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Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC

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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#101 » by KGdaBom » Sun Aug 2, 2020 7:00 pm

Klomp wrote:To be honest, it's very possible that we won't be able to get McLaughlin on a 1+3. At least not right away. He's gonna probably want to see what the market says he's worth. If a team offers him closer to $3-4 million and Campazzo would take $5-6 million, what direction would you all prefer? At that point, we may only be able to keep one in that situation. Is it all about the bottom line, or is the talent gap wide enough to where Campazzo becomes a better value than McLaughlin? These are the types of decisions the front office will face. It's not just a simple "We like him, we'll pay him no matter what" and deal with the consequences later. That's how Thibs and other previous front offices here ran things, and that's how you get into financial struggles when trying to build a good team.

if it comes down to either or I would prefer J Mac to Campazzo at 3 vs 6. If it was 4 vs 5 I would have to look into it more. I don't think it is either or. I think we could manage to have them both.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#102 » by Klomp » Sun Aug 2, 2020 8:07 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
Klomp wrote:To be honest, it's very possible that we won't be able to get McLaughlin on a 1+3. At least not right away. He's gonna probably want to see what the market says he's worth. If a team offers him closer to $3-4 million and Campazzo would take $5-6 million, what direction would you all prefer? At that point, we may only be able to keep one in that situation. Is it all about the bottom line, or is the talent gap wide enough to where Campazzo becomes a better value than McLaughlin? These are the types of decisions the front office will face. It's not just a simple "We like him, we'll pay him no matter what" and deal with the consequences later. That's how Thibs and other previous front offices here ran things, and that's how you get into financial struggles when trying to build a good team.

if it comes down to either or I would prefer J Mac to Campazzo at 3 vs 6. If it was 4 vs 5 I would have to look into it more. I don't think it is either or. I think we could manage to have them both.

At $9 million between the two, I do think it might be an either-or situation. Think about it, Rosas didn't want to pay Jones $7 million to back up $19 million Jeff Teague, knowing he'd probably also have to pay around $1.8 million to a third-stringer like Napier. That's $9 million between two backups to a $19 million Teague. Now he has a $28 million Russell next year. I just don't see them doubling up unless they're signing one or both of them for the intent to use them as eventual trade bait.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#103 » by KGdaBom » Sun Aug 2, 2020 9:36 pm

Klomp wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
Klomp wrote:To be honest, it's very possible that we won't be able to get McLaughlin on a 1+3. At least not right away. He's gonna probably want to see what the market says he's worth. If a team offers him closer to $3-4 million and Campazzo would take $5-6 million, what direction would you all prefer? At that point, we may only be able to keep one in that situation. Is it all about the bottom line, or is the talent gap wide enough to where Campazzo becomes a better value than McLaughlin? These are the types of decisions the front office will face. It's not just a simple "We like him, we'll pay him no matter what" and deal with the consequences later. That's how Thibs and other previous front offices here ran things, and that's how you get into financial struggles when trying to build a good team.

if it comes down to either or I would prefer J Mac to Campazzo at 3 vs 6. If it was 4 vs 5 I would have to look into it more. I don't think it is either or. I think we could manage to have them both.

At $9 million between the two, I do think it might be an either-or situation. Think about it, Rosas didn't want to pay Jones $7 million to back up $19 million Jeff Teague, knowing he'd probably also have to pay around $1.8 million to a third-stringer like Napier. That's $9 million between two backups to a $19 million Teague. Now he has a $28 million Russell next year. I just don't see them doubling up unless they're signing one or both of them for the intent to use them as eventual trade bait.

You could be right, but different players. We shall see. Are we allowed to sign either now or do we have to wait?
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#104 » by Jedzz » Sun Aug 2, 2020 10:40 pm

Tyus just isn't in the same stratosphere aside from BBIQ. The more I look at Compazzo's limited looking game I think the same there. These players aren't on the same level as JMac. I could be wrong about Compazzo but everyone's just sharing videos of him with the whip passing. It appears to be accurate passing anyway. I know a few things I doubt he brings to the table.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#105 » by Jedzz » Sun Aug 2, 2020 10:49 pm

minimus wrote:
Jedzz wrote:
minimus wrote:Jedzz, you simply don't understand that simple fact, that we should not overpay players just to not see them go,


it's not overpaying him to say he deserves a guaranteed deal like the rest of the NBA. He is that capable. We found that needle in the cheap haystack. But you are going overboard on how cheap you want players for. You simply don't get that. There is nothing expensive about paying a good PG backup 3 to 5 a season if he's good.


Like I said, there are too many moving parts in JMac situation. Having him on Layman type deal as main backup PG is okay for me. Having him for 3-5mil per yer deal behind two lead ballhanlders is an overpay.


Who is the second lead ballhandler? There is no other right now. JMac can be that guy. He can also be the guy that plays with Dlo when Russell plays some off ball. It's really a great fit until you start talking about drafting someone to replace him and crossing fingers he can play as well. This Compazzo thing is left field for me. I haven't the foggiest why someone would claim he's better, and we've already talked about his cost.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#106 » by Jedzz » Sun Aug 2, 2020 11:02 pm

Klomp wrote:I think there's a very simple, easy 1-to-1 comparison people are missing when it comes to Jordan McLaughlin.....while not an exact replica of the situation, it's pretty dang close.

-Undrafted
-Spent a lot of time his first year out of college in the G League (unlike JMac, he did play in NBA games)
-Signed to a 1+1 deal (I'd argue it's the two-way deal of its time)
-Picked up off waivers by new team
-Only played 55 minutes through the first 23 games
-Team lost 11 of its previous 13 games before putting him in the lineup
-In first extended minutes, put up 25 points and 7 assists
-Finished season averaging 15/6 in 35 games (25 starts)
-Restricted free agent after season

Have you figured out who I'm talking about yet?

In restricted free agency, he was offered a 3/25 deal by another club. Did they make a mistake by not matching? Did the new team make a mistake by offering that contract? His old fan base was pissed that their team let him go, because he was destined for stardom supposedly. In two seasons with the new team, he was a full-time starter one year and averaged 13/5 over the two years but eventually got benched on teams that were first-round exits.

Still haven't figured it out?

Spoiler:
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When the New York Knicks confirmed Tuesday evening that they had decided not to match the three-year, $25.1 million offer sheet tendered by the Houston Rockets to restricted free-agent point guard Jeremy Lin, many fans expressed sadness at what they viewed as the too-soon conclusion of Lin's brief, remarkably eventful tenure in Manhattan. (This one included.) Many others stood fast against that emotional tide, though, arguing that this was a logic-based decision predicated on the financial reality that Knicks owner and Madison Square Garden chairman James Dolan simply couldn't agree to pay a still-unproven commodity with a rotation-player resume just 26 games long a whopping $14.9 million for one year of work three years from now.

https://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ball-dont-lie/jeremy-lin-knicks-james-dolan-betrayed-deceived-161820611--nba.html


Any player going to a different team with different supporting cast and different schemes is at risk for having it all go sideways. But it's foolish to predict the exact same outcome here. Sure, anything is possible.

You want to blame anyone in that situation about the contract you blame the guy who offered it. But any contract written up as 5+5+15 with something unguaranteed is precisely created to never be paid. It's an NFL type deal and they almost always get cut or restructured before the balloon final year. There is no reason to assume JMac would demand these kinds of numbers. What's wrong with 3/15 on the high end? 5yr for someone you can use at 18 minutes or 35 minutes if needed is a team friendly deal. He would be assured a home for now and then 27 when the deal is up and in Prime shape to get his next larger deal should his play turn out to confirm he's worthy for more.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#107 » by Jedzz » Sun Aug 2, 2020 11:10 pm

Klomp wrote:To be honest, it's very possible that we won't be able to get McLaughlin on a 1+3. At least not right away. He's gonna probably want to see what the market says he's worth. If a team offers him closer to $3-4 million and Campazzo would take $5-6 million, what direction would you all prefer? At that point, we may only be able to keep one in that situation. Is it all about the bottom line, or is the talent gap wide enough to where Campazzo becomes a better value than McLaughlin? These are the types of decisions the front office will face. It's not just a simple "We like him, we'll pay him no matter what" and deal with the consequences later. That's how Thibs and other previous front offices here ran things, and that's how you get into financial struggles when trying to build a good team.


How is Campazzo ever going to be a better value? I don't believe he has as deep a bag of skills as JMac. I mean if he does, someone show us some examples. If he's costing more from day 1, and this is assured with the whole buyout business, then there is no questions about better value.

If we want another passing fiend that puts effort into defense I'll roll with getting Rubio back here to back up Dlo. At least I know what he looks like in the NBA. Right now I'm expecting half those Compazzo whip passes to get picked for break outs after 10 games of people seeing him play. I don't see him getting up, or showing a burst that is going to make him a threat. I just don't right now. Convince me. He's pobably a good fit with Luka. But Dlo is not Luka.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#108 » by Jedzz » Sun Aug 2, 2020 11:23 pm



Wolves have some good young players.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#109 » by Jedzz » Fri Aug 7, 2020 11:38 pm

I count 5 missed shots in this 5 minute workout vid. Did I miss any?

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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#110 » by Jedzz » Sat Aug 8, 2020 2:32 am

How many players on the Twolves can make Kawhi Leonard look like he's in quicksand? How about twice in a game?
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#111 » by Klomp » Sat Aug 8, 2020 5:35 am

Something to remember for McLaughlin.....he's not your normal undrafted rookie two-way player who only played 30 games. He played on the Nets summer league team before a training camp invite and spending last year with the LI Nets. Then spent this summer league with Minnesota before a training camp invite and getting time in Iowa before his call-up. The systems are pretty similar.

"Yes, it was very similar (in Brooklyn). Pretty much the same. Minnesota and Iowa run the exact same thing and have the same terms for everything, so it makes the transition of being a two way player (easier)."

https://dunkingwithwolves.com/2020/03/27/minnesota-timberwolves-interview-jordan-mclaughlin-career-path/3/
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#112 » by Jedzz » Sun Aug 9, 2020 1:42 am

Klomp wrote:Something to remember for McLaughlin.....he's not your normal undrafted rookie two-way player who only played 30 games. He played on the Nets summer league team before a training camp invite and spending last year with the LI Nets. Then spent this summer league with Minnesota before a training camp invite and getting time in Iowa before his call-up. The systems are pretty similar.

"Yes, it was very similar (in Brooklyn). Pretty much the same. Minnesota and Iowa run the exact same thing and have the same terms for everything, so it makes the transition of being a two way player (easier)."

https://dunkingwithwolves.com/2020/03/27/minnesota-timberwolves-interview-jordan-mclaughlin-career-path/3/


Why should we "remember" this? is this a form of detracting from what he did as a first year player say as less special than someone who doesn't have a summer league or gleague run with the system prior to a rookie season? If it is, boy, that's reaching.

If that was your point, not saying it was, but if it was I would only point out all the second year players that win or get votes for ROY awards anyway, because it was their first year playing in the NBA. I would have loved it if JMac had gotten even 30 starts this season to see what he would have done with that. I think all you have to do is look at what he was already doing in college to realize he's just got that many skills and BBIQ and because of this it probably doesn't matter what scheme the team plays. But nobody is going to argue that it hurt him to already know the offense type, obviously we should assume that's one less thing he had to learn for this season. But Okogie knew the offense before this season, I didn't see his shooting get better. I didn't see Towns become a defensive star in this season. I didn't see Okogie's handles look in rare form. He did look like less of a chicken running around with his head cutoff this season. Some of the time anyway. That's the kind of thing you hope to see while being in the system for a second year. More knowing what to do and where to be. Being able to do anything you want with the ball in your hand tho, that's not really a system awareness thing. Maybe someone could say how well he was passing was due to knowing where everyone else should be and that's system based. Wouldn't you agree?

But I'm still thinking even that is more of his quick thinking on display and more of his general court awareness than anything else. To be able to do that with players you don't have even 700-1000 minutes playeing with was something else. Usually teams and players, even those in the same system every year, need much of the season together to start playing that well together. He was displaying an ability to bring a whole bunch of new players to him together as a whole unit when he was starting. I swear it's unique to see so young.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#113 » by old school 34 » Sun Aug 9, 2020 3:03 am

Jedzz wrote:
Klomp wrote:Something to remember for McLaughlin.....he's not your normal undrafted rookie two-way player who only played 30 games. He played on the Nets summer league team before a training camp invite and spending last year with the LI Nets. Then spent this summer league with Minnesota before a training camp invite and getting time in Iowa before his call-up. The systems are pretty similar.

"Yes, it was very similar (in Brooklyn). Pretty much the same. Minnesota and Iowa run the exact same thing and have the same terms for everything, so it makes the transition of being a two way player (easier)."

https://dunkingwithwolves.com/2020/03/27/minnesota-timberwolves-interview-jordan-mclaughlin-career-path/3/


Why should we "remember" this? is this a form of detracting from what he did as a first year player say as less special than someone who doesn't have a summer league or gleague run with the system prior to a rookie season? If it is, boy, that's reaching.

If that was your point, not saying it was, but if it was I would only point out all the second year players that win or get votes for ROY awards anyway, because it was their first year playing in the NBA. I would have loved it if JMac had gotten even 30 starts this season to see what he would have done with that. I think all you have to do is look at what he was already doing in college to realize he's just got that many skills and BBIQ and because of this it probably doesn't matter what scheme the team plays. But nobody is going to argue that it hurt him to already know the offense type, obviously we should assume that's one less thing he had to learn for this season. But Okogie knew the offense before this season, I didn't see his shooting get better. I didn't see Towns become a defensive star in this season. I didn't see Okogie's handles look in rare form. He did look like less of a chicken running around with his head cutoff this season. Some of the time anyway. That's the kind of thing you hope to see while being in the system for a second year. More knowing what to do and where to be. Being able to do anything you want with the ball in your hand tho, that's not really a system awareness thing. Maybe someone could say how well he was passing was due to knowing where everyone else should be and that's system based. Wouldn't you agree?

But I'm still thinking even that is more of his quick thinking on display and more of his general court awareness than anything else. To be able to do that with players you don't have even 700-1000 minutes playeing with was something else. Usually teams and players, even those in the same system every year, need much of the season together to start playing that well together. He was displaying an ability to bring a whole bunch of new players to him together as a whole unit when he was starting. I swear it's unique to see so young.
I do think it's something worth taking into consideration...not a negative or positive...just different. JMac and Martin should handle certain aspects of the season easier than a Naz or Nowell...just cause they've lived thru a professional season. How much that translates to production on the court...different probably for each guy? But what I do hope maybe translates is that 2nd year in the same system keeps some of those younger guys confident enough that when they do get an opportunity the next year...they understand it well enough that maybe they break thru after that speed of the game transition takes place...similar to what JMac was able to do....still requires skills first, but if you truly understand the system better chance those skills show up.

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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#114 » by Klomp » Sun Aug 9, 2020 5:05 am

Jedzz wrote:
Klomp wrote:Something to remember for McLaughlin.....he's not your normal undrafted rookie two-way player who only played 30 games. He played on the Nets summer league team before a training camp invite and spending last year with the LI Nets. Then spent this summer league with Minnesota before a training camp invite and getting time in Iowa before his call-up. The systems are pretty similar.

"Yes, it was very similar (in Brooklyn). Pretty much the same. Minnesota and Iowa run the exact same thing and have the same terms for everything, so it makes the transition of being a two way player (easier)."

https://dunkingwithwolves.com/2020/03/27/minnesota-timberwolves-interview-jordan-mclaughlin-career-path/3/


Why should we "remember" this? is this a form of detracting from what he did as a first year player say as less special than someone who doesn't have a summer league or gleague run with the system prior to a rookie season? If it is, boy, that's reaching.

If that was your point, not saying it was, but if it was I would only point out all the second year players that win or get votes for ROY awards anyway, because it was their first year playing in the NBA. I would have loved it if JMac had gotten even 30 starts this season to see what he would have done with that. I think all you have to do is look at what he was already doing in college to realize he's just got that many skills and BBIQ and because of this it probably doesn't matter what scheme the team plays. But nobody is going to argue that it hurt him to already know the offense type, obviously we should assume that's one less thing he had to learn for this season. But Okogie knew the offense before this season, I didn't see his shooting get better. I didn't see Towns become a defensive star in this season. I didn't see Okogie's handles look in rare form. He did look like less of a chicken running around with his head cutoff this season. Some of the time anyway. That's the kind of thing you hope to see while being in the system for a second year. More knowing what to do and where to be. Being able to do anything you want with the ball in your hand tho, that's not really a system awareness thing. Maybe someone could say how well he was passing was due to knowing where everyone else should be and that's system based. Wouldn't you agree?

But I'm still thinking even that is more of his quick thinking on display and more of his general court awareness than anything else. To be able to do that with players you don't have even 700-1000 minutes playeing with was something else. Usually teams and players, even those in the same system every year, need much of the season together to start playing that well together. He was displaying an ability to bring a whole bunch of new players to him together as a whole unit when he was starting. I swear it's unique to see so young.

Wow, what a reach.....I was using it as a way to compliment him, but anything said about McLaughlin by anyone other than you apparently must be an insult. He's a rookie by NBA standards but he has two full years running this offensive system. That's a good thing.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#115 » by Jedzz » Sun Aug 9, 2020 5:28 pm

Klomp wrote:Wow, what a reach.....I was using it as a way to compliment him, but anything said about McLaughlin by anyone other than you apparently must be an insult. He's a rookie by NBA standards but he has two full years running this offensive system. That's a good thing.


Oh I think like many of your points they can be pushed to either side of the fence and I think that is right where you like to exist. I accounted for the possibility that it wasn't your point. But just bringing it up begs the question of why you would bring it up and that was never offered in your first post. You are saying why now, after the fact. Thanks for clearing your point up for us. Doesn't change my thoughts on it at all though. I offered an argument for seeing the forest through the trees for anyone that might look at it through the other lens. Don't let me stop you from getting all defensive though.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#116 » by Jedzz » Sun Aug 9, 2020 6:44 pm

old school 34 wrote:I do think it's something worth taking into consideration...not a negative or positive...just different. JMac and Martin should handle certain aspects of the season easier than a Naz or Nowell...just cause they've lived thru a professional season. How much that translates to production on the court...different probably for each guy? But what I do hope maybe translates is that 2nd year in the same system keeps some of those younger guys confident enough that when they do get an opportunity the next year...they understand it well enough that maybe they break thru after that speed of the game transition takes place...similar to what JMac was able to do....still requires skills first, but if you truly understand the system better chance those skills show up.

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I do agree.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#117 » by Jedzz » Mon Aug 31, 2020 6:44 am

JMac NBA assists
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#118 » by Jedzz » Mon Aug 31, 2020 7:06 am

JMac, I mean Jcrossover before even reaching college. Ball skills, change of direction, so quick. There is a behind the head pass while he's in the air as he's attacking the basket in this clip, passing to a player left of paint that he dupicated while playing with the Twolves and passing to Towns and at least one other Timbewolves player this season. Everything he does translated to this level.
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#119 » by KGdaBom » Mon Aug 31, 2020 3:26 pm

Are we allowed to discuss contract with J Mc (it's not Mac) yet? Do we have to wait until next seasons Free Agency window? If we can't talk contract with him now we should quit worrying about how we haven't signed him yet.
If we can talk contract with him now we should Git R Dun. :D
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Re: Jordan McLaughlin - JMAC 

Post#120 » by Klomp » Mon Aug 31, 2020 5:56 pm

KGdaBom wrote:Are we allowed to discuss contract with J Mc (it's not Mac) yet? Do we have to wait until next seasons Free Agency window? If we can't talk contract with him now we should quit worrying about how we haven't signed him yet.
If we can talk contract with him now we should Git R Dun. :D

Who's worried about it?

And no, the free agency window hasn't opened yet. That's not until after the draft I believe.
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