2008-2009 Roster

[deeney0]

Those same bounds over 3 years become $11.6mil to $18.6mil. A three year contract might not be a bad thing for both sides, but I think it's in the Wolves best interest (especially for 2009), to make a long term offer this season rather than just taking the QO and negotiating next year, so that keeping Bassy at an inflated price doesn't become the highlight of the 2009 offseason.

And what makes you think there's no way he would get MLE?

[Worm Guts]

Those same bounds over 3 years become $11.6mil to $18.6mil. A three year contract might not be a bad thing for both sides, but I think it's in the Wolves best interest (especially for 2009), to make a long term offer this season rather than just taking the QO and negotiating next year, so that keeping Bassy at an inflated price doesn't become the highlight of the 2009 offseason.

And what makes you think there's no way he would get MLE?

He's not that good. He's been a role player on a terrible team, there's usually not a huge market for those guys.
Long term contracts are how we got stuck with Hudson, Hassell, and Jaric. Considering Telfair's past(this a career year for him and it's still relatively mediocre), I just can't see how a 5 year contract is a good idea.

[deeney0]

2008 FA PGs:
Chris Duhon (UFA)
Ben Gordon if you count him as a PG (RFA)
Daniel Gibson (RFA)
Delonte West (RFA)
Anthony Carter (RFA)
Allen Iverson (can opt out)
Baron Davis (can opt out)
Monta Ellis (RFA)
Steve Francis (can opt out)
Sam Cassell (UFA)
Shaun Livingston (RFA)
Sasha Vujacic (RFA)
Jason Williams (UFA)
Stephon Marbury (can opt out)
Carlos Arroyo (UFA)
Keyon Dooling (UFA)
Louis Williams (RFA)
Tyronn Lue (UFA)
Beno Udrih (UFA)
Jose Calderon (RFA)
Gilber Arenas (can opt out)

It's actually a larger group of PGs than I thought, although almost all are RFAs. Looking at that list, I guess Bassy probably won't get a MLE sized deal, and 3 years at $12-$15mil may be realistic.

Wolves have very rarely guessed right in terms of who to keep and who to walk. Constract length is a good thing when the deal is reasonably sized, it only turns into a bad thing when the player is overpayed.

[theGreatRC]

If Bassy doesn't take what we give him (I'd say a 2 year deal 6 mil), then let him play the field, and if teams offer him reasonable contracts, we match.

[skorff26]

Personally, I would like to make a trade up, move the 2 second rd picks with walker perhaps for a 1st and a big. Of course trade checker does not account for next year, but a draft day trade of.

(of course it is all based on if teams want it)

Walker+2 2nds for Nene+1st

Walker+2 2nds for Diaw+atl 1st (might need to add more, who knows, Phx has an owner that loves to save money)

Walker+2 2nds for E.Thomas+wash 1st

Just some ideas to save some teams money, we take a little cap hit, but get a better pick and concentrate the draft picks. Anything in the late teen range can bring a decent big.

the nene trade would not be good since we'd have an average always hurt nene and his long contract that would hamper any move we would make

i wouldn't want diaw but the atl 1st is tempting

i don't mind the thomas trade, just he runs a year longer and that would hinder our cap room in 09 and may restrict us from making a big move. i'd probably do this one though.

[wolves_fan_82au]

if we resign all these guys just dont exspect a big time free agent signing when we get cap space cause our roster limit will be full

[the_bruce]

Walker+2 2nds for Diaw+atl 1st (might need to add more, who knows, Phx has an owner that loves to save money)

I think the wolves need to do something like this assuming atl lands in the lotto. I'm not to trusting of all the "cap space" plans. I think MN would be much better off having 2 largish tradable contracts in 2010/2011 plus all the talent they get in the next couple years than cap space to sign some FA for way to much cash. Those deals seem to net the best ROI.

The atl pick could easily be a serviceable center(thabeet/hibbert) or maybe Jordan slips as a project 5? Or maybe love? Our pick is a gimme if we get #1 or #2, but a pick 10-15 could get MN a very nice piece without really forking over anything to valued long term aside from cash.

I'm not sure if Diaw is worth an extra 9m a year for 3 more years than Walker. Diaws play is probably worth 5-6m/yr? and he could always live up to 9m/yr in the right situation. At worst MN over pays him 3m/yr for 3 years. So 9m over 3 years? Most late 1sts are worth ~3m, and lotto picks have more value than those late firsts that are often sold. So MN pays an extra ~6m for a lotto pick. The right to move up into late lotto territory is probably worth another 3-6m. So mn is maybe break even? Maybe -3m?

pick chance at #1 or #2
6 0.113
7 0.113
8 0.041
9 0.041
10 0.039
11 0.017
12 0.015
13 0.013
14 0.011


If the pre-ping pong ball drop has the ATL pick at 11+ the chance of landing the 2 coveted guys in this years lotto is much less likely....but I'd just ignore them from the draft board because the real value is evaluating a worst best case scenario and how likely those scenarios are vs the extra $$$ MN pays to do so.

Best Case: (absurdly improbable)
MN gets #1 and #2 is worth it.
(Rose + Beasly)

Worst Case:(likely)
MN gets #5 and #11 (looks ok to me)
(Thabeet + green)

Marco + Diaw are both versatile. Jaric can play all backcourt spots and Diaw all front court. Both pass well, and are decent rebounders.

The only problem is it chews up capspace, but thats not all that bad imo. Off the top of my head probably puts MN in the mid 55m range over the extra 3 years....and really the only year where this really hurts is that first year when howard/hudson are finally off the books. The year after Jaric + Diaw = 16m in contracts that expire in 1 year for Jaric and 2 for Diaw(with his option). Tha's not so bad considering MN will have plenty to buncle to aquire a star caliber player.

[PeeDee]

I'm not to trusting of all the "cap space" plans. I think MN would be much better off having 2 largish tradable contracts in 2010/2011 plus all the talent they get in the next couple years than cap space to sign some FA for way to much cash. Those deals seem to net the best ROI.

Good thinking. We all know how hard it is to lure free agents here. We always have to overpay and/or take the plunge on a high risk, high reward player. Developing from within, and making some well timed trades might be the best way.

Also, Phoenix would never do ^ that deal pre-lottery. So if it happens, it'll only be for a late lottery player, which I would still do in a heartbeat.

[Worm Guts]

-= original quote snipped =-



Good thinking. We all know how hard it is to lure free agents here. We always have to overpay and/or take the plunge on a high risk, high reward player. Developing from within, and making some well timed trades might be the best way.
.

You can trade cap space the same way you can trade expiring contracts or you have the flexibility of being able to add free agents. And that way you don't have to pay for players you don't want.

[PeeDee]

Really? You can trade cap space?

[Worm Guts]

Really? You can trade cap space?

Well, you take more salary back (up to the salary cap) in a trade than you give out. Which I would call the equivalent to trading cap space.

[deeney0]

Like what Orlando/Seattle did this year. Orlando got Rashard, Seattle got a fricken huge TPE. That only worked because Orlando was far enough under the cap. Then with that TPE, Seattle was able to take Kurt Thomas for 2 first round picks and sell him for a third.

[gold0259]

Telfaire is a money man, and frankly that is all he cares about. Before he was in the nba the guy was spending money on cars and jewelry and probably has money already spent on his next contract. So I truly believe that he will go to the highest bidder, regardless of playing time and the chance that the wolves have given him this year to showcase his skills.

Wolves have no luck with guards anyhow hhhhhmm mike james, troy, chauncey. So expect for telfaire to end up to the highest bidder and become marcus banks 2.0. Just my thoughts

[Worm Guts]

Telfaire is a money man, and frankly that is all he cares about. Before he was in the nba the guy was spending money on cars and jewelry and probably has money already spent on his next contract. So I truly believe that he will go to the highest bidder, regardless of playing time and the chance that the wolves have given him this year to showcase his skills.

Wolves have no luck with guards anyhow hhhhhmm mike james, troy, chauncey. So expect for telfaire to end up to the highest bidder and become marcus banks 2.0. Just my thoughts

He's a restricted free agent, he isn't going anywhere unless we let him. Although if someone offered him a Marcus Banks contract, I'd pack his bags for him.
I also think its a little unfair to judge him based on how he spent money in high school. Hopefully he's a little more humble now.

[Steve_Holiday]

I don't think anyone watching Rose at the point for the Wolves will miss 'bastian much next season. If we get Beasley, Telfair may still be around, but hopefully not as a starter.

Granted, Sebastian has really grown on me this year. He has gone from "not qualified to be in the league" to potential "backup pointguard on a halfway decent team."