same, but who makes way less money.

The Bucks for to long have largely handcuffed themselves from improving a lot because of their roster having to many overpaid players, Jefferson was just another frustrating addition to that trend.

[paulpressey25]

Again I may be wrong but I think we'll regret trading him for an expiring if that's what we end up doing.

Yeah, from a basketball standpoint I really don't want to trade RJ right now at all. He fills a really nice role for us. And I think trading him would set this team back.

The problem is what you do about the money. The Bucks put themselves in this mess with their salary. They never anticipated that their young guys who Larry Harris brought in would actually blossom and blow up with good coaching. If RJ were to go down tomorrow night with a torn ACL, this team is even more screwed financially. That's why unfortunately he's the logical one to go.

[BDUB_30]

If CV gets a near max deal and his play stagnates, we'd all hate on him next year.

thats not accurate at all .


we hated on gadzuric and hes not on a max deal in fact were advocating given cv a similar deal.. maybe less years but i read simliar money per year and even more .


we hate on bell all the time for his play and last year we REALLY got on him ..bell makes 4 mil per if im not mistaken .


bobby simmons , no max deal ...injuried and target of massive hate .

the bottom line is its not just all about money setting the standard of what the expectations are . we all have our natural expectations of how these players should perform , we see the potential , we all have certain expectations for these guys thats not solely defined by money and the notion that its only max salary players that receive critism .


you guys have already started saying bogut is a disapointment and overpaid , and hammond dropped the ball with the contract ...


mo williams was deamonized for the deal he signed , turns out its pretty fair contract now .



could you be any more inaccurate? i think some of you just make this crap up as you go along .

[GrandAdmiralDan]

What I find interesting is that there's a guy on our team who most are desperate to trade for an expiring or a bag of sand who's putting up 17.5ppg on 43% / 40% / 78% while actually playing some defense. Perception around here is a very interesting thing.

It has nothing to do with perception and all to do with

I like that picture

[paul]

Again I may be wrong but I think we'll regret trading him for an expiring if that's what we end up doing.

Yeah, from a basketball standpoint I really don't want to trade RJ right now at all. He fills a really nice role for us. And I think trading him would set this team back.

The problem is what you do about the money. The Bucks put themselves in this mess with their salary. They never anticipated that their young guys who Larry Harris brought in would actually blossom and blow up with good coaching. If RJ were to go down tomorrow night with a torn ACL, this team is even more screwed financially. That's why unfortunately he's the logical one to go.

I understand the situation with our salary and it blows, I agree with your post Press. But because of the basketball situation I'd be working my ass off to get Gadz off the books first and foremost. If that isn't going to leave enough space then I guess I get moving RJ, but I'd be extremely reluctant to do it without significant talent in return. People are grossly underestimating RJ's value to our team right now.

I believe we can sign both CV and Ramon next season under the Bird rule right? That is we can sign them no matter how far over the cap we go to do it because they are our players?
That being the case we'd have until next June or whenever to get back under the threshold as that's when salary is measured for Lux Tax purposes - in that time Redd will be healthy and playing again and will be a year closer to expiring meaning he can get moved. If Redd can't be moved we could then move RJ if need be. If I've made any incorrect assumptions there I'm sure someone will point them out for me - but to the best of my knowledge Lux Tax doesn't become an issue for us until deadline time NEXT season, as we won't be over at the end of this season either way. Is that correct?

I'll say it again, if we move RJ for expirings we will live to regret it - it will go down in folklore as just another Bucks screwup.

[midranger]

Since I started this thread with a fantasy basketball reference, I just thought I point this out.

If you play a yahoo league with standard scoring, CV has been the 4th best fantasy player in the NBA over the last month.

[midranger]

Assuming that Redd is healthy and playing well enough for anyone to want him by next year's trade deadline would be a mistake IMO. It certainly could happen, but we've seen Redd's time to recover from injury before. Quite frankly, he's no Bogut in that area.

[lawrybeard]

Something odd: CV has a huge differential in his shooting percentages between playing at home and on the road. On the season:

FG%: 51.4% (H) v 41.7% (A)
3FG%: 46.6% (H) v 28.4% (A)

I don't recall ever seeing a variance so high with any other players - wonder if there is a reason? If we could just swing things so we have 82 home games next year he's definitely worth keeping.

[midranger]

He only plays well in Toronto. Wait...

[GrandAdmiralDan]

I understand the situation with our salary and it blows, I agree with your post Press. But because of the basketball situation I'd be working my ass off to get Gadz off the books first and foremost. If that isn't going to leave enough space then I guess I get moving RJ, but I'd be extremely reluctant to do it without significant talent in return. People are grossly underestimating RJ's value to our team right now.

I believe we can sign both CV and Ramon next season under the Bird rule right? That is we can sign them no matter how far over the cap we go to do it because they are our players?
That being the case we'd have until next June or whenever to get back under the threshold as that's when salary is measured for Lux Tax purposes - in that time Redd will be healthy and playing again and will be a year closer to expiring meaning he can get moved. If Redd can't be moved we could then move RJ if need be. If I've made any incorrect assumptions there I'm sure someone will point them out for me - but to the best of my knowledge Lux Tax doesn't become an issue for us until deadline time NEXT season, as we won't be over at the end of this season either way. Is that correct?

I'll say it again, if we move RJ for expirings we will live to regret it - it will go down in folklore as just another Bucks screwup.

You are correct, but it is MUCH harder to clear salary for the 09-10 season DURING the 09-10 season than it is to do so prior to the 08-09 trade deadline. For example, trading RJ for an expiring contract next season means that player's salary will still be part of our 09-10 lux tax snapshot, whereas if we trade him for an expiring contract now, he obviously wouldn't.