TOR - PHI - MN

[freshie2]

I'd be fine with Johnson/'Big'/Webster/Flynn for Iguodala/Nocioni, but I'd be curious if the #20 pick is asking too much?? With the 16 and 20, I'd like to see the Sixers take a flier on Vucevic or Tyler, and hopefully Moti falls as well. I'm fine with Holiday/ET as the main core backcourt pieces, but they need to take come calculated risks on talent (in the teens it isn't that big a risk) on the frontcourt of the future. Johnson or Webster can replace Iguodala at the SF spot/add depth off the bench, either big man is helpful short term and not a big hit long term, and Flynn either has something to prove or is moved in another deal. If they could get hit on those bigs, they would be in great shape in a few years.

I've thought for some time that Iguodala is a nice piece for the Wolves and Kings, and those teams have enough young talent to make a deal possible...we shall see!

[shrink]

If I haven't mentioned it, I just wanted to note I wouldn't give up Wes Johnson for Iguodala's expensive contract, especially if we had Nocioni tacked on too.

[Devilzsidewalk]

I dont like involving trade downs or contracts in Iguodala trades, seems unnecessary. Straight up trade for Wes Johnson and change is plenty. No unloading all their bad contracts, no piles of lotto picks. Wes Johnson and change.

If Philly needs their socks blown off to trade Iguodala then let them keep their socks, keep Iguodala, and the Wolves need to keep shopping.

Good front offices are patient and wait for the right time to land bargains these levels of players like Portland did w/ Gerald Wallace, Dallas did w/ Chandler, and Houston did w/ Martin.

Crappy front offices like Detroit did w/ Billups, Orlando did w/ Gortat, and NY did w/ Gallinari, get too impatient and scared of their fans and start rushing out to make big moves to satisfy their fans and the teams they're trading with take full advantage of them every time.

If we want to get good we have to find the right timing for the right guys. If we traded for Deng last year we could've gotten him for pennies on the dollar. Trade for him now and he's going to be way overpriced. Just a year, but it makes a huge difference. If Philly wants to talk about their bad contracts or the Wolves' draft in an Iguodala trade, it's definitely not the right time.

[Esohny]

Clearly we forget that because we haven't seen a competent front office up close before.

[mandurugo]

I dont like involving trade downs or contracts in Iguodala trades, seems unnecessary. Straight up trade for Wes Johnson and change is plenty. No unloading all their bad contracts, no piles of lotto picks. Wes Johnson and change.

If Philly needs their socks blown off to trade Iguodala then let them keep their socks, keep Iguodala, and the Wolves need to keep shopping.

Good front offices are patient and wait for the right time to land bargains these levels of players like Portland did w/ Gerald Wallace, Dallas did w/ Chandler, and Houston did w/ Martin.

Crappy front offices like Detroit did w/ Billups, Orlando did w/ Gortat, and NY did w/ Gallinari, get too impatient and scared of their fans and start rushing out to make big moves to satisfy their fans and the teams they're trading with take full advantage of them every time.

If we want to get good we have to find the right timing for the right guys. If we traded for Deng last year we could've gotten him for pennies on the dollar. Trade for him now and he's going to be way overpriced. Just a year, but it makes a huge difference. If Philly wants to talk about their bad contracts or the Wolves' draft in an Iguodala trade, it's definitely not the right time.

or MN did w/ Beasley... I think Kahn's done some good and some bad, but I'm not sure you can say that Deng was available last year and judge him (or the other GM's) by his failure to get him. It seemed like he was available on RealGM, but there's a big difference between what the trade board thinks is going on and what it thinks ought to be fair and what is actually out there.

[moss_is_1]

^Plus when you are a good team, you can afford to take on salary for an older player at a chance he will put you over the top. What would be the point in us trading young guys for Gerald Wallace when he's 8 years older then anyone on our core?

[Devilzsidewalk]

I wasn't suggesting Kahn failed in not trading for Deng, I was illustrating how player values can rapidly fluctuate and that it's unnecessary to trade top dollar for a non-all star. ie it doesn't mean that if they wait it out that they'll be able to land Iguodala for spare parts, but that if they don't make hasty moves, there will be plenty of opportunities to get a guy of that caliber - he's what, maybe the 40th best player in the NBA and he's in his prime? And not even close to top 50 in trade value.

I'm a Beasley supporter, but cmon, 1/3 of a good season in 3 years from Beasley doesn't compare w/ what Tyson Chandler, Kevin Martin and Gerald Wallace have done. Kahn has made below average player transactions almost across the board and he's doing it by going against the grain and gambling which makes it worse. Its one thing to go against the grain like Sam Presti, but all his roster moves come up aces. Kahn did an admirable job turning a mediocre overpaid roster into cap space and draft picks, but he's quickly turning all that cap into bad free agents and all the draft picks into mediocre prospects.

At the very least you dont get to walk around w/ a **** eating grin like everybody else doesn't get it when your 17 month plan involved turning a big ass pile of prime draft picks and 25 million dollars into Flynn, Wes, Ridnour, Darko, and Martell Webster.

[GopherIt!]

^ He wasted most of the capspace to get marginal players like Darko, Luke, Webster, AT, etc and now we are probably going to miss out on guys like Gasol and Jordan.

[JMillott]

I don't like it for the simple reason that if the Wolves are going to get Iggy they should keep Wesley Johnson who is by far the best compliment to him and really if i'm the 76ers i'm not doing the deal without getting a lottery pick either.

[Breakdown777]

Brand, Thad, Speights, Hawes
[Pek/Darko]
Songaila, Brackins, Battie.

Doesn't Philly have enough bigs? Do they really need Pek/Darko? I guess if it's for $ reasons, but I think including something else might entice them more.

[mandurugo]

I wasn't suggesting Kahn failed in not trading for Deng, I was illustrating how player values can rapidly fluctuate and that it's unnecessary to trade top dollar for a non-all star. ie it doesn't mean that if they wait it out that they'll be able to land Iguodala for spare parts, but that if they don't make hasty moves, there will be plenty of opportunities to get a guy of that caliber - he's what, maybe the 40th best player in the NBA and he's in his prime? And not even close to top 50 in trade value.

Well I agree that player value fluctuates, but my point is that I don't think it fluctuates nearly as much as RealGM thinks it does. More to the point, the players that RealGM are so convinced are available are not necessarily really available. Igoudala is a good example - it's reasonable to think he's available due to position overlap, but that is just supposition and to think we can peg his shifting values is a fun but meaningless exercise. To then lambast actual gm's for trades they didn't make but we're sure they could have is all I'm cautioning against. Kahn has screwed up enough on actual deals, but he still gets a ton of flak for things people think he could have done.

[SouthJersey]

Brand, Thad, Speights, Hawes
[Pek/Darko]
Songaila, Brackins, Battie.

Doesn't Philly have enough bigs? Do they really need Pek/Darko? I guess if it's for $ reasons, but I think including something else might entice them more.

Are you being sarcastic? Songalia, Brackins, Battie, and at the end of the year, Speights, barely saw any playing time and for good reason.

Besides, what legitmate Center do you see on that roster?

[Devilzsidewalk]

I wasn't suggesting Kahn failed in not trading for Deng, I was illustrating how player values can rapidly fluctuate and that it's unnecessary to trade top dollar for a non-all star. ie it doesn't mean that if they wait it out that they'll be able to land Iguodala for spare parts, but that if they don't make hasty moves, there will be plenty of opportunities to get a guy of that caliber - he's what, maybe the 40th best player in the NBA and he's in his prime? And not even close to top 50 in trade value.

Well I agree that player value fluctuates, but my point is that I don't think it fluctuates nearly as much as RealGM thinks it does. More to the point, the players that RealGM are so convinced are available are not necessarily really available. Igoudala is a good example - it's reasonable to think he's available due to position overlap, but that is just supposition and to think we can peg his shifting values is a fun but meaningless exercise. To then lambast actual gm's for trades they didn't make but we're sure they could have is all I'm cautioning against. Kahn has screwed up enough on actual deals, but he still gets a ton of flak for things people think he could have done.

oh i totally agree, i think most fans, myself included, for not making rumored deals or deals that we *think* are possible. Ultimately Kahn can't be blamed for that.

But when he does end up making a move, he seems to have an uncanny ability to get his ass kicked each and every time. I don't know, maybe Taylor should be catching more flak because there's been an alarming trend on draft day in recent years to have good prospects fall into the Wolves' laps on the later picks only to be traded for "future considerations". Has a negative financial feel to it.

[GopherIt!]

I don't like it for the simple reason that if the Wolves are going to get Iggy they should keep Wesley Johnson who is by far the best compliment to him and really if i'm the 76ers i'm not doing the deal without getting a lottery pick either.

I'd like to hear what more people think about an Iggy-Wes Johnson wing tandem. Are they a good fit next to each other?

[Devilzsidewalk]

they're a good fit for 3 and half quarters, but usually you don't find too many contenders w/o at least 1 upper echelon iso scorer at the wing to close out games. Especially difficult if Rubio and Love are starting @ PG and PF. Thats 4 positions locked up with no go-to scoring players and I can't think of any centers in the NBA that can fill that. As far as I can tell, every playoff series this year was won by the team w/ the superior iso play. We need that half court scoring threat to put pressure on the defense. For that reason I think I'd prefer Beasley over Wes for the potential that he might be a consistent scorer some day.