VOTE! The “Other Big” Archetype - Max Level

[Klomp]

I don't think it will ever be a pure 5. That just doesn't seem to be how they want to build their team.

I've felt for a while that Simmons is the archetype. Movement ability has always seemed to be the top priority of the position for Rosas. Finch likes running offense through the bigs at the elbow (Simmons can do this) and he fits the requirement of getting bigger at the position to help with rebounding.

[Klomp]

3. A 3/4. More mobile, more switchable, but not someone that can handle 5s. Simmons, obviously, or Covington would be examples.

The fact that Simmons is classified this way should be proof of why someone like him is so valuable. He's described as a SF/PF by some (a PG by others) and yet is essentially the same size as Karl-Anthony Towns. Both are the same height (6'11"/2.11m) according to the NBA and only eight pounds separates them (248 vs. 240). By comparison, Covington (included in the same category as Simmons) is only 6'7" (2.01m) and 209 lbs. Keep in mind that after Towns and Reid, the next heaviest player on the 2020-21 Wolves roster was Anthony Edwards (225 lbs).

[breatnach]

Turner would be perfect. We need someone who can play 5 on defense, but the 4 on offense. Basically the inverse to Towns.

[Klomp]

Hi Dane!

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[Biff Cooper]

Are we supposed to make believe that all of these "player types" are of equal ability and are getting paid the same "max" salary?

I obviously want the best player of the three (or more) who is getting paid the most reasonable salary.

That probably isn't what this is about though, so I would have to go Turner / Collins / Simmons

[SO_MONEY]

Turner would be perfect. We need someone who can play 5 on defense, but the 4 on offense. Basically the inverse to Towns.

We need someone who can defend the 4.

[flyindutchman]

Can we stop with the "building around KAT" and "how would KAT respond" threads? He was drafted in '15 and has yet to show he's a leader that can bring the team to the playoffs. I'd much rather find players that can bring out the best of Ant. If a player can do both, great, but this should be the end of KAT being the deciding factor.

[shangrila]

Can we stop with the "building around KAT" and "how would KAT respond" threads? He was drafted in '15 and has yet to show he's a leader that can bring the team to the playoffs. I'd much rather find players that can bring out the best of Ant. If a player can do both, great, but this should be the end of KAT being the deciding factor.

I don't think you could find a better big to pair with Ant than KAT.

[TheProdigy]

The new Dane Moore pod on Bolmaro has an interesting feature at the end - talking about what type of archetype we need next to KAT.

It looks like the initial archetype, “SF that can shoot the three,” didn’t fit, even with good players like Covington.

I think part of the reason Covington didn't work out for us is because we didn't have the personnel needed to run Rosas' 5 out offense. In order to properly run that offense, you need 5 guys who are a threat to shoot from 3. Maybe equally important is having at least one guy on the floor that can attack the rim and collapse the defense. During Covington's tenure in MN, the only guy who could consistently collapse the defense was Derrick Rose, and he was gone before Rosas arrived.

Edwards has exceptional athleticism and a surprisingly good handle, so he should be the type of guy who can put pressure on the rim and create open 3's for his teammates. I'm very excited to see how things look when we have a healthy roster and can surround him with shooters.

That's why I'm hesitant on adding Simmons. Without question, he would add much needed defense to the rotation. I'm just not sure how it would work on offense with spacing. Last off season, I was in favor of packaging the #1 pick for Simmons (I was wrong). Now after seeing what Edwards was capable of during the 2nd half of the season, l think Edwards should have the ball in his hands with as much space to work with as possible.

[Klomp]

Can we stop with the "building around KAT" and "how would KAT respond" threads? He was drafted in '15 and has yet to show he's a leader that can bring the team to the playoffs. I'd much rather find players that can bring out the best of Ant. If a player can do both, great, but this should be the end of KAT being the deciding factor.

Choosing someone who fits alongside KAT doesn't mean the team is only building around Towns.

[Nick K]

I don't think the primary concern anymore is what type of player fits best next to KAT. He's not a great rim defender and his size/huge feet will be a detriment to defending on the perimeter. The far more interesting question is what type of player fits best with Edwards? You mentioned that the Covington archtype didn't fit with KAT, but I think that's exactly the type of player we need to be surrounding Edwards with.

Our top priorities for roster construction should be 1) creating space for Edwards to attack the rim, and 2) being able to switch on picks and screens. In order for Edwards to reach his potential, he needs to learn how to read defenses and drive/kick to open shooters.

Of the three options you mentioned, the only one that plays above average defense and can hit 3s is Myles Turner. The problem then is you're playing KAT at the 4 which takes away your switchability.

I like McDaniels at the 3 and he can cover the 4. That's why a Mobley or Barnes could be such a great fit.

I wonder what the cost might be to get Barnes? The Simmons price tag has my head spinning. Plus how do you pay him with Dlo and Kat?

McDaniels is a great fit for our rotation. SFs/PFs that can hit 3s on low usage and make an impact on defense are not easy to find. Just look at the impact PJ Tucker is having on the Bucks, and Jae Crowder is having on the Suns.

We have some very unique talents on this team right now and I think our focus should be on surrounding our core with the right players. Edwards is a SPECIAL athlete, and he should be a great fit next to KAT on offense. If we can surround Edwards with good shooters, there is no reason why he can't attack the rim relentlessly, and kick to open shooters when the lane collapses.

Yes, Yes!

[Nick K]

I don't think it will ever be a pure 5. That just doesn't seem to be how they want to build their team.

I've felt for a while that Simmons is the archetype. Movement ability has always seemed to be the top priority of the position for Rosas. Finch likes running offense through the bigs at the elbow (Simmons can do this) and he fits the requirement of getting bigger at the position to help with rebounding.

The true archetypes are Kevin McHale or Tim Duncan. Of course they are not walking in the room. The bottom line is we don't need a scorer or a passer. We need a rim protecting, rebounding demon on both ends.

We don't knw if Simmons can dominate inside. Simmons is a 14 and 7 guy and most of his boards are the easy ones. Can he block out inside? We don't know how effective he'd be there. He's a great on the ball defender but is that what we need most? Covington was a great defender and look how far that got us?

I loved Simmons coming out of the draft and like him less every year I see him.

We throw around players and picks like drunken sailors at a whorehouse for this guy. I do like him at a reduced price.

[Norseman79]

I don't think it will ever be a pure 5. That just doesn't seem to be how they want to build their team.

I've felt for a while that Simmons is the archetype. Movement ability has always seemed to be the top priority of the position for Rosas. Finch likes running offense through the bigs at the elbow (Simmons can do this) and he fits the requirement of getting bigger at the position to help with rebounding.

The true archetypes are Kevin McHale or Tim Duncan. Of course they are not walking in the room. The bottom line is we don't need a scorer or a passer. We need a rim protecting, rebounding demon on both ends.

We don't knw if Simmons can dominate inside. Simmons is a 14 and 7 guy and most of his boards are the easy ones. Can he block out inside? We don't know how effective he'd be there. He's a great on the ball defender but is that what we need most? Covington was a great defender and look how far that got us?

I loved Simmons coming out of the draft and like him less every year I see him.

We throw around players and picks like drunken sailors at a whorehouse for this guy. I do like him at a reduced price.

Nah, the perfect archetype for a PF for this team is KG. From his build, to his game, to his attitude....he is exactly what we need at the 4. Of the players listed, Simmons is closest...

[shrink]

The true archetypes are Kevin McHale or Tim Duncan.

Nah, the perfect archetype for a PF for this team is KG. From his build, to his game, to his attitude....he is exactly what we need at the 4.

Man, I was already drooling, imagining the young Duncan next to KAT, and now KG?

Thanks for some very sweet dreams, guys!

[Nick K]

I don't think it will ever be a pure 5. That just doesn't seem to be how they want to build their team.

I've felt for a while that Simmons is the archetype. Movement ability has always seemed to be the top priority of the position for Rosas. Finch likes running offense through the bigs at the elbow (Simmons can do this) and he fits the requirement of getting bigger at the position to help with rebounding.

The true archetypes are Kevin McHale or Tim Duncan. Of course they are not walking in the room. The bottom line is we don't need a scorer or a passer. We need a rim protecting, rebounding demon on both ends.

We don't knw if Simmons can dominate inside. Simmons is a 14 and 7 guy and most of his boards are the easy ones. Can he block out inside? We don't know how effective he'd be there. He's a great on the ball defender but is that what we need most? Covington was a great defender and look how far that got us?

I loved Simmons coming out of the draft and like him less every year I see him.

We throw around players and picks like drunken sailors at a whorehouse for this guy. I do like him at a reduced price.

Nah, the perfect archetype for a PF for this team is KG. From his build, to his game, to his attitude....he is exactly what we need at the 4. Of the players listed, Simmons is closest...

Oh absolutely. He might be the perfect fit.

[Krapinsky]

Yes, what we need is one of the two best PF's of all time. /thread

[Calinks]

Can we stop with the "building around KAT" and "how would KAT respond" threads? He was drafted in '15 and has yet to show he's a leader that can bring the team to the playoffs. I'd much rather find players that can bring out the best of Ant. If a player can do both, great, but this should be the end of KAT being the deciding factor.

Steph Curry with Draymond Green and an "unlocked" Wiggins didn't make the playoffs. Future NBA Hall of Famer Russ Westbrook and Bradley Beal didn't make the playoffs in the east. Dame Lillard got bounced in the first round. 2021 NBA MVP Nikola Jokic got bodied in the second round. The greatest scorer in the modern era James Harden struggled after Houston blew things up and his team was not going anywhere. Can we stop with the "The wolves haven't made the playoff's because KAT can't lead them there" talk?. It's always about the team, great players still get screwed if they don't have good teams and this is doubly so if you are a big.

[Norseman79]

Yes, what we need is one of the two best PF's of all time. /thread

Well, not exactly...just one in the same mold... athletic, intense, insane work ethic, chip on shoulder, 6'10+ and move/agile like a guard focus on rebound, defense, and filling a role.