PA's Rumor on Al trade

[Worm Guts]

Rip and Prince have played 8 games each this year. Like i said before, the trade depends how good they still are.

[LordBaldric]

Rip Hamilton: .404 FG%, .226 3Pt%, .469 TS%
Tayshawn Prince: .429 FG%, .200 3Pt%, .459 TS%

Both these guys are sucking ass and are only getting older. And Rip has three more years on his deal for big $$$.

[Worm Guts]

They haven't played much and they've been injured. They were good last year, they'll probably be good again once they get fully healthy. Rip's contract is longer than originally thought, I already admitted that. The last year isn't fully guaranteed though, which would help the contract as trade bait.

I'll admit it looks worse the more I look at it, but I'm mainly trying to push outside of the box that we can only young guys. I'd like to have some winners on the team, some guys who have playoff experience. Older guys who would help us succeed immediately don't automatically condemn us to eternal mediocrity.

[horaceworthy]

It upgrades both wings, provides veteran leadership, allows up to compete for the playoffs next year, while leaving us with 5 players who are 22 and under and were taken in the top 10 of the draft (and two other picks, and Pekovic). The wings aquired also happen to provide shooting and defense which are our biggest needs.

This trade doesn't particulary make us less likely to be stuck in mediocrity, but if you compare it to signing a free agent for 6 years, it gives alot more flexibilty.

I'm fine with holding onto Al, and I actually probably wouldn't make the trade but I think it improves us now, while keeping us young and maintaining longterm flexibility.

It does upgrade both wings, but not as much as you'd think. Prince's D dropped off last year, and his offense hasn't been anything to write home about this year. If it returns to where it was the last couple years, then both he and Hamilton would be average players. I don't think that, a couple rookies and Pekovic pushes us into playoff contention next year. I think it more than likely pushes us into GSW/Milwaukee no man's land territory of winning 33 games if things go right and missing out on a shot at Perry Jones/Harrison Barnes.

I really don't have much interest in signing a free agent next year, at least not for 6 years. Unless we can get one of the big names, I don't see that happening. That argument rings a little false to me.

I just don't think it's wise to trade for players on the downside of their career, making 10+ million (one of them for 3 more years), both in the middle of down years (and at that point in their careers where it isn't certain they come all the way back from nagging injuries). The pick is decent, but the trade as a whole doesn't make a lick of sense to me.

I'm all for not waiting 6 years to compete like you've been saying, but I think the best blueprint to follow would either be that of the Celtics, where you draft well, develop the players and then cash in the chips through the trade market, or the Hawks, who developed a few of their draft picks and supplemented them through wise FA signings and then traded for a vet after seeing how their guys worked together. The Pistions trade would be jumping the gun on that, and for the wrong players.

[Worm Guts]

It does upgrade both wings, but not as much as you'd think. Prince's D dropped off last year, and his offense hasn't been anything to write home about this year. If it returns to where it was the last couple years, then both he and Hamilton would be average players. I don't think that, a couple rookies and Pekovic pushes us into playoff contention next year. I think it more than likely pushes us into GSW/Milwaukee no man's land territory of winning 33 games if things go right and missing out on a shot at Perry Jones/Harrison Barnes..

Hamilton and Prince were pretty much at their career averages statistically last year. If they have fallen off defensively, that would be an issue. I think if they played at that level, we'd be in the realm of the playoffs with a couple other moves that would necessarily require dipping our best young players. We'd still have guys like Brewer, Sessions, Utah and Charlotte picks.

Also, I sort of expect us to be in the 30+ win range next year regardless. I don't think we'll have a realistic shot at the top pick. We might even lose our pick.

I really don't have much interest in signing a free agent next year, at least not for 6 years. Unless we can get one of the big names, I don't see that happening. That argument rings a little false to me.

I think Gay is real possibility and would require 6 years. Not necessarily likely, but still a possibility.

I just don't think it's wise to trade for players on the downside of their career, making 10+ million (one of them for 3 more years), both in the middle of down years (and at that point in their careers where it isn't certain they come all the way back from nagging injuries). The pick is decent, but the trade as a whole doesn't make a lick of sense to me.

I don't care much about how much we pay, as long we're not locked in too long. Prince would be an expiring. He could either be traded, resigned at a cheaper rate, or let expire and we'd have cap space again. Hamilton was kind of in the same boat, it's that third year that really killed my defense of the trade. That and them seemingly falling apart because of injuries.

I'm all for not waiting 6 years to compete like you've been saying, but I think the best blueprint to follow would either be that of the Celtics, where you draft well, develop the players and then cash in the chips through the trade market, or the Hawks, who developed a few of their draft picks and supplemented them through wise FA signings and then traded for a vet after seeing how their guys worked together. The Pistions trade would be jumping the gun on that, and for the wrong players.

I'd love the Celtics blueprint but nothing resembling that looks to be available. The Hawks blueprint has taken a long time, and will probably max out without reaching the conference finals barring a major trade. I think we've got to look at as many options as we can and be open-minded.

[wolves_fan_82au]

Al isnt going anywhere imo,why would we trade someone whos just getting back to hes old self

seriously if this happens it will be the most stupid move ive seen any franchise do in a long time

[skorff26]

Agree about the terrible deal, this gets the wolves to the playoffs, 2nd round at best, and we'd never get beyond that... I'd rather let our young guys develop, bring in more young talent, and use cap space to get an all-star lvl player to push us into title contention.

I guess you'd do this trade if you want 8 years of getting into the playoffs and not going anywhere (like the KG years); or you could wait and develop, miss the playoffs the next year, borderline playoff team, 1st or 2nd round exit, title contender for 3 or 4 years... I guess it's what you'd prefer as a fan.

What exactly is it about this trade that dooms the Wolve to long term mediocrity, the youth or the short term contracts?
Part of the reason for targeting older guys like Prince and Hamilton would be that their shorter contracts would give us more financial flexibility and make us LESS likely to be stuck in mediocrity.

I wouldn't mind Prince for expirings to upgrade our wings, I wouldn't really like it either.
but we do not want RIP; he's pretty much 32 years old, and he makes 12.5 million/season the next 2 years, and 9 million guaranteed for a 3rd year (3.5 million unguaranteed)... RIP making 34 million over the next 3 years is not worth it.

There are a ton better packages out there, I bet right now we could get RIP + Prince for expirings... and Jefferson is worth more then Detroit's 1st

[Breakdown777]

We already have a Tayshaun Prince, his name is Corey Brewer.
I liked rip BEFORE he signed that crazy huge contract.
We already have enough picks if you ask me. I really don't understand how so many on this board go lady ga ga over having like 5 1st rounders, stating who'd they pick with each, then putting together a hypothetical dream rotation that features 4 rookies, 2 second year guys, a 3rd year guy, and a bunch of players under 25. A team that young without any vet's would be TERRIBLE, see; 2009/2010 NEW JERSEY NETS and MN TIMBERWOLVES.

[Narf]

Just thought I'd reiterate this point. If you offered cap space for Rip and Prince, Detroit takes that deal in 3 seconds. And the only reason it takes them 3 seconds is their GM is waiting for Kahn to say "I'm kidding, I'm kidding, here's what the real deal is".

Those 2 are not worth their salary. That's a no brainer.

What about Flynn/Jefferson for Granger/Hansbrough?

[Foye]

Just thought I'd reiterate this point. If you offered cap space for Rip and Prince, Detroit takes that deal in 3 seconds. And the only reason it takes them 3 seconds is their GM is waiting for Kahn to say "I'm kidding, I'm kidding, here's what the real deal is".

Those 2 are not worth their salary. That's a no brainer.

What about Flynn/Jefferson for Granger/Hansbrough?

Jefferson and Granger need to be paired, not exchanged.

[shangrila]

^That's not what Kahn thinks.

But in all seriousness, I think Granger and Love could make a decent couple combined with whoever they pick up in the draft.

[Jumping to Pass]

what do you guys think of a Jefferson + Gomes for Horford + Marvin + ZaZa deal?

[Narf]

what do you guys think of a Jefferson + Gomes for Horford + Marvin + ZaZa deal?

I think Atlanta is a stones throw away from contending for the title and doesn't want to mess that team up.

[Ojmayo]

Just thought I'd reiterate this point. If you offered cap space for Rip and Prince, Detroit takes that deal in 3 seconds. And the only reason it takes them 3 seconds is their GM is waiting for Kahn to say "I'm kidding, I'm kidding, here's what the real deal is".

Those 2 are not worth their salary. That's a no brainer.

What about Flynn/Jefferson for Granger/Hansbrough?

Jefferson and Granger need to be paired, not exchanged.

So we trade Flynn, Ricky, and Gomes, Utah's pick, Charlotte's pick.

[Worm Guts]

We already have a Tayshaun Prince, his name is Corey Brewer.
I liked rip BEFORE he signed that crazy huge contract.
We already have enough picks if you ask me. I really don't understand how so many on this board go lady ga ga over having like 5 1st rounders, stating who'd they pick with each, then putting together a hypothetical dream rotation that features 4 rookies, 2 second year guys, a 3rd year guy, and a bunch of players under 25. A team that young without any vet's would be TERRIBLE, see; 2009/2010 NEW JERSEY NETS and MN TIMBERWOLVES.

Tayshaun Prince can shoot and Tayshaun Prince has played on an NBA championship team. I don't understand your point about a young team with no vets, Richard Hamilton and Tayshaun Prince are the vets. The selling point for this trade is that it keeps us with a young core but with playoff tested vets.

[Slum_Dillinger]

Just thought I'd reiterate this point. If you offered cap space for Rip and Prince, Detroit takes that deal in 3 seconds. And the only reason it takes them 3 seconds is their GM is waiting for Kahn to say "I'm kidding, I'm kidding, here's what the real deal is".

Those 2 are not worth their salary. That's a no brainer.

What about Flynn/Jefferson for Granger/Hansbrough?

Jefferson and Granger need to be paired, not exchanged.

So we trade Flynn, Ricky, and Gomes, Utah's pick, Charlotte's pick.

Yea but can we throw in Sessions too? I mean we really dont even need a PG right?