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2014 Draft Prospects Thread

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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1201 » by AQuintus » Tue Jun 3, 2014 1:13 am

Sakuragi_ wrote:Vonleh is probably going number 5.


This.

I think it will go:

1. Cavs - Embiid
2. Bucks - Wiggens (plays the 2 next to the Greek Freak)
3. 76ers - Parker
4. Magic - Exum (plays PG next to Oladipo)
5. Jazz - Vonleh (plays the 4 next to Favors, Kanter is moved)
6. Wolves - Gordon (picked over Randle due to better D and better range on his shot)
7. Lakers - Smart
8. Kings - Randle
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1202 » by AQuintus » Tue Jun 3, 2014 1:24 am

In case anyone's interested, Draftexpress has a couple of new videos of Vonleh up on their site. One's his workout and interview and the other is a breakdown of his games against "NBA length."

He's definitely an interesting prospect, but from what I've seen, I don't like him for the Wolves. Despite his athletic measurables, he's a below the rim player, and I don't want anymore bigs like that.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1203 » by MinneOOPalis » Tue Jun 3, 2014 2:16 am

So its basically down to Gordon or Randle if nothing changes..
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1204 » by Klomp » Tue Jun 3, 2014 2:17 am

Sakuragi_ wrote:So its basically down to Gordon or Randle if nothing changes..

Well if nothing changes, it means we haven't dealt Love, and I'm guessing neither will be there at 13
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1205 » by MinneOOPalis » Tue Jun 3, 2014 2:41 am

Theres also a chance the Jazz select Marcus Smart. They really need some depth at PG... And Trey Burke doesn't strike me as franchise PG.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1206 » by Krapinsky » Tue Jun 3, 2014 2:46 am

I'm torn between Randle and Gordon, but I like them both more than Vonleh. Randle looks like a natural. Gordon like an athletic freak. Vonleh just looks long.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1207 » by The J Rocka » Tue Jun 3, 2014 3:15 am

In certain rotations, we could play Sullinger (assuming we get him) at C and have an athletic freak like Gordon to play next to him. Both players compliment each other. Gordon can defend and get up while Sully can bang down low and stretch the floor (all the way out to 3pt territory). Not to mention, he can pass. Rubio & Sully throwing dimes to Gordon would be pure entertainment.

Gordon/Sully/Dieng is a great young nucleolus up front. Let the best man win the starting PF spot between Sully & Gordon. Of course, if we don't trade Love to Celtics, everything changes.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1208 » by phonzadellika » Tue Jun 3, 2014 3:27 am

AQuintus wrote:
Sakuragi_ wrote:Vonleh is probably going number 5.


This.

I think it will go:

1. Cavs - Embiid
2. Bucks - Wiggens (plays the 2 next to the Greek Freak)
3. 76ers - Parker
4. Magic - Exum (plays PG next to Oladipo)
5. Jazz - Vonleh (plays the 4 next to Favors, Kanter is moved)
6. Wolves - Gordon (picked over Randle due to better D and better range on his shot)
7. Lakers - Smart
8. Kings - Randle


Sorry, haven't watched much college ball this year...but I thought Gordon's shot was only slightly better than MKG's?
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1209 » by AQuintus » Tue Jun 3, 2014 3:39 am

phonzadellika wrote:Sorry, haven't watched much college ball this year...but I thought Gordon's shot was only slightly better than MKG's?


Statistically maybe, not that it matters a ton since MKG is a SF and Gordon is a PF. Form-wise? Not, Gordon's form is much better which suggests that he should be able to improve with some work.

And, again, it's Gordon vs. Randle. Gordon shot around 35% (in 1.2 attempts per gam) from college three. Randle shot 16.7% (on 0.5 attempts per game).
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1210 » by Takingbaconback » Tue Jun 3, 2014 4:24 am

The basketball gods will never show this franchise mercy. Every single year the Wolves are continuously in this uncontrollable, unfavorable spot whether it manifests on the floor, in FA, or in the draft. Yeah a lot of the recent stuff was Kahn's fault but it's like rolling a 1 all the time on a dice... The injuries, the bs officiating, FAs playing the worst they had ever played, FAs and coaches "wanting" to come here only to whisked away, lottery balls never bouncing the right way, finding good potential in players that play the same positions, finding good potential in players that don't fit together, developing talent patiently that gets over the top just as they leave the franchise, etc.

Really hope the draft picks work out but just get that feeling that whoever we choose is going to somehow not work out whether it is a lack of development, injuries, or a bad fit with Rubio. Gordon will be the next hack-a-shaq tweener victim and won't be good enough to stay on the floor in fourth quarters, Vonleh will be the next potential athletic bust that can't handle passes from Rubio, Randle will be good... just good enough so the wolves can win 9th or 10th place every year and balloon up to 300 pounds, Smart will blow up on the fans and teammates then hold out for a trade, Saric will never even come to the NBA if wolves draft him, Levine will be the next athletic Austin Rivers, McDermott will adjust very slowly and rot on the bench until he blossoms after his stay with the wolves like Redick and Korver, Stauskas will be a Kevin Martin clone as the disgruntled Martin takes him under his wing, oh God if wolves somehow draft Embiid we all know they would trade away Dieng then Pek and Embiid will be out for the season by game 5. Excuse me for my pessimism but the fortune of the team is ridiculously horrible.

Please basketball gods, let us wolves fans have nice things too this year. :banghead:
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1211 » by Feilong » Tue Jun 3, 2014 4:25 am

Aaron Gordon:
He started out the season determined to turn himself into a small forward, but it is apparent that his future is as a 4. His main weakness is very concerning. To be blunt, his jump shot is broken (similar to MKG) and while it can look solid in 1-on-0 situations, the mechanics break down when he is forced to shoot it within the speed of a game situation. While some envision a future star at the next level, look for Gordon to ultimately become an excellent defensive oriented, energy role player as a small 4.


Gordon is a tweener.
He has a SF body but because he is a terrible shooter he has to play PF.
I don't understand why you like him. 42% FT i repeat 42% FT
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1212 » by minimus » Tue Jun 3, 2014 4:46 am

Feilong wrote:Aaron Gordon:
He started out the season determined to turn himself into a small forward, but it is apparent that his future is as a 4. His main weakness is very concerning. To be blunt, his jump shot is broken (similar to MKG) and while it can look solid in 1-on-0 situations, the mechanics break down when he is forced to shoot it within the speed of a game situation. While some envision a future star at the next level, look for Gordon to ultimately become an excellent defensive oriented, energy role player as a small 4.


Gordon is a tweener.
He has a SF body but because he is a terrible shooter he has to play PF.
I don't understand why you like him. 42% FT i repeat 42% FT


I guess nobody remembers Joe Alexander.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1213 » by shangrila » Tue Jun 3, 2014 4:54 am

C.lupus wrote:He might be the worst of those three but he isn't bad on defense. He's got lateral quickness and is a pretty good post defender. The problem I have with Randle is that he's another below the rim player. He's not a rim protector and he's a questionable fit with Pekovic. He also has not outside shot.

That said, he could be an excellent fit next to Dieng going forward and I think he has the highest ceiling of those three.

No, he's bad on defence. Terrible. He's an average post defender, which is ok, but he just sucks on team defence. The game moves too fast for him and he can't react quickly to situations. I mean, he misses simple rotations and stuff like that. It's horrible to watch.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1214 » by AQuintus » Tue Jun 3, 2014 5:08 am

minimus wrote:I guess nobody remembers Joe Alexander.


Joe Alexander failed because, while he was explosive, he wasn't particularly quick (unlike Gordon), and because he quit working hard after he got drafted.

Feilong wrote:Aaron Gordon:
He started out the season determined to turn himself into a small forward, but it is apparent that his future is as a 4. His main weakness is very concerning. To be blunt, his jump shot is broken (similar to MKG) and while it can look solid in 1-on-0 situations, the mechanics break down when he is forced to shoot it within the speed of a game situation. While some envision a future star at the next level, look for Gordon to ultimately become an excellent defensive oriented, energy role player as a small 4.


Gordon is a tweener.
He has a SF body but because he is a terrible shooter he has to play PF.
I don't understand why you like him. 42% FT i repeat 42% FT


1) If you're going to post a direct quotation, you should post a link to where it's coming from. (http://hoopshype.com/draft.htm). And, really, hoopshype has Zach LaVine going in the top 10. I don't trust their analysis.

2) There's more to basketball than FT%. 42% is awful, but improvable with work.

Here's a picture of MGK shooting:

Image

Here's Gordon shooting:

Image


You can see, just by looking at their elbows that MKG's shot is completely broken and Gordons' isn't.

Here's a video of MKG shooting:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NII9RZ7HvFs[/youtube]

Here's a video of Gordon shooting (starting at 11:54):

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MeP9bTv_90?t=11m54s[/youtube]

His form isn't perfect, but he doesn't shoot on the way down with his elbow cocked inside like MKG does.

Edit: I'll also say that if shooting is your biggest weakness, then you're in pretty good shape since shooting is perhaps the easiest thing is basketball to improve upon.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1215 » by Feilong » Tue Jun 3, 2014 5:26 am

Aquintus
What are you talking about?
He can't make a free throw. 42%FT
He can't make a basket WITHOUT an opponent. Does it matter how he shoots? I am not even talking against an opponent, in action.
Maybe he should try to kick the ball, maybe that way he will be more successful.
We had a tweener. D-Will who was a very good player in college, we know how it went.
You want to trade Love and get in return as main piece a guy who can't even make a FT? Good job.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1216 » by MinneOOPalis » Tue Jun 3, 2014 5:38 am

He's a tweener.. theres no denying that.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1217 » by horaceworthy » Tue Jun 3, 2014 7:10 am

Krapinsky wrote:I'm torn between Randle and Gordon, but I like them both more than Vonleh. Randle looks like a natural. Gordon like an athletic freak. Vonleh just looks long.

Vonleh's very skilled as well, and has an NBA body to go with that length. He might also have the best motor of the three.

I like all of three of them, even though they all have their flaws. Randle's got the most questionable defense and length/athleticism, Vonleh has the most to learn about applying his strengths, Gordon has the jump shot concerns and I worry that he's a guy who wants to play SF in the long term.

I hadn't realized until last week that Spencer Dinwiddie declared for the draft. If he hadn't gotten hurt and had sustained his strong start he might have been in the mix at #13. I really like his fit next to Rubio.
"A while back,'' Cardinal said, "I took a picture of the standings and texted it to Love, just to bust his chops,'' Cardinal said. "He sent me a picture back of a snowdrift.''
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1218 » by Maefteda » Tue Jun 3, 2014 9:51 am

Feilong wrote:Aquintus We had a tweener. D-Will who was a very good player in college, we know how it went.
You want to trade Love and get in return as main piece a guy who can't even make a FT? Good job.

They are two different kind of tweeners though. Williams couldn't defend either position as a tweener, because he wasn't long/strong enough to guard PFs and wasn't quick enough to guard SFs. He tried to adjust to a new position every year, which hampered his shooting development and meant that he had no go to moves.

Gordon can defend at least 2, maybe 3 positions and actually has a skill that can separate him in the NBA. He's athletic enough to make a real impact on offense. I don't know about you, but if we could, I'd draft Blake Griffin or Andre Drummond if they were just coming along in this draft, and they were both (are in Drummond's case) really bad FT shooters.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1219 » by Feilong » Tue Jun 3, 2014 10:50 am

Maefteda wrote:
Feilong wrote:Aquintus We had a tweener. D-Will who was a very good player in college, we know how it went.
You want to trade Love and get in return as main piece a guy who can't even make a FT? Good job.

They are two different kind of tweeners though. Williams couldn't defend either position as a tweener, because he wasn't long/strong enough to guard PFs and wasn't quick enough to guard SFs. He tried to adjust to a new position every year, which hampered his shooting development and meant that he had no go to moves.

Gordon can defend at least 2, maybe 3 positions and actually has a skill that can separate him in the NBA. He's athletic enough to make a real impact on offense. I don't know about you, but if we could, I'd draft Blake Griffin or Andre Drummond if they were just coming along in this draft, and they were both (are in Drummond's case) really bad FT shooters.


I don't agree with your analysis. The reason is because you compare apples with oranges.
You compare D-Will as pro (against NBA players) and Gordon as college student. So let's compare similar things.
D-Will as college student wasn't a bad defender.
Defensively, Williams puts in a better effort than you typically see from a collegiate go-to guy. He does a good job of staying in front of opponents and shows strong fundamentals, as you would expect from a Sean Miller-coached player. He's usually in an attentive stance both on and off the ball and does his best to bother his matchup, even if he lacks the physical tools to be overly productive in terms of getting his team extra possessions. The aggressiveness he brings on this end will lead to some foul trouble on occasion, though, which is something that has limited his minutes at times this season.

http://search.draftexpress.com/profile/ ... iams-5811/

a)So yes Gordon can defend in college. D-Will could also but in NBA? Who knows? D-Will in NBA cannot (according to you and i agree).
b)Griffin in college 71.5% FT, Gordon 42% If Griffin was a bad FT shooter with 71% what does this mean for Gordon?
c)Drummond's college FT% was similar to Gordon's. But centers (Howard, Shaq ,Dieng etc) usually struggle with their shot. Bigger hands, finders, poor body balance etc. I've never heard a SF who can't shoot FTs. Especially if you want this guy to be your main piece for Love.
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Re: 2014 Draft Prospects Thread 

Post#1220 » by minimus » Tue Jun 3, 2014 11:50 am

Am I the only one who believes that Dieng+Vonleh+Rubio combo has more potential that Pek+Gordon+Rubio?

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