MIN/UTA/SAC

[Worm Guts]

Give us your examples where they can save $8.5 mil.

Financial savings is too often neglected on these boards, when you see it so often in the real NBA. I don't disagree that the Knicks pick could be Top Ten, but its $8.5 mil and another 1st.

I don't think I'm neglecting financial savings, I just don't think Utah has shown itself this summer to be desperate enough to move a major asset for savings. They were already over the luxury tax when they signed Paul Millsap for 8 million per year.

[Marc]

Suns gave away their 1st round pick for money like 3-4 times? And we are talking about 21, 21, 24.

$3M for a 21 pick. I am talking about $8.5M to move from 16-19 to 5-11? And we are talking about the future. We are talking about DAntoni, a coach that is capable of turning scrubs into role players and role players into borderline stars, LOL.

Dantoni coaches the Knicks, not the Jazz, and those ranges should be more like 1-11 and 16-23. I think the difference in those ranges is potentially very significant and probably worth more than 8.5 million.

I mentioned DAntoni because the rights to swap UTA/NYK pick is involved and i think DAntoni could get some wins for the Knicks.

[Marc]

Give us your examples where they can save $8.5 mil.

Financial savings is too often neglected on these boards, when you see it so often in the real NBA. I don't disagree that the Knicks pick could be Top Ten, but its $8.5 mil and another 1st.

I don't think I'm neglecting financial savings, I just don't think Utah has shown itself this summer to be desperate enough to move a major asset for savings. They were already over the luxury tax when they signed Paul Millsap for 8 million per year.

They re-signed Millsap because he was worth his contract but that doesn't mean they could care less about saving money. In fact, they need to save more money now with Millsap than before they decided to match Blazer's offer. Remember Blazers' offer was 'toxic' = They had to pay big big money right away (I can't remember the exact value but i think it was around $7M...). Pretty sure i read they had to take a loan before matching the offer sheet...

[shrink]

They see Milsap as part of their future longterm.

LoserX said it best, and I'll paraphrase: "When Boozer decided not to walk, UTA decided to do their best to trade him for anything that can disguise a payroll decrease.

I think UTA cares very much about the extra $15 mil or so they will lose because of luxury taxes/lux share.

[Marc]

They see Milsap as part of their future longterm.

LoserX said it best, and I'll paraphrase: "When Boozer decided not to walk, UTA decided to do their best to trade him for anything that can disguise a payroll decrease.

I think UTA cares very much about the extra $15 mil or so they will lose because of luxury taxes/lux share.

Of course they do. Miller's family did their best to keep all the best current players because they know Sloan's coaching career is coming to an end soon and they want to win while they can.

But obviously, they care about money. And it is obviously harder to keep finances up when the owner of the team died.

Again, Miller's family was willing to re-sign Millsap as a sign of loyalty to Sloan. And i think they would give up the rights to swap UTA/NYK pick to save $8,5M.

[KF10]

While Kevin Martin may be the best player on the Kings, most Kings posters realize that he is not a superstar they can build their team around, and they have created several trade scenarios for Martin that aren't too far from this. They may want some sort of assurance they are getting a better pick, or to move Udrih before they sign on. Its just so tough to make deals involving the Knicks pick, since different posters have such a variable view of its worth.

Other than Smills trade situations, what other posters creates such inbalance such as this one? Other than Smills (even though, he has stated that he is just "probing" values) most Kings fans are not going to give up Martin for devalued packaged, just like this one.

This deal is very bad.

[jade_hippo]

i think the deal has the underlying thought Sacto is rebuilding. Ellington is a very similar player to Martin in terms of abilities and skillset. Sacto gets a younger, unproven version of Martin, they cut a big contract and get what look like 2 good picks.

Now i don't really like the deal either, i'd much rather trade for Ray Allen or Rip Hamilton or Jason Richardson. an older vet for our young team.

[shrink]

Its not my deal, but I don't think this deal is as bad for the Kings as others may believe.

If they don't do the deal they have Kevin Martin.

If they do the deal they have:

NYK 1st
Ellington - last year late 1st
Whoever they get with the tradable raw cap space that they spend on Martin.


Is this a lesser KG/superstar deal? A late 1st, a high 1st (we'll call ours Al Jefferson), and cap space .. SAC's being RAW cap space.

Again, I understand that SAC fans want to think of their #1 guy like he's a superstar, but the other 29 teams are not going to look at him that way if he was on their team -- and aren't going to offer superstar trade value. Personally, I think this is a very good package for a high-scoring little man. To me, it depends on how high that NYK pick will be in the 2010 draft. If SAC gets two Top 5 picks (and moving Martin would almost guarantee that), and trading the raw cap space for another star, they may be in better position than keeping Martin.

[Worm Guts]

They re-signed Millsap because he was worth his contract but that doesn't mean they could care less about saving money. In fact, they need to save more money now with Millsap than before they decided to match Blazer's offer. Remember Blazers' offer was 'toxic' = They had to pay big big money right away (I can't remember the exact value but i think it was around $7M...). Pretty sure i read they had to take a loan before matching the offer sheet...

I think it can viewed that this means Utah has prioritized basketball talent over financial savings. If Utah was willing to use the NYK pick for savings, they probably could have done much better than this when there were teams with cap room. They still might be able to do better with a team that has a big trade exception.

[Worm Guts]

i think the deal has the underlying thought Sacto is rebuilding. Ellington is a very similar player to Martin in terms of abilities and skillset. Sacto gets a younger, unproven version of Martin, they cut a big contract and get what look like 2 good picks.

Now i don't really like the deal either, i'd much rather trade for Ray Allen or Rip Hamilton or Jason Richardson. an older vet for our young team.

Ellington isn't much like Martin at all.

[KF10]

Its not my deal, but I don't think this deal is as bad for the Kings as others may believe.

No. It is that bad.

If they don't do the deal they have Kevin Martin.

We much rather have this option.

Anyways, I'm not too sure where you get the notion that Martin is perceived as a superstar in our eyes. We only view him as a all star caliber guard. That's all. But that doesn't means that we are trading him for peanuts. And that is what is happening here.

[john2jer]

Brutal for the Kings and WAY too good for the Wolves.

[KF10]

Ellington isn't much like Martin at all.

Agreed.

I just can't believe that anyone would compare Ellington to Martin. Style wise.

[shrink]

. We only view him as a all star caliber guard. That's all. But that doesn't means that we are trading him for peanuts. And that is what is happening here.

I assume he's never been a REAL all star, right? It's just the kigns viewing him that way? It seems to me like there are at least a dozen better SG's in the league in front of him.

A high 1st, a low 1st, and cap space seems reasonable to me. ::shrug::

[jack612]

I support this trade because the title is really close to spelling out MI NUT SAC

[KF10]

I assume he's never been a REAL all star, right? It seems like there are at least a dozen better SG's in the league in front of him.

The all star voting is no indication of being a real all star. The voting itself is just a popularity contest. Sure it may have some merit but it does not show a definite all star player. Believe me, Martin is an all star caliber talent.

Martin, when healthy, is easily in the top ten. I still don't know why people keep disputing this. Most people don't even watch Kings games and just follow popular opinion of him.

A high 1st, a low 1st, and cap space seems reasonable to me. ::shrug::

The Knicks pick is still an unknown. We are not trading Martin for an unknown quality. This deal is far from being reasonable.

[Winter Wonder]

I support this trade because the title is really close to spelling out MI NUT SAC

I am not usually one for this type of humor, but this did make me laugh as I looked at the letters closer.....

I blame being at work....

[john2jer]

I assume he's never been a REAL all star, right? It seems like there are at least a dozen better SG's in the league in front of him.

The all star voting is no indication of being a real all star. The voting itself is just a popularity contest. Sure it may have some merit but it does not show a definite all star player. Believe me, Martin is an all star caliber talent.

I completely agree. Just the other day my buddy was telling me I had no chance of dating Jessica Alba. And really, that's just a popularity contest. Believe me, I'm dating Jessica Alba.

[KF10]

I completely agree. Just the other day my buddy was telling me I had no chance of dating Jessica Alba. And really, that's just a popularity contest. Believe me, I'm dating Jessica Alba.