Mayo to Grizzlies

[revprodeji]

very good take Dewey

[shrink]

One last point.

I grimaced a bit when we got Brian Cardinal. He gets paid $6.3 mil this year, and $6.75 mil next season, and he's almost completely unproductive on the court (FG 34%, 3.4 PPG in 12 MPG, 6' 8" PF). In my valuation, he's a worse contract than Jaric. Since Jaric is so useful, he's paid maybe $2.5-$3.0 per year too much, so let's say he's a net negative $8 mil but Cardinal is a net negative $12.

However, there's a silver lining. Since Cardinal expires in two years, next summer he becomes an expiring. As we learned with Walker and Buckner, That has value, particularly since we have the ability to add salary in a trade. Since Cardinal's deal expires in 2010, not 2011 like Jaric, that expiring may have some extra trade value, with the wonder class of LeBron, Wade, Bosh, Carmello all potentially available in free agency.

Its hard to sit and wait, and just eat that much money. However, by Summer 2010, we are rid of all our negative contracts .. a pretty incredible accomplishment when you think about where we were one year ago.

[Magoose]

One last point.

I grimaced a bit when we got Brian Cardinal. He gets paid $6.3 mil this year, and $6.75 mil next season, and he's almost completely unproductive on the court (FG 34%, 3.4 PPG in 12 MPG, 6' 8" PF). In my valuation, he's a worse contract than Jaric. Since Jaric is so useful, he's paid maybe $2.5-$3.0 per year too much, so let's say he's a net negative $8 mil but Cardinal is a net negative $12.

However, there's a silver lining. Since Cardinal expires in two years, next summer he becomes an expiring. As we learned with Walker and Buckner, That has value, particularly since we have the ability to add salary in a trade. Since Cardinal's deal expires in 2010, not 2011 like Jaric, that expiring may have some extra trade value, with the wonder class of LeBron, Wade, Bosh, Carmello all potentially available in free agency.

Its hard to sit and wait, and just eat that much money. However, by Summer 2010, we are rid of all our negative contracts .. a pretty incredible accomplishment when you think about where we were one year ago.

Well, maybe we have to see it the other way round. Jaric might be more useful than cardinal is, but since Cardinal is less useful, he won't see anywhere near the minutes Jaric got=>more playing time for our young guns and maybe another deep gulp out of the draft pool next year. So Jaric might be more valuable than Cardinal from an objective pov but Cardinal might be more valuable for this team since he has a lower value (sounds irritating though)

[Dewey]

I think Cardinal is viewed as a great locker-room guy, so having him on the bench (versus Walker and/or Jaric) is viewed as "priceless" to management at this point in time. That may sem cheesy, but we have young players who can be easily influenced, so the more positivity there is, the more chemistry we can hope to develop.

Brian Cardinal was a real relentless scrapper (a true gamer) in his days at Pudue, and that's how he got to the NBA for all practical purposes. Always had an uncanny knack for finding ways to win. Reminds me of a Maddog at SF, but actually has a few skills when it comes to finding ways to score. Been a while since I've seen him play, but I'm pretty sure he has slowed down. I have to think it would be fun to see him and Maddog get the motors going in practice.

Yes, the bench and locker-room will be tons better for the youngr guys. I like the exchange even if he never steps foot on the floor, and actualy, I may buy myself a Cardinal jersey ... if they make one.

Min FG% 3pt% FT%
Career 263 29 16.7 0.416 0.380 0.856 0.9 2.1 3.0 1.2 0.8 0.1 0.95 2.20 6.4

Another 3pt threat? ... Foye, McCants, and Miller were all in the top 20 (3pt%) in 2007-08.

[revprodeji]

Yea, Shrink these points are very valid. Cardinal is a good guy in the lockeroom. Jaric was not. Cardinal is known as a hustle type player (the janitor) Jaric is not. Jaric takes minutes and needs rotation time to be productive. Cardinal does not.

Also Cardinal ends a year early. I thought you were making a point earlier that you would trade Jaric for anyone just to get the year off the contract.

[Klomp]

Rev, you might want to change the last part of your sig.

[shrink]

I thought you were making a point earlier that you would trade Jaric for anyone just to get the year off the contract.

That wasn't me, but it would be a tough call. My valuation process goes like this:

In my valuation, he's a worse contract than Jaric. Since Jaric is so useful, he's paid maybe $2.5-$3.0 per year too much, so let's say he's a net negative $8 mil but Cardinal is a net negative $12.

... but I've been toying with a more precise view, where the expiring year has neutral value. Yes, some prove to be very valuable (Kwame in the Gasol trade), however, if your team is not willing to take on salary, you're stuck with the final year of a non-productive guy. When I break it down, cost - production, it goes like this

2008-09 Jaric $6.6 - $4.0 = -$2.6
2009-10 Jaric $7.1 - $4.0 = -$3.1
2010-11 Jaric $0.0 ...................... Net $-5.7

2008-09 Cardinal $6.3 - $0.0 = -$6.3
2009-10 Cardinal $0.0 ...................... Net $-6.3

That's really close. The question would be is utility. How much does each team need to be clear of the salary early? You could also roll in the factors you, Magoose and Dewey mentioned. Its possible retaining Jaric as a back-up PG would have meant we'd have saved money by not having to pay a FA, but overall, I think your benefits outweigh the costs for MIN. Jaric played last season, on a team needing to develop its youth, for a reason -- the team played better with him than without him. Imagine where we would have been without Jaric when we lost Foye, and then Telfair?

I wouldn't have seeked out a straight-up Cardinal for Jaric swap, and I'm SURE Memphis wouldn't have done it, but with the benfits you guys listed, I wouldn't have had major problems with it. I'd have a harder time doing a similar 3-year-for-2 deal if it was someone like Jerome James.

[karch34]

Jaric was useful, but I'd rather see Foye, McCants, Miller, Brewer, Gomes, and hopefully Telfair getting the minutes at 1-3 that Jaric would've gotten. He didn't want to come off the bench and viewed himself as a PG instead of SF, which was my problem.

I understand the negative views on the trade of him vs. Cardinal, but for me that's one part of the deal that I liked a lot.

[T_Van]

Eh, not terrible but not great either.