Flynn Vs Sessions

[shrink]

In Kahn's last interview, he stated that while he was starting Ryan Hollins, he never acquired him to be a starting center. His role was 4th big.

I think that instead of trying to accumulate as much talent at a position, Kahn is seeking to fill each position seperately, like he was casting for a movie. This differs from most of our views, where we would prefer to just add the most talented players, and work out roles afterwards. Kahn probably was happy filling the fourth big role by locking up Hollins for three years at a small salary for a big man. With his age and skill-set, he can fill the role of fourth big, and has lots of potential to improve on those athletic skills.

I also think Kahn's the same thing applies to Ramon Sessions. Sessions wasn't added to this team to be a starter, but he was locked in longterm, at the expense of cap space, because he's super as a back-up PG. Like Hollins, he has the athleticism and tools for the job, and the youth to develop .. all on a small salary. He's so impressed with Sessions that he's taken the unusual step of not even carrying a third PG, which is a move I'm happy with.

Sometimes when I see Flynn struggling, I wonder whether we'd be better starting Sessions. We know he can produce - at least, he produced in MIL in a different offense. I think he may be a bit stereo-typed as our "good BACK-UP pg" in Kahn's architecture, and of course, if the #6 pick is to pay off, we're forced to try to develop Flynn. However, its a tribute to Sessions that I am open to trading Flynn while his value is high because I feel Sessions can step in without a significant downgrade in our team's ability. Like Flynn, he's also young, also impressive, and he also could improve with development and starting minutes.

[Worm Guts]

Neither is a starting material, but Sessions is miles better right now, cause Flynn's decision-making is atrocious and that's the most crucial part of being a good point guard. Drafting him was a huge miss for Kahn, although people forget that he didn't draft Flynn to be a starting PG, Rubio was supposed to be that. When Ricky chose to stay in Europe, Kahn went after Sessions. Why Rambis chose to stick with Flynn is beyong me.

Its way too early to call Flynn a miss, and I disagree that Kahn didn't draft Flynn to be a starting point guard. You don't draft a guy at 6 if you don't think he's starting caliber. Right now, Rambis is forcing Flynn away from his strengths. I don't if it's strictly to help development, or Rambis is shoving his offense down the teams throat. I hope it's the former.
Either way, I think Flynn would look alot better in an offense geared towards his strengths.

[Devilzsidewalk]

Summary : it's tough Rubio plays for Minnie this summer. Really do you want wait for him another year?

There are no other options, Minnesota can either wait for Rubio to play for them or else trade him for what most likely would be poor value because NBA teams are vultures. If they think you're backed into a corner to trade somebody, then they try and screw you. So if the choices are to trade Rubio for poor value or else wait him out, then I'd rather wait him out to the bitter end. Worst case scenario is Rubio truly hates Minnesota so much that he refuses to come to the NBA and stays in Europe forever and ever. Ultimately since Rubio had to have been taken with that pick, we would have lost out on Foye and Miller - 2 guys we weren't going to re-sign anyways; I think we can handle that.

Most likely scenario is Rubio probably wants to play in a bigger market, but tough ****, you can't have your cake and eat it too, so he ends up playing for Minnesota in 2011/12.

[lobishome]

I am not asking this.

Possible Scenario : Rubio wants play for Minnie in 2011, and Minnie can pick Wall this summer.

Do Minnesota fans prefer pick & trade Wall and wait for Rubio one year more?

or

Do you prefer start the next seasson with Wall and trade Rubio next summer?

[jpatrick]

I think some on this board would rather trade Wall for Evans plus something, but I and I'm assuming the Wolves would pick and keep Wall and make Rubio available for trade. Wall appears a sure thing, in that he has more athletic ability and that he'd be willing to play in MN next season, while Rubio does have some question marks about how is game will transfer and he has already said no to us once to stay in Europe.

[PeeDee]

Poor Evan Turner, or is it Turner Evans? Whatever, I'd pick him over Wall. The difference between Wall and Rubio/Turner isn't good enough to take another freaking PG.

[Biff Cooper]

Poor Evan Turner, or is it Turner Evans? Whatever, I'd pick him over Wall. The difference between Wall and Rubio/Turner isn't good enough to take another freaking PG.

I also would take Turner over Wall

[Esohny]

Poor Evan Turner, or is it Turner Evans? Whatever, I'd pick him over Wall. The difference between Wall and Rubio/Turner isn't good enough to take another freaking PG.

Luckily(?) for us, the odds, and history, say that there's little chance we have a choice between Wall and Turner.

[PeeDee]

Don't tell anyone, but I did secret voodoo rituals last year to get Rubio on the roster. It worked. (Kinda) Turner is as good as ours. MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

[Winter Wonder]

What does Flynn do wrong that you feel would improve with growth and time? Has he improved as the year progressed?

His defense primarily. More so off the ball. Now this has possibly/probably improved, but I saw him getting beat on cuts, back doors, and not in the passing lanes when he should be, or playing helpside. He just needs to imrpove his defensive awareness off the ball.

Offensively, better decision making in the half court and utilizing his above average quickness and strength to create opportunities for himself AND others. improved outside and mid range shooting, or again, when to take these shots and how (set vs. off the dribble, etc.)

Overall though, Ramon seems to get the offense moving better and is a steadier hand, moving without the ball better as well (probably due to playing some SG in Mil).

[Tirion]

Neither is a starting material, but Sessions is miles better right now, cause Flynn's decision-making is atrocious and that's the most crucial part of being a good point guard. Drafting him was a huge miss for Kahn, although people forget that he didn't draft Flynn to be a starting PG, Rubio was supposed to be that. When Ricky chose to stay in Europe, Kahn went after Sessions. Why Rambis chose to stick with Flynn is beyong me.

Its way too early to call Flynn a miss, and I disagree that Kahn didn't draft Flynn to be a starting point guard. You don't draft a guy at 6 if you don't think he's starting caliber. Right now, Rambis is forcing Flynn away from his strengths. I don't if it's strictly to help development, or Rambis is shoving his offense down the teams throat. I hope it's the former.
Either way, I think Flynn would look alot better in an offense geared towards his strengths.

I don't care about Flynn "looking better", I care about him producing wins. That's Rambis fault now that Flynn is a liability on defense or can't recognize and make a simple pass?

[Worm Guts]

When I said "looking better", I didn't mean he'd start playing in an Armani suit. I meant more productive and helpful to the team. He'd still have his flaws, but that doesn't mean he couldn't be doing more to help the team win.

[shrink]

Maybe I should have realized this before, but if we got Wall, Flynn's trade value would really hit a lower than low. I had toyed with some sort of Flynn + CHA pick for IND pick deal, but realize now that Bird would simply say, "No thanks. Let's talk about Rubio?"

[Casperkid23]

Maybe I should have realized this before, but if we got Wall, Flynn's trade value would really hit a lower than low. I had toyed with some sort of Flynn + CHA pick for IND pick deal, but realize now that Bird would simply say, "No thanks. Let's talk about Rubio?"

Then deal Flynn before the draft, but after the lottery order is made.

Unless they're talking to the team picking #2, the Timberwolves would still have about the same leverage as if they didn't get the #1 - especially if it ends up being a split decision on who the top prospect is.

[Steve_Holiday]

When I said "looking better", I didn't mean he'd start playing in an Armani suit.

Ahahahahaha!!!!

Maybe I should have realized this before, but if we got Wall, Flynn's trade value would really hit a lower than low. I had toyed with some sort of Flynn + CHA pick for IND pick deal, but realize now that Bird would simply say, "No thanks. Let's talk about Rubio?"

Not sure I see the logic here. Unless the Wolves were in an untenable cap situation, they could have all three pg's plus Rubio and not be forced into making a move. Look at Love and Jefferson...having two PF's hasn't shot the trade value of either player (other factors have, *sigh*). I think the thing hurting Flynn's value the most is his sub-par play.

Also, if the Wolves got Wall, I'd be perfectly fine with them talking about Rubio to IND or anywhere else.

[Calinks]

I don't see how any9ne can say that Flynn is a miss and wont be a starter in the NBA. 20 year old rookie trying to play a complex system. Don't write the guy off yet.

Sessions I think is a really good PG, I do not think he is great in the triangle however. I think he is best in a more open, freestyle system that lets him attack the basket and collapse defenses. He would be good on the Suns, Warriors, or 76ers. Give him a lot of athletes and let him run and he will look like a poor man's Jason Kidd.

[Narf]

Maybe I should have realized this before, but if we got Wall, Flynn's trade value would really hit a lower than low. I had toyed with some sort of Flynn + CHA pick for IND pick deal, but realize now that Bird would simply say, "No thanks. Let's talk about Rubio?"

And our response would be "If you can find another team with a better young pointguard to trade, let me know. I have 17 other teams who let me know they were interested. Make your best offer or don't waste my time, Rubio's not for sale."

His trade value goes up if we draft Wall, not down. If we are shopping Flynn this year, teams are going to say "What's wrong with him that they don't want him?" But if we're shopping Flynn after we draft Wall, no one asks that question. So they don't feel like they might be buying damaged goods.

[shrink]

The problem is supply-side. The last draft flooded the market with young PG's. There are only a couple teams that could use a young PG, and several that could be selling. I think we'd struggle finding minutes with four PG's on deals (Wall, Flynn, Sessions .. Rubio)

[Narf]

The problem is supply-side. The last draft flooded the market with young PG's. There are only a couple teams that could use a young PG, and several that could be selling. I think we'd struggle finding minutes with four PG's on deals (Wall, Flynn, Sessions .. Rubio)

We would have 3 PGs, and could trade Sessions instead of Flynn moving him to the bench. Rubio is a year after drafting Wall, we need at least 2 PGs until then. Atlanta, Miami, Sacramento, Portland (for Fernandez) would all be teams off the top of my head that would like to have Flynn. Then you have guys like Steve Nash and Jason Kidd who are getting up there in age. No doubt they'd like to have a young protege to fill that gap after they retire (or just lose a step).

But I don't think it matters if it's 7 or 17 teams, we don't have to sell Flynn cheap. Enough teams will want him OR Sessions if we draft Wall that we should be able to get value.