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Constructing the Timberwolves rotation

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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1301 » by Jedzz » Sun Dec 20, 2020 4:40 am

wolves_89 wrote:I think the expectations for Edwards are a bit too high for this season. In a normal off-season, rookies are drafted and then have 3-4 months to work with coaches, establish a routine, learn the system, and play in summer league. This year none of that happened. I find it unlikely that a 19 year old is going to come in and start with no knowledge of the system or time to adjust to a completely new way of life. My guess for Edwards is he comes off the bench for 15-20 minutes a night to start the year and gradually gets more minutes as he demonstrates that he deserves them.

Another factor is that the Wolves are actually trying to win this year, which is a different situation than the majority of high draft picks are in. Typically the top draftees can come in and get big minutes even though their on-court production is awful and they are damaging their teams ability to compete. The Wolves have enough talent to be competitive and a clear incentive to prioritize winning sooner rather than later, so I'm expecting Edwards to be integrated much slower than a lot of people hope.


That should be the story. But it should have been last year also with Culver as he began the season with 4 games up to 16 minutes and that was a good number to stick with. Then by game 7 he's already starting at one of the hardest positions for a rookie to excel at. About the only limit they seemed to put on Culver was keeping him under 30 minutes.

I think Edwards will have much the same limits, none except for being kept under 30 minutes. The excuse might be the very first 19 sickness or injury. Might not even wait for that. They showcase him as much as they can is my guess for better or worse. We' will see, but he's available in trade if they can get a bigtime player back. If their history is any indication they won't sloroll him.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1302 » by minimus » Sun Dec 20, 2020 8:13 am

KGdaBom wrote:
minimus wrote:I also see why Zylan Cheatham might end up as a steal. He is a hardworker, big wing, uberathletic, aggressive, high IQ, dominated gleague, excellent rebounder. He also is a perfect fit in five-out system. I wonder what type of contract he signed, is it gleague contract? Hinkie/Gupta special?


If I understand correctly he's already been waived/


You are right. Hope he will return to Iowa
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1303 » by Jedzz » Sun Dec 20, 2020 8:36 am

minimus wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
minimus wrote:I also see why Zylan Cheatham might end up as a steal. He is a hardworker, big wing, uberathletic, aggressive, high IQ, dominated gleague, excellent rebounder. He also is a perfect fit in five-out system. I wonder what type of contract he signed, is it gleague contract? Hinkie/Gupta special?


If I understand correctly he's already been waived/


You are right. Hope he will return to Iowa


Wonder what they didn't like about him. Too competitive?
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1304 » by Jedzz » Mon Dec 21, 2020 1:23 am

What is your "thibs lineup" (7 guys) of this team?
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1305 » by Norseman79 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 1:51 am

Jedzz wrote:What is your "thibs lineup" (7 guys) of this team?


Russell
Beasley
Okoge
Juancho
Towns
Rubio
Layman

If I was forced to pick 7 that I think they would pick it would be that. My personal top 7 would look a bit different,but I am all for swinging for the fences and not playing the style they are hung up on.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1306 » by Calinks » Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:13 am

I think people are being too reactionary towards some guys. Seeing a lot of negativity surrounding Layman, Okogie, Russell, Juancho. I think they all will improve from some of the bad stuff we have seen in pre-season. On top of that, they have shown flashes or had good stints outside of maybe Juancho in those 3 games.

We need to evaluate the team for several games before we demand so and so should be benched for life or is useless.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1307 » by Klomp » Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:41 am

Wonder if they'll consider Dzanan Musa...
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1308 » by Norseman79 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 4:04 am

Klomp wrote:Wonder if they'll consider Dzanan Musa...


I mean, you would think....any player with some length and height that can handle and shoot a bit would get a look
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1309 » by Jedzz » Mon Dec 21, 2020 12:47 pm

Calinks wrote:I think people are being too reactionary towards some guys. Seeing a lot of negativity surrounding Layman, Okogie, Russell, Juancho. I think they all will improve from some of the bad stuff we have seen in pre-season. On top of that, they have shown flashes or had good stints outside of maybe Juancho in those 3 games.

We need to evaluate the team for several games before we demand so and so should be benched for life or is useless.

It doesn't really matter either way. This is who they paid. So this is the team until they change it.

If people want to complain I say go for it. Complain until they give you a reason not to if it helps them feel better about what they see for this coming season.

I had higher hopes for the season too before seeing some of these guys in the preseason. As I noticed you left Culver's name out of this likely because he appeared to show better play than when we last saw him last season. No one is going to complain about them if they show up able to play looking improved or at least ready. It was a terrible offseason, chincy camp process, terrible 2020 year. Can't wait to turn the page.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1310 » by Dewey » Mon Dec 21, 2020 6:34 pm

DLo/Beasley/Culver/Layman/KAT

Rubio/Edwards/Okogie/Juancho/Reid

McL/Nowell/McDaniels/Vanderbilt/Reid

I like the potential in McDaniels and hope he puts the work in. Wasn’t a fan of the pick, but he has some knack to the game. Lastly, I do feel like a trade is coming ... seems like we could be a smaller conveying part of a bigger deal
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1311 » by Calinks » Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:17 pm

Jedzz wrote:
Calinks wrote:I think people are being too reactionary towards some guys. Seeing a lot of negativity surrounding Layman, Okogie, Russell, Juancho. I think they all will improve from some of the bad stuff we have seen in pre-season. On top of that, they have shown flashes or had good stints outside of maybe Juancho in those 3 games.

We need to evaluate the team for several games before we demand so and so should be benched for life or is useless.

It doesn't really matter either way. This is who they paid. So this is the team until they change it.

If people want to complain I say go for it. Complain until they give you a reason not to if it helps them feel better about what they see for this coming season.

I had higher hopes for the season too before seeing some of these guys in the preseason. As I noticed you left Culver's name out of this likely because he appeared to show better play than when we last saw him last season. No one is going to complain about them if they show up able to play looking improved or at least ready. It was a terrible offseason, chincy camp process, terrible 2020 year. Can't wait to turn the page.

Sure they can complain, I'm just trying to talk people down from going nuts over 3 pre-season games. I still think Layman is going to be a useful piece for this team, maybe he shouldn't be starting but he's a solid player who can help on multiple ends. On that same token, Culver will have some bad games too, I highly doubt he's going to be great every game. We can read some into pre-season but you need a lot more time to get a better handle on the situation.

I also think we will be better than some suspect. That still doesn't mean a playoff team, I think the West is really just that good. If we are close to .500 that is a big improvement over where we have been. I don't think .500 makes the playoffs this season though. This team is also not at all a final product, if you saw what Rosas did last season with middling players, a few of them who may not even be in the league for long, you should know that he has the ability to reshape the roster at all times.

He moved both Wiggins and Deing contracts which I think were seen as worse than any contract we have right now. He turned a bunch of none shooters into shooters, he will keep making moves when he sees opportunities or feels like something isn't working.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1312 » by Dual » Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:23 pm

Calinks wrote:
Jedzz wrote:
Calinks wrote:I think people are being too reactionary towards some guys. Seeing a lot of negativity surrounding Layman, Okogie, Russell, Juancho. I think they all will improve from some of the bad stuff we have seen in pre-season. On top of that, they have shown flashes or had good stints outside of maybe Juancho in those 3 games.

We need to evaluate the team for several games before we demand so and so should be benched for life or is useless.

It doesn't really matter either way. This is who they paid. So this is the team until they change it.

If people want to complain I say go for it. Complain until they give you a reason not to if it helps them feel better about what they see for this coming season.

I had higher hopes for the season too before seeing some of these guys in the preseason. As I noticed you left Culver's name out of this likely because he appeared to show better play than when we last saw him last season. No one is going to complain about them if they show up able to play looking improved or at least ready. It was a terrible offseason, chincy camp process, terrible 2020 year. Can't wait to turn the page.

Sure they can complain, I'm just trying to talk people down from going nuts over 3 pre-season games. I still think Layman is going to be a useful piece for this team, maybe he shouldn't be starting but he's a solid player who can help on multiple ends. On that same token, Culver will have some bad games too, I highly doubt he's going to be great every game. We can read some into pre-season but you need a lot more time to get a better handle on the situation.

I also think we will be better than some suspect. That still doesn't mean a playoff team, I think the West is really just that good. If we are close to .500 that is a big improvement over where we have been. I don't think .500 makes the playoffs this season though. This team is also not at all a final product, if you saw what Rosas did last season with middling players, a few of them who may not even be in the league for long, you should know that he has the ability to reshape the roster at all times.

He moved both Wiggins and Deing contracts which I think were seen as worse than any contract we have right now. He turned a bunch of none shooters into shooters, he will keep making moves when he sees opportunities or feels like something isn't working.

Close to .500 gives you play-in games for sure. Which for me is the realistic objective.
But who knows, it will depend on injuries/Covid around the league.
Last game by Towns on the defensive end and more so what he said after is what makes me feel, this one can be his year.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1313 » by Jedzz » Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:44 am

Dual wrote:Close to .500 gives you play-in games for sure. Which for me is the realistic objective.
But who knows, it will depend on injuries/Covid around the league.
Last game by Towns on the defensive end and more so what he said after is what makes me feel, this one can be his year.


I didn't hear what Towns said after, but in the games seeing him blocking shots in preseason games and reaching over from behind in a way that doesn't foul gives me hope. I remember seeing him I think as a rookie do that to someone that side stepped him on the perimeter to get their shot off. He reached over his head from behind to take the ball touching nothing but ball. Each year he's added something new to the next season that he has excelled at. If he's chosen defense or blocking shots, it would make a big difference.

I was just listening to NFL Today radio and they were talking center rankings after a short spot complaining about Gobert's new deal. Saying that if AD is considered a PF (which is what he calls himself most), then the Rankings for Center go 1. Jokic, 2. Embiid 3. Giannis. Never mentioned Towns, not even Gobert once they started talking rankings. I think Towns needs to make a move into complete player this season and make these people take notice.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1314 » by Dual » Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:28 am

Jedzz wrote:
Dual wrote:Close to .500 gives you play-in games for sure. Which for me is the realistic objective.
But who knows, it will depend on injuries/Covid around the league.
Last game by Towns on the defensive end and more so what he said after is what makes me feel, this one can be his year.


I didn't hear what Towns said after, but in the games seeing him blocking shots in preseason games and reaching over from behind in a way that doesn't foul gives me hope. I remember seeing him I think as a rookie do that to someone that side stepped him on the perimeter to get their shot off. He reached over his head from behind to take the ball touching nothing but ball. Each year he's added something new to the next season that he has excelled at. If he's chosen defense or blocking shots, it would make a big difference.

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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1315 » by Dewey » Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:56 am

I’d be happy if his whiny “I’m gonna cry” antics cease... both ends of the floor.

Fundamentally: KAT is a poor anticipator defensively - therefore a poor help defender. Feet are slow to defend in space, and when he tries, he often fouls. His best bet is to study more to improve anticipation.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1316 » by minimus » Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:07 am

Dewey wrote:Fundamentally: KAT is a poor anticipator defensively - therefore a poor help defender. Feet are slow to defend in space, and when he tries, he often fouls. His best bet is to study more to improve anticipation.


Yes, it is pretty annoying when KAT does not understand how contain point of attack without fouling by using his body and position wisely. He chooses wrong angles/vectors in defense, and his footwork is inconsistent.

When Marc Gasol came in NBA he was an awful defender. But he studied the game, he was constantly asking referees for explanation. He remained a slow feet defender, but he is an exceptional positional defender, he uses his body and hands to alter shots or just making opponent life in offense harder. And Marc buys into team defense, rather than carrying team defense by making heroic things.

This should be the next step for KAT: trust team defense and improve defensive awareness. We can see that he actually tries in defense, but without awareness it is just an equivalent of forcing shots in offense. He has all tools, he is not slow footed as many bigs. It sucks that we have not been having any kind of continuity at PF, to help him to improve. But I am sure that Rosas is working on it.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1317 » by shrink » Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:00 pm

Dewey wrote: His best bet is to study more to improve anticipation.

Like Kyler Murray, right?

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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1318 » by Medall21 » Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:25 pm

If you want to give your best and build a winning culture:

R.Rubio
D.Russell / M.Beasley
A.Edwards
Trade / J.Hernangomez
K.A.Towns / N.Reid

If you want to rebuild for 749th season in a row, finish 14-68 and try to develop players who when they are ready leave for a mega fancy franchise keep the rotation as it is.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1319 » by Jedzz » Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:58 pm

Medall21 wrote:If you want to give your best and build a winning culture:

R.Rubio
D.Russell / M.Beasley
A.Edwards
Trade / J.Hernangomez
K.A.Towns / N.Reid

If you want to rebuild for 749th season in a row, finish 14-68 and try to develop players who when they are ready leave for a mega fancy franchise keep the rotation as it is.


I like your tone. However what is the rotation as it is that you refer to. We are closely following this team and most of us can't truly say we know what they will do without any doubts right now.
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Re: Constructing the Timberwolves rotation 

Post#1320 » by Dewey » Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:22 pm

shrink wrote:
Dewey wrote: His best bet is to study more to improve anticipation.

Like Kyler Murray, right?


that's good!!! 8-)
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