ALL RUBIO TALK HERE

theGreatRC · Post #1161 » by **theGreatRC** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 7:33 pm

Wow, you have the same nickname as my girlfriend

nilo · Post #1162 » by **nilo** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 7:34 pm

It's me sweetheart

nilo · Post #1163 » by **nilo** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 7:34 pm

theGreatRC · Post #1164 » by **theGreatRC** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 7:37 pm

i'll be over at 7, leave the door unlocked

nilo · Post #1165 » by **nilo** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 7:50 pm

But one thing is clear. Rubio is negotiating his buyout. There can only be a reason for that: he wants to play in the NBA next season.

SportsGuy8 · Post #1166 » by **SportsGuy8** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 8:53 pm

I'm still hoping that he'll end up playing in Minnesota next year (as I said, having him in the NBA would be so much fun

), but I'm less optimistic about that lately.

The only realistic way for him to come to the NBA now is to get the buyout reduced as much as possible. But for that, Joventut needs to be desperate. And by supposedly talking to other Euro-teams (as the articles from Spain are suggesting), he's lowering that "leverage" as Joventut knows there're other better options for them to get as much $ as possible.

To me, that indicates that Rubio & his camp are probably leaning towards staying in Europe

, or else they would keep insisting that he won't play for any other European team. (well, there's also an option that his camp continues giving him bad advice)

All-in-all, it doesn't look too good.

But I still hope for a surprise news in the upcoming weeks.

KWSN-Men · Post #1167 » by **KWSN-Men** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:08 pm

SportsGuy8 wrote:WTF? Where do you see me "making jokes about you" there?

I think you're being overly sensitive, not just now, but overall. I have seen numerous times people responding to you in a totally normal way, yet you accuse them of attacking you and threaten to report them ... It's like you see conspiracies & attacks in everything ...

The funny part though, as I said, I actually defended you before, but now I'm starting to understand Genjuro (and a few others) ...

I have an advice for you: don't take life so seriously, nobody gets out alive.

You were mocking me. Anyone could see that.

KWSN-Men · Post #1168 » by **KWSN-Men** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:14 pm

Genjuro wrote:http://www.marca.com/2009/07/12/baloncesto/acb/1247413700.html

Not surprisingly, F.C.Barcelona would be interested as well in Ricky Rubio. According to this piece of news, they would be willing to offer 3 million euros to Joventut, a good salary to Rubio (I'm assuming it would be around one million euros net per year) and a very affordable buyout after the second year of the contract.

The big advantage of Barcelona? it's where Rubio lives.

The Rubio sweepstakes:
- F.C.Barcelona: almost home
- Real Madrid: money
- Unicaja Málaga: coach

Barca makes the least sense for him from a playing perspective. He has maybe 10-15 minutes a game there. But if he can leave after one year that would be his logical choice.

KWSN-Men · Post #1169 » by **KWSN-Men** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:15 pm

mnWI wrote:Joventut is already talking to an agent about bringing Pooh Jeter and Dionte Christmas in for next year. Jeter was one of the top point guards in the ACB last season.

Which only proves I am telling everyone here the truth. Euroleague is far better than the ACB.

Esohny · Post #1170 » by **Esohny** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:20 pm

I don't understand what one has to do with the other, at least in terms of that quote from mnWI.

nilo · Post #1171 » by **nilo** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:28 pm

Yes, all that is right, but for one thing. If there are teams willing to sing him he doesn't have to negotiate any buyout. When an european team wants to sign a player from the ACB that team deals directly with the player current team. That means Barça or Unicaja or any other team would negotiate Rubio's buyout with Joventud, but not Rubio himself. Once the teams agree, then the "buyer" negotiates with the player. It is always like that. The only possible reasons for Rubio to be negotiating himself his buyout is because the NBA is not allowed to pay that buyout.

KWSN-Men · Post #1172 » by **KWSN-Men** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:30 pm

john2jer wrote:Wow, the twists and turns of bad information keep coming.

Using the example provided, if you apply at American Express and the only option they give you to work is 1000 miles a way, you either take it and move, or you apply for a different company. You have no right to sue because they won't give you a job next door.

If Rubio wants to fulfill his NBA dream, it goes through Minnesota until the Wolves trade his rights. So yeah, he has to play by their rules. Even if he demands a trade, the Wolves aren't required to trade him.

Rubio is free to play basketball all he wants, but if he wants to play in the highest league in the world, he has to accept the rules they've laid down.

That's wrong. If you apply to work at American Express and they say the only place you can work is somewhere you don't want to live, they don't prevent you from ever working again in that same country because you turned them down.

Under NBA foreign rules players are slaves to whatever team drafts them and they can never play in the NBA ever if their team is not willing to give them the trade to fix their financial situation. If you don't understand that then you need to brush up on David Andersen and Luis Scola.

Rubio cannot play in the NBA with another team if the Wolves decide to play it that way because the Wolves retain his rights forever. The fact that it's financially almost impossible for him to play with them for the next 2 years has no bearing according to the NBA. You are simply wrong on that. The complaint you can make against Rubio is he should have never entered the draft.

However, actually he is also right on that in a way. The reason being, the NBA also has the rule that all foreign players are drafted in the age 22 birth year WITHOUT permission and even if the player asks not to be drafted. The Wolves own draft pick Nikola Pekovic requested to NBA teams not to draft him and he was drafted.

The Wolves may now have their own David Andersen on their hands. NBA fans act like these "Euro" players are being arrogant, when the NBA teams are BLOCKING them from playing in the NBA when they choose to and under what circumstances they want. You could make the argument Rubio should have waited 2 years before declaring for the draft and he would still have 1 year before the 22 age rule draft. However, what if he got injured during the next 2 years? Because of that possibility he is basically forced to declare for the draft as soon as he is able to possibly be drafted high. All this with him and his agent making it very clear to teams about the financial situation, meaning he had to go top 3. Does the NBA care? Of course not. Under their rules he's now a slave to the Wolves forever and they can block him from ever playing in the NBA.

Therefore, that is why a player like Rubio declares for the draft early, trying to get drafted as soon as possible, because even if they did NOT declare the NBA sets up the same rules down the line trapping them. NBA rules toward foreign players are Draconian.

Genjuro · Post #1173 » by **Genjuro** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:33 pm

Esohny wrote:I don't understand what one has to do with the other, at least in terms of that quote from mnWI.

I guess you are an ignorant American. Obviously everything, whatever it might be, proves that the Euroleague is far far better than the ACB.

That's why Rubio would only play 10-15 minutes for F.C.Barcelona. Because despite being better than Jaka Lakovic in the ACB, since Lakovic is a Euroleague player and has played so much better in the Euroleague than a one-handed Rubio, and the Euroleague is far far better than the ACB, Rubio would only play 10-15 minutes in F.C.Barcelona, which is exactly the reason why F.C.Barcelona would pay the highest buyout ever in the history of European basketball.

Even a four year-old kid would understand it. Why don't you?

KWSN-Men · Post #1174 » by **KWSN-Men** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:34 pm

Esohny wrote:I don't understand what one has to do with the other, at least in terms of that quote from mnWI.

Pooh Jeter would never be considered "one of the best point guards in the Euroleague."

deeney0 · Post #1175 » by **deeney0** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:34 pm

KWSN-Men wrote:That's wrong. If you apply to work at American Express and they say the only place you can work is somewhere you don't want to live, they don't prevent you from ever working again in that same country because you turned them down.

But they prevent you from working for American Express. There are other basketball leagues in the US, they are just far less lucrative. That's not American Express's fault/concern.

KWSN-Men wrote: You could make the argument Rubio should have waited 2 years before declaring for the draft and he would still have 1 year before the 22 age rule draft. However, what if he got injured during the next 2 years? Because of that possibility he is basically forced to declare for the draft as soon as he is able to possibly be drafted high.

Plenty of US players wait a year or two or more when they could be drafted high and take the risk to go back to school. Empty argument.

KWSN-Men · Post #1176 » by **KWSN-Men** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:35 pm

nilo wrote:Yes, all that is right, but for one thing. If there are teams willing to sing him he doesn't have to negotiate any buyout. When an european team wants to sign a player from the ACB that team deals directly with the player current team. That means Barça or Unicaja or any other team would negotiate Rubio's buyout with Joventud, but not Rubio himself. Once the teams agree, then the "buyer" negotiates with the player. It is always like that. The only possible reasons for Rubio to be negotiating himself his buyout is because the NBA is not allowed to pay that buyout.

No. If a European team pays his buyout it is a 100% for sure and certain fact he will NOT play in the NBA next year.

nilo · Post #1177 » by **nilo** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:37 pm

"No. If a European team pays his buyout it is a 100% for sure and certain fact he will NOT play in the NBA next year."

Yes, that is for sure. But that has nothing to do with what I said. Mmmm...maybe I was not clear.

john2jer · Post #1178 » by **john2jer** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:43 pm

KWSN-Men wrote:
john2jer wrote:Wow, the twists and turns of bad information keep coming.

Using the example provided, if you apply at American Express and the only option they give you to work is 1000 miles a way, you either take it and move, or you apply for a different company. You have no right to sue because they won't give you a job next door.

If Rubio wants to fulfill his NBA dream, it goes through Minnesota until the Wolves trade his rights. So yeah, he has to play by their rules. Even if he demands a trade, the Wolves aren't required to trade him.

Rubio is free to play basketball all he wants, but if he wants to play in the highest league in the world, he has to accept the rules they've laid down.

That's wrong. If you apply to work at American Express and they say the only place you can work is somewhere you don't want to live, they don't prevent you from ever working again in that same country because you turned them down.

Actualy, you're wrong. American Express would say, "You can't work for us then". You're still allowed to work in the United States, you just go apply at VISA, or MasterCard, or some other company.

Just like in this situation, if Rubio's dream is only to play in the United States, but doesn't desire to work for the company that provides the best pay/marketing ability because he doesn't like the location, then he can go play in the CBA, or ABA, or some other basketball league.

But Rubio's dream is to play in the NBA.

Just like it would be John Doe's dream to work for AmEx, then he needs to take the job they're offering him, if he desires to accomplish that dream.

It's not Ricky Rubio's right to play in the NBA, it's a priviledge that he gets to take advantage of as long as he follows the guidelines laid down by the NBA.

nilo · Post #1179 » by **nilo** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:44 pm

Rubio's buyout as such has nothing special. In Spain every professional player (soccer, bball, etc..) has such a clause. That clause is meant to put a price beforehand for the player to be free of his contract. But that buyout (called clause 1006) is basically what a Spanish or European team has to pay to sign the player. Unless the team holding the rights wants to negotiate with the "buyer" team. But in this case it is a fact that Rubio's agents are negotiating that buyout. What for? For going to the Barça? There is no reason for that. If that was the case the negotiation goes between the Barça and the Joventud. I hope that was more clear. :-)

KWSN-Men · Post #1180 » by **KWSN-Men** » Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:44 pm

nilo wrote:
"No. If a European team pays his buyout it is a 100% for sure and certain fact he will NOT play in the NBA next year."

Yes, that is for sure. But that has nothing to do with what I said. Mmmm...maybe I was not clear.

He would not negotiate actually with the team paying the buyout after he was bought out. He would never be a free agent. So yes, the team paying the buyout would deal with Joventut to come to an agreement on that amount of money, but they would not then deal with Rubio after the fact separately.

Rubio would first have to make all his concessions and agree. The way it works is another team has to want that player but the player has to have already agreed that is where he is signing. The buyout is paid once Rubio agrees to the contract. So although what you are saying is true that the club's negotiate on the buyout, the fact is Rubio is responsible for that by what he agrees to when he is negotiating with his new club. Things like contract length and amount, if there are opt out options in the contract, if there are buyouts and for how much, etc. That is what then determines what the new club will pay the old club in the buyout.

So regardless in fact it is Rubio that decides that. If he agrees to what the club paying the buyout wants in contract terms then the new club will be glad to pay Joventut exactly what they need. If not then that's a different story. Rubio taking the Unicaja offer would mean the buyout would be done really quick and easy. If Rubio took the Barca offer, then Barca would certainly probably want to lower what Joventut wants. So Rubio directly controls the buyout situation and he directly controls what team he signs with and for how long.