Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition

[shrink]

I think it’s highly likely we trade Wendell Moore Jr to a team for cap space and a fake 2nd, and sign a vet min replacement.

Replacing Moore’s $2,421,720 salary with a pro-rated 2 year vet min at the deadline ($767,488), would cut $1,654,232, and make many more trades possible that leave us under the luxury threshold.

[shrink]

For example,

$21,483,448 IN: Monte Morris, Alec Burks, 2 year vet min ($767,488), 0 year vet min ($425,434)
$20,641,232 OUT: Anderson, Troy Brown Jr, Shake Milton, Wendell Moore Jr. (WMJ to a third team)

This overall deal adds $842,216 (if my math is right).

We are currently $2,362,588 under the lux, and even if Conley’s $1.5 mil bonus kicks in.. we squeeze in, adding $2,342,216!

20k under!

[BlacJacMac]

I also think people need to realize how to fix turnovers. There is bringing in a seive defensively like Tyus Jones who slows down the pace, controls the ball and decisions, decreases the ceiling, pace and dynamicness of an offense, takes the ball out of Towns/ANT hands but also helps turnovers.

There is also spacing which helps turnovers. When players have ample space, they aren't turning the ball over. When players don't have clean and clear passing lanes, the lane is clogged, and teams can actively help-off non-shooters, it increases turnovers. Adding someone like Burks increases spacing, which, as a by-product, decreases turnovers.

He's started every game for the fastest paced team in the league this year.

(Yeah, I was surprised by that too!)

[BlacJacMac]

For example,

$21,483,448 IN: Monte Morris, Alec Burks, 2 year vet min ($767,488), 0 year vet min ($425,434)
$20,641,232 OUT: Anderson, Troy Brown Jr, Shake Milton, Wendell Moore Jr. (WMJ to a third team)

This overall deal adds $842,216 (if my math is right).

We are currently $2,362,588 under the lux, and even if Conley’s $1.5 mil bonus kicks in.. we squeeze in, adding $2,342,216!

20k under!

I'd do that.

[winforlose]

Burks has been red hot from three point recently, but I wonder whether his shooting is sustainable in MIN, in limited minutes and role. In other words, if we put TBJ in DET, could he had multiple 30+ points game with 7-8 made threes? Does Burks have better than TBJ dribbling, or passing and more importantly defense?

He may not score 30 here but his shooting is definitely sustainable. He’s been a 40% shooter from 3 on volume for several years, mostly off the bench. He’s also a significantly better creator/scorer than TBJ. Passer? I’m not sure. Defense? He’s physically capable of being a net neutral but not sure he’s shown the effort on the Pistons.

The other benefit is that he’s already played with Rudy/Gobert.

Yup. Burks has been a 41% 3P shooter over the past 4 seasons, which is 1093 3PA and 84% from the FT Line on 684 FTA.

Burks is larger than TBJ, and he would provide spacing and size without sacrificing defense.

I also think people need to realize how to fix turnovers. There is bringing in a seive defensively like Tyus Jones who slows down the pace, controls the ball and decisions, decreases the ceiling, pace and dynamicness of an offense, takes the ball out of Towns/ANT hands but also helps turnovers.

There is also spacing which helps turnovers. When players have ample space, they aren't turning the ball over. When players don't have clean and clear passing lanes, the lane is clogged, and teams can actively help-off non-shooters, it increases turnovers. Adding someone like Burks increases spacing, which, as a by-product, decreases turnovers.

Tyus is shooting better than 50/40/73 with decent volume. He is averaging 12.4 shots and 1.2 steals. I don’t think you and I are talking about the same Tyus Jones. That said, Morris works too. I am not sure about Burks. His from the field is under 40% and that is dangerous. Feels like we are heading back into Beasley territory where we lose defense for offense and get a guy who lives and dies by the 3. Burk’s doesn’t rebound his position well, is below .5 in either steal or blocks, and has had roughly 1/3 of his games be 0 or 1 made 3 on high volume. Averages can be inflated by a hot streak, and that is a lot of money that could help with a two way player. I have very mixed feelings about this.

[moss_is_1]

Burks would be a nice get. I think we definitely need someone that's able to score the ball off the bench with Naz.

Kyle needs to be shipped out. Loved him and his play, but his offense is awful. He's 4th in the league in TOV%, refuses to shoot and ruins spacing. He just can't be in the lineup with Rudy/Naw and Jmac.

[shangrila]

For example,

$21,483,448 IN: Monte Morris, Alec Burks, 2 year vet min ($767,488), 0 year vet min ($425,434)
$20,641,232 OUT: Anderson, Troy Brown Jr, Shake Milton, Wendell Moore Jr. (WMJ to a third team)

This overall deal adds $842,216 (if my math is right).

We are currently $2,362,588 under the lux, and even if Conley’s $1.5 mil bonus kicks in.. we squeeze in, adding $2,342,216!

20k under!

I'd do that.

0 year vet min you say?

Bah gawd, that's Trevor Keels' music!

[Flashtaco]

One year ago at trade deadline:

DLO nets you Michael Conley, NAW and 3 SRP

Today:

Teams are running away from any trade that has DLO (yes, I realize his 2 year option has changed some things).

[moss_is_1]

Looking at teams that may be selling come deadline. Are there pieces out there we could try and snag?

Detroit - Burks and Morris fit the bill the most. Guys like Joe Harris and Bogdanovic would be nice but they just make too much $$
Wizards - Tyus/Delon Wright, Shamet, Kispert. Report came out they want picks and mentioned Avdija. I don't see him getting moved, hes a good young player, and just signed an extension so hes PPP making it extra difficult to match his salary.
Hornets - Cody Martin?
Raptors - Jalen McDaniels, Otto Porter, Schroeder, Gary Trent - either not very good options or make too much money.
Nets - DFS, Royce Oneal - Could be something. Royce has the Utah connection.
Bulls - Caruso, Jevon Carter, Torrey Craig - Caruso would be my #1 choice, but feel he may cost too much and overlap with NAW.
Spurs - Mcdermott, Graham, Osman - Mcdermotts shooting would be nice, but hes expensive(13m)
Grizz - Kennard probably makes too much for us to consider

not sure I see a whole lot else. Utah has some nice pieces but not for use really.

Caruso is my dream, but Burks with Morris would be a pretty nice get depending who we send out.

[moss_is_1]

One year ago at trade deadline:

DLO nets you Michael Conley, NAW and 3 SRP

Today:

Teams are running away from any trade that has DLO (yes, I realize his 2 year option has changed some things).

Can't believe we ever thought DLO was better than Mike.

[winforlose]

One year ago at trade deadline:

DLO nets you Michael Conley, NAW and 3 SRP

Today:

Teams are running away from any trade that has DLO (yes, I realize his 2 year option has changed some things).

Can't believe we ever thought DLO was better than Mike.

Dlo was expiring, this year he has 18.7 of bad money next year. Dlo is younger than Mike and trading for Mike put us in a weird salary spot. It wasn’t so much about talent as long term planning. Finally Mike’s age was a real threat for quality slide. But yes you are correct that while Mike has in many ways played his best basketball (of a very long and distinguished career,) Dlo had one of the worst Decembers in the NBA. Dlo is also pretty toxic after his comment about not improving on defense because that isn’t what he does.

[TimberKat]

One year ago at trade deadline:

DLO nets you Michael Conley, NAW and 3 SRP

Today:

Teams are running away from any trade that has DLO (yes, I realize his 2 year option has changed some things).

Can't believe we ever thought DLO was better than Mike.

Dlo was expiring, this year he has 18.7 of bad money next year. Dlo is younger than Mike and trading for Mike put us in a weird salary spot. It wasn’t so much about talent as long term planning. Finally Mike’s age was a real threat for quality slide. But yes you are correct that while Mike has in many ways played his best basketball (of a very long and distinguished career,) Dlo had one of the worst Decembers in the NBA. Dlo is also pretty toxic after his comment about not improving on defense because that isn’t what he does.

I am no DsLow fan but his ceiling in point production is much higher than Conley. The good DLo, which don't show up often, can carry the second unit. The original plan of Ant, Towns, DLo are enough scoring against any team. We won't have to worry about 4qt drought. But do have to worry about 4th qtr defense. It's very reasonable to think he has higher trade value. However, if you don't work in LAL, BKN, GSW, MIN, and LAL than I don't know where is a good landing spot? So, the contract does look bad now.

[BlacJacMac]

One year ago at trade deadline:

DLO nets you Michael Conley, NAW and 3 SRP

Today:

Teams are running away from any trade that has DLO (yes, I realize his 2 year option has changed some things).

Can't believe we ever thought DLO was better than Mike.

Not me. Ever.

Yeah, he can get hot scoring, but he's completely disinterested in defense, can't throw an entry pass to save his life and has a ridiculous ego that has convinced himself he's a superstar.

In his All Star year in Brooklyn he was often sat down in 4th quarters because he was detrimental to winning games.

[GopherIt!]

One year ago at trade deadline:

DLO nets you Michael Conley, NAW and 3 SRP

Today:

Teams are running away from any trade that has DLO (yes, I realize his 2 year option has changed some things).

that trade was awesome

[Neeva]

Time for more awesome trades at the deadline.
Lets end up with Bojan Bogdanovic, Monte Morris and pick up Hayward when he gets traded and bought out.

[shrink]

MIN GIVES: Wendell Moore Jr + Cash
TEAM X GIVES: Cap Space/TPE

Just looking at the teams with a TPE big enough for Moore’s $2.4

ATL, BOS, BRK, DAL, DET, HOU, LAL, MEM, MIA, NOP, NYK, PHI, PHX, POR, TOR, WAS.

Which of these 16 team(s) would it take the least cash?

[Neeva]

I don’t want the desperate Suns to get Miles Bridges. Wolves can probably outbid the Suns but I don’t want Bridges on the wolves either even though he’s a decent three point shooter. Hope the Pistons outbid Phoenix!

So for the wolves for shooting help Bogdan Bogdanovich ? Or Huerter? Lonnie Walker? Alec Burks, Who else is there and might be available?

[Domejandro]

Time for more awesome trades at the deadline.
Lets end up with Bojan Bogdanovic, Monte Morris and pick up Hayward when he gets traded and bought out.

What assets are Minnesota offering for Bojan Bogdanović?

[Neeva]

Time for more awesome trades at the deadline.
Lets end up with Bojan Bogdanovic, Monte Morris and pick up Hayward when he gets traded and bought out.

What assets are Minnesota offering for Bojan Bogdanović?

No idea but it was mentioned the wolves are interested in him. I meant Bogdan btw, the hawk not the piston sorry, I always get the two confused.

[winforlose]

If the Wolves don’t make a trade, don’t do buy out market, and ride the exact same roster into next year (minus the expiring guys,) then do we get the taxpayer MLE before we go over the second apron? For example, if the first signing is a tax MLE guy, then the next signing is Mike which puts us over the second apron, is that within the new CBA rules?