Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition

[BlacJacMac]

Wolves need to pick up Hayward after he is bought out, he played with Rudy right?

Not sure any team trades for him just to buy him out. Also not sure the Rudy connection is enough to bring him to us.

Maybe the #1 seed is though.

[MN7725]

Wolves need to pick up Hayward after he is bought out, he played with Rudy right?

Not sure any team trades for him just to buy him out. Also not sure the Rudy connection is enough to bring him to us.

Maybe the #1 seed is though.

Minutes, opportunity to play trumps everything
Wolves would be near bottom for any buyout player as roster stands now

[winforlose]

Not sure any team trades for him just to buy him out. Also not sure the Rudy connection is enough to bring him to us.

Maybe the #1 seed is though.

Minutes, opportunity to play trumps everything
Wolves would be near bottom for any buyout player as roster stands now

Not always. Ring chasers who see us as a safe bet would be interested. Also Hayward would be in our rotation. We would expand it to get him minutes. His shooting would help a lot.

[BlacJacMac]

Not sure any team trades for him just to buy him out. Also not sure the Rudy connection is enough to bring him to us.

Maybe the #1 seed is though.

Minutes, opportunity to play trumps everything
Wolves would be near bottom for any buyout player as roster stands now

For young kids, sure.

But if titles are the goal a smaller role on a good team trumps big minutes on a bad one.

[MN7725]

Maybe the #1 seed is though.

Minutes, opportunity to play trumps everything
Wolves would be near bottom for any buyout player as roster stands now

For young kids, sure.

But if titles are the goal a smaller role on a good team trumps big minutes on a bad one.

Agreed, but I think other teams have clearer path to play

Brown jr isn’t in the rotation right now, even though he’s been pretty decent

Whereas Suns, Hayward would likely get big role, maybe start

[Neeva]

Suns wouldn’t be able to sign Hayward if he is bought out They are over the tax apron, same as Nuggets, Celtics, Bucks and Clippers.
Only contending teams currently that can are Wolves and 76ers.

[MN7725]

Suns wouldn’t be able to sign Hayward if he is bought out They are over the tax apron, same as Nuggets, Celtics, Bucks and Clippers.
Only contending teams currently that can are Wolves and 76ers.

Good point!
That would hugely improve Wolves chances

[winforlose]

Suns wouldn’t be able to sign Hayward if he is bought out They are over the tax apron, same as Nuggets, Celtics, Bucks and Clippers.
Only contending teams currently that can are Wolves and 76ers.

Are you sure being over the first apron prevents butout signing? I thought the rule was for the 2nd apron.

[BlacJacMac]

What are the penalties for the first apron?

The first apron hits when a team's payroll exceeds $172 million. At this point, the following restrictions are triggered:

Teams cannot acquire a player in a sign-and-trade if that player keeps them above the apron

Teams cannot sign a player waived during the regular season whose salary was over the $12.2 million midlevel exception

Salary matching in trades must be within 110 percent, rather than 125 percent for teams not above the apron

[BlacJacMac]

What are the penalties for the second apron?

All of the penalties for the first apron apply to the second apron as well, which is triggered when a team's salary exceeds $182.5 million. For the 2023-24 season, one additional penalty is added when crossing the second apron:

No access to the $5 million taxpayer midlevel exception

Starting at the end of the 2023-24 season, even more restrictions will be added to the second apron. These include:

Teams cannot use a trade exception generated by aggregating the salaries of multiple players

Teams cannot include cash in a trade

Teams cannot use a trade exception generated in a prior year

First-round picks seven years out are frozen (unable to be traded)

A team's first-round pick is moved to the end of the first round if they remain in the second apron for three out of five seasons

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nba/news/nba-second-apron-explained-salary-cap-team-spending/efo6htjzzmzrswoncvvlbmhi

[TimberKat]

What are the penalties for the second apron?

All of the penalties for the first apron apply to the second apron as well, which is triggered when a team's salary exceeds $182.5 million. For the 2023-24 season, one additional penalty is added when crossing the second apron:

No access to the $5 million taxpayer midlevel exception

Starting at the end of the 2023-24 season, even more restrictions will be added to the second apron. These include:

Teams cannot use a trade exception generated by aggregating the salaries of multiple players

Teams cannot include cash in a trade

Teams cannot use a trade exception generated in a prior year

First-round picks seven years out are frozen (unable to be traded)

A team's first-round pick is moved to the end of the first round if they remain in the second apron for three out of five seasons

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nba/news/nba-second-apron-explained-salary-cap-team-spending/efo6htjzzmzrswoncvvlbmhi

In that case, let's go over it 3 years in a row to ensure the 2027 unprotected picks to UTA is #27 and above . Besides the 5M tax payer exception, would any of the restrictions in 1st and 2nd Apron impacted how Wolves made trades? If your roster is very much set, you can navigate around it as it is meant to keep teams continue pile on talent like the Clippers.

[cmoss84]

Shake, 2nd rd pick and WMJ for Prince and Wood?
Lakers are in a weird position. Who knows what they do...

[BlacJacMac]

No thanks on Wood.

There is something super off about that guy.

I’ve never seen a guy as talented as he is wear out his welcome so fast, so often.

[Domejandro]

Getting Gordon Hayward would be absolutely massive for Minnesota. Dude is still a really solid player.

Realistically, he should go to a team that can offer him minutes for one last pay day (no reason for him to come here and play less than twenty minutes a game, unless he desperately is gunning for a Championship), but he legitimately would be a dream fit for Minnesota's roster.

[minimus]

Getting Gordon Hayward would be absolutely massive for Minnesota. Dude is still a really solid player.

Realistically, he should go to a team that can offer him minutes for one last pay day (no reason for him to come here and play less than twenty minutes a game, unless he desperately is gunning for a Championship), but he legitimately would be a dream fit for Minnesota's roster.

I wonder if players in situation like Hayward in CHA, or Tyus Jones / Delon Wright in WAS, or Monte Morris in DET would love to get a chance in MIN because we are winning.

[TwolvesFanRome]

Milton / McDermott straight up could work?

[TimberKat]

Let's swing for the fences:
Assume ARod sorted it out with the new ownership group and all agree we are one player away from NBA Championship. They welcome 2nd apron with open arms to bring a NBA Championship to Minnesota. What is the one move that put us over the top?
1. We want to keep Naz, JMcD, and Conley as much as possible. KA's wing/glue production needs to be replace if he is traded
2. Our draft assets are: 2024 1st (draft day only unless under the table), 2024 2nd; 2026 2nd; 2028 2nd; 2029 2nd
3. Tyus Jones or Gordon Hayward are good but don't feel like that will get us pass LAC/OKC/DEN.

How about:
1. Murray for JMcD + KA : We will need wing replacement and also don't want to give up JMcD, a big maybe for me
2. Murray for 2024 1st, Miller, all available 2nds - off season draft day move, not sure how cap works at that point. Do they count this year or next year's salary?
3. Brogdon for JMcD: Not sure this one put us over the top but will have a little more apron flexibility, maybe?
4. Brogdon for Miller, all 2nds, salary filler: Love it but not sure that is enough for POR
5. Zack for whatever: Just won't work unless Gobert or Towns is part of it, so no.
6. DeRozan for non essential: salary doesn't work unless include KA, Naz, or Conley, so no
7. Siakam for whatever: doesn't work unless it's Gobert, so no.
8. Markkanen + Sexton for Naz + Miller + KA+ all 2nds + Milton + Moore + TBJ: We go big boy and take on Sexton's bad contract but we will have the biggest balls of them all. May not be enough for the Grinch
9. Markkanen + Sexton + one MN 1st for Naz + JMcD + Miller + all 2nds + salary filler: Now is a maybe for me... Will still do it.

[moss_is_1]

Milton / McDermott straight up could work?

McDermott makes over 13m and Shake only makes 5. Not any realistic scenario to get him here.

[younggunsmn]

I don't know why CHA would buy out Hayward besides doing him a solid.
He's got another calf injury which tend to linger.

There's a chance he gets dealt to the Lakers once they realize no one wants their garbage contracts, but I have a hard time seeing Charlotte want the guaranteed money left on Russell/hachimura's salary matching.

A healthy Hayward would be a perfect fit offensively on our bench unit.
But I question whether he can still play defense at the level we are currently asking.
And he has a bit of Mike Miller syndrome where he has become reluctant to drive the ball all the way to the hoop or pull the trigger on his 3 point shot.

[younggunsmn]

MIN IN: Jalen McDaniels, Garrett Temple
TOR IN: Shake Milton, Wendell Moore Jr

Why for MIN: Trade a free agent signing who is not working out for a potential KA bench replecement for next year and 3/4 injury insurance for this year.
Get off of Moore's 2.5 mil guarantee and open a roster spot for next year.
Temple is a "break glass in case of emergency" veteran wing defende.

Why for TOR: Get off the 4.7 mil guaranteed for next year to McDaniels who is a free agent signing that is not working out well.
Take a chance on Milton, who was a good player last year and might thrive in a change of scenery.
If it doesn't work he is owed no money next year. If it does, they have a really cheap bench piece to potentially replace Gary Trent Jr.
They get a look at a former late 1st in Moore and the chance to see if a change of scenery might help, for very little investment.

Wolves also get the added bonus of bringing Jaden's brother here, and hope that helps Jaden to mature and feel at home here.

I would even throw Minott in for free and use that roster spot on a minimum PG.

I think there's a good chance we don't exericse Minott's '24 option and he is waived before free agency starts because we prefer to fill that roster spot with a veteran who can actually contribute, since we will be potentially adding 2 more draft picks.