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Trade Talk (Part Five)

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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1761 » by Merc_Porto » Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:02 pm

Dewey wrote:Agree ... Steph without Thompson has been a struggle for GS and they are a well-established championship caliber franchise, so I can cut some slack. Short-term I just need the gritty effort, especially, if we can get Ant/McD/JV/Reid sold on that intensity as how they are expected to play. Rubio/Okogie/Culver/McL for example are pretty good with taking pride in their effort, so if we add 4 more of these young fella's, we can only hope that will pay dividends up the road. Just need to win a few to keep the spirit alive. Tonight would be an awesome win and then the Kitten back Friday...


Steph, scoring wise is in his 2nd best season ever.

28.4 PTS
FG% .458
3PT% .392

The struggle is because there´s nobody else outside of him to really score the ball.
Is kinda impressive what he's doing by himself.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1762 » by Klomp » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:07 pm

mercgold3 wrote:
Dewey wrote:Agree ... Steph without Thompson has been a struggle for GS and they are a well-established championship caliber franchise, so I can cut some slack. Short-term I just need the gritty effort, especially, if we can get Ant/McD/JV/Reid sold on that intensity as how they are expected to play. Rubio/Okogie/Culver/McL for example are pretty good with taking pride in their effort, so if we add 4 more of these young fella's, we can only hope that will pay dividends up the road. Just need to win a few to keep the spirit alive. Tonight would be an awesome win and then the Kitten back Friday...


Steph, scoring wise is in his 2nd best season ever.

28.4 PTS
FG% .458
3PT% .392

The struggle is because there´s nobody else outside of him to really score the ball.
Is kinda impressive what he's doing by himself.

Taking out last year's 5-game sample, it's his worst shooting season ever from 3-point range and second-worst overall. The scoring is up because of volume, not efficiency.
tsherkin wrote:The important thing to take away here is that Klomp is wrong.
Esohny wrote:Why are you asking Klomp? "He's" actually a bot that posts random blurbs from a database.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1763 » by Jedzz » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:07 pm

Dewey wrote:
Jedzz wrote:Steph Curry would be cried about all day here calling his own number so often, being a weakness on defense, "scrawny", holy hell all that together with his snarky attitude and facial expresssions he would have an army of people against him here. Imagine Steph Curry here with a bunch of scrubs "developing", multiple in starters roles that have no head for it yet. Cherry on top the POBO signs Rubio and drafts Edwards to somehow play with Steph. Imagine that playing out.

Agree ... Steph without Thompson has been a struggle for GS and they are a well-established championship caliber franchise, so I can cut some slack. Short-term I just need the gritty effort, especially, if we can get Ant/McD/JV/Reid sold on that intensity as how they are expected to play. Rubio/Okogie/Culver/McL for example are pretty good with taking pride in their effort, so if we add 4 more of these young fella's, we can only hope that will pay dividends up the road. Just need to win a few to keep the spirit alive. Tonight would be an awesome win and then the Kitten back Friday...


That's fine to see his predicament now without Thompson. Everyone sees their record and a missing piece. But it's just one missing piece really. He's still got the coach, green, and others. But I'm talking about imagining Curry in the Wolves situation this season like Dlo is stuck with. It is 5 times as bad. How would Curry handle being pushed to bench for Rubio to start and players like Edwards/Culver initiating the offense as well? Granted Curry doesn't have as many cold moments, but he's had them when things aren't going right. Here it is rarely going right. How man 6-4 players they run at PF there? Curry would crap his pants if he had to play here.

People like Merc need to see the difference here. Need to see players the same way, not differently.

mercgold3 wrote:
Steph, scoring wise is in his 2nd best season ever.

28.4 PTS
FG% .458
3PT% .392

The struggle is because there´s nobody else outside of him to really score the ball.
Is kinda impressive what he's doing by himself.


Those aren't great percentages for his numbers but sure his PPG is up.

Hmmm Sounds familar and yet a different narrative. Most playesr are described as steering the tank with inflated PPG because they are alone with no stars in such a situation.

When Dlo was driving Warriors tank without Thompson or Curry, Dlo had:

24 PPG
FG% .430
3PT% .374

Terrible, right? Only because he was a single player on a tank team, right? Different narrative.

Whether you like or not, Steph waited until years 4,5,6 to get over 20PPG. Dlo might be a half notch below someone like Curry overall, but he still made it to that level in years 4,5,6 as well. And Dlo did it while being bandied about around the league from team to team. Different coaches, schemes, players around him at each stop. These players are more similar than you think. Their situations have been so different. Even today, Warriors made sure there wasn't a logjam to Curry's role coming back. Here, Dlo sees the team add Rubio, Edwards, Bolmero, Hagans, and twoway Jmac again all after Dlo was here. Then in preseason they show us they plan to rerun Culver at "playmaker" again.

Use that Warriors difference in situation handling to see where this Pobo and Coach have gone awry. Imagine Curry having to deal with this. Then stop your Dlo hate posts when your head finally understands, Merc.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1764 » by Merc_Porto » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:25 pm

Klomp wrote:Taking out last year's 5-game sample, it's his worst shooting season ever from 3-point range and second-worst overall. The scoring is up because of volume, not efficiency.


I know that. But still those are great percentages from 3 and if you watched the Warriors games you would know that happends because the attention the opponents give to Steph is really tight. We even saw that last game against us but then Dray and Kelly did what they usually dont do it, they hit long jumpshots.

Theres nobody else on that team that is a scoring threat from long distance.
Plus that bench they have is awful. And they are with 9-8 record. Thats impressive.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1765 » by Klomp » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:32 pm

If you really wanted to try and blow things up, here's a crazy idea. Side pieces have to be worked in to make it legal, but this would be the main framework.

MIN: Towns, Russell for Simmons, Ayton
PHI: Simmons for Paul
PHX: Paul, Ayton for Towns, Russell
tsherkin wrote:The important thing to take away here is that Klomp is wrong.
Esohny wrote:Why are you asking Klomp? "He's" actually a bot that posts random blurbs from a database.
Klomp wrote:I'm putting the tired in retired mod at the moment
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1766 » by Merc_Porto » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:47 pm

Jedzz wrote:
Those aren't great percentages for his numbers but sure his PPG is up.

Hmmm Sounds familar and yet a different narrative. Most playesr are described as steering the tank with inflated PPG because they are alone with no stars in such a situation.

When Dlo was driving Warriors tank without Thompson or Curry, Dlo had:

24 PPG
FG% .430
3PT% .374

Terrible, right? Only because he was a single player on a tank team, right? Different narrative.

Whether you like or not, Steph waited until years 4,5,6 to get over 20PPG. Dlo might be a half notch below someone like Curry overall, but he still made it to that level in years 4,5,6 as well. And Dlo did it while being bandied about around the league from team to team. Different coaches, schemes, players around him at each stop. These players are more similar than you think. Their situations have been so different. Even today, Warriors made sure there wasn't a logjam to Curry's role coming back. Here, Dlo sees the team add Rubio, Edwards, Bolmero, Hagans, and twoway Jmac again all after Dlo was here. Then in preseason they show us they plan to rerun Culver at "playmaker" again.

Use that Warriors difference in situation handling to see where this Pobo and Coach have gone awry. Imagine Curry having to deal with this. Then stop your Dlo hate posts when your head finally understands, Merc.


My goodness... No, doesnt sound familiar at all.

Just stop it

I will chill out about my "hate" against Dlo because i already explain many times how bad this guy is when you are try to built a team from the ground and now you come with " These players are more similar than you think"

Geez :banghead:

Yes, DLO has been in different coaches, schemes, players around him at each stop for a reason.
Nobody looked at Dlo and saw... Wow, that guy has Steph Curry potential.

Again, theres nothing similiar in the first 4,5,6 years between the two. Steph was better in every single category by a large margin with less usage. And the first three years in the league he was on bad teams as well.

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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1767 » by Note30 » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:52 pm

packforfreedom wrote:
Note30 wrote:
Jedzz wrote:
What is that Common opinion? That he's not James Harden? That he's not Kyrie? What?

Every one of these lauded characters across the league have severe drawbacks themselves which you have to build a team around them correctly to mitigate. As already said, We can't attract a single one of these players here but if we could, they would have the exact same problems here until the team stops playing games with this roster every season and gets serious about winning.

So let's have it your way. I've suggested this to others. Trade Dlo. Now go find us the next iteration of your grand plan to turn this into a winning team. Is that Edwards/Culver? :lol: See you in 2025 if they are even around here then to see who they really become.


Harden is a prolific scorer - but he's hasn't won ****. I sincerely doubt he will either, his game is detrimental to every combo of players he's ever played with.

Kyrie great 2nd option. Not a first option for sure.

Name a team with defensive liabilities as big as Harden that won a championship in the last 10 years. The only one I can think of is Dirk's Mavs. And that was a different game and time.

DLo isn't as good of scorer as either of those players, and doesn't have any advantages that makes him better. Could he develop into something better? He's almost 6 years in, his development is pretty much at its end.

If he isn't even as good as those players as a 1 or 2 option what makes him championship material?


I think Hardens defense has become over dramatized lately. I don't think he's a worse defender than for example Curry or late Kobe, who both won championships.


Late Kobe never won a championship. Prime Kobe did and Prime Kobe is arguably one of the best on-ball defenders in history. Curry had 3-4 defensive stalwarts on his team and doesn't give up on defense like Harden. Harden's attitude and ego will be his undoing

Ev
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1768 » by Note30 » Wed Jan 27, 2021 4:53 pm

Klomp wrote:If you really wanted to try and blow things up, here's a crazy idea. Side pieces have to be worked in to make it legal, but this would be the main framework.

MIN: Towns, Russell for Simmons, Ayton
PHI: Simmons for Paul
PHX: Paul, Ayton for Towns, Russell


Lots of picks coming our way tho right?
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1769 » by Norseman79 » Wed Jan 27, 2021 5:54 pm

Kat is only going one of two places if it is up to me, somewhere for the top pick in the draft, or to Boston for Marcus Smart and Jaylen Brown. If Wolves land a top 3 on their own and are able to get one for Kat, it's a great year to have two top 3 picks
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1770 » by Merc_Porto » Wed Jan 27, 2021 5:58 pm

Norseman79 wrote:Kat is only going one of two places if it is up to me, somewhere for the top pick in the draft, or to Boston for Marcus Smart and Jaylen Brown. If Wolves land a top 3 on their own and are able to get one for Kat, it's a great year to have two top 3 picks


At this moment i really doubt the Celtis do a Brown for Kat straigh up.
Especially with Ainge...
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1771 » by Jedzz » Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:04 pm

mercgold3 wrote:
Klomp wrote:Taking out last year's 5-game sample, it's his worst shooting season ever from 3-point range and second-worst overall. The scoring is up because of volume, not efficiency.


I know that. But still those are great percentages from 3 and if you watched the Warriors games you would know that happends because the attention the opponents give to Steph is really tight. We even saw that last game against us but then Dray and Kelly did what they usually dont do it, they hit long jumpshots.

Theres nobody else on that team that is a scoring threat from long distance.
Plus that bench they have is awful. And they are with 9-8 record. Thats impressive.


Thats total bs mercgold. The only thing Curry is missing on his team is Klay and he's got Wiggins adding a good chunk in his stead. All his averages are down and Klonps right, the volume is up. That's because Klays gone. Curry also doesn't have his coaches having 3 other points digging at Curry's role. If you want to refuse this difference you are no longer an objective poster.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1772 » by Jedzz » Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:08 pm

Note30 wrote:
Klomp wrote:If you really wanted to try and blow things up, here's a crazy idea. Side pieces have to be worked in to make it legal, but this would be the main framework.

MIN: Towns, Russell for Simmons, Ayton
PHI: Simmons for Paul
PHX: Paul, Ayton for Towns, Russell


Lots of picks coming our way tho right?


No. Why would there be? You guys are saying DLo/Kat are junk. Wolves will probably have to add picks soon at this rate, the way some of you are working on their perceived value.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1773 » by Merc_Porto » Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:31 pm

Jedzz wrote:
mercgold3 wrote:
Klomp wrote:Taking out last year's 5-game sample, it's his worst shooting season ever from 3-point range and second-worst overall. The scoring is up because of volume, not efficiency.


I know that. But still those are great percentages from 3 and if you watched the Warriors games you would know that happends because the attention the opponents give to Steph is really tight. We even saw that last game against us but then Dray and Kelly did what they usually dont do it, they hit long jumpshots.

Theres nobody else on that team that is a scoring threat from long distance.
Plus that bench they have is awful. And they are with 9-8 record. Thats impressive.


Thats total bs mercgold. The only thing Curry is missing on his team is Klay and he's got Wiggins adding a good chunk in his stead. All his averages are down and Klonps right, the volume is up. That's because Klays gone. Curry also doesn't have his coaches having 3 other points digging at Curry's role. If you want to refuse this difference you are no longer an objective poster.


What is BS man?
I didnt deny that the volume of shots is higher (actually is not, compared with his best scoring year, is the same) and obviously his effience is lower than his best scoring year and i gave a obvious explanation of why that happends. One thing is to defend a team with Klay and Curry, another thing is to defend a team with Curry and Wiggins.

2015-2016
31.1 points per game
20.2 FGA per game
FG% - 50.4%

2020-2021
28.4 Points per game (second best)
20.2 FGA per game
FG% - 45.8%
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1774 » by Merc_Porto » Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:33 pm

Jedzz wrote:
Note30 wrote:
Klomp wrote:If you really wanted to try and blow things up, here's a crazy idea. Side pieces have to be worked in to make it legal, but this would be the main framework.

MIN: Towns, Russell for Simmons, Ayton
PHI: Simmons for Paul
PHX: Paul, Ayton for Towns, Russell


Lots of picks coming our way tho right?


No. Why would there be? You guys are saying DLo/Kat are junk. Wolves will probably have to add picks soon at this rate, the way some of you are working on their perceived value.


Now, thats what i call BS.
You trying to put Dlo in the same level of value than KAT when nobody said that.

Keep trying...
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1775 » by Jedzz » Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:46 pm

mercgold3 wrote:
Jedzz wrote:
Note30 wrote:
Lots of picks coming our way tho right?


No. Why would there be? You guys are saying DLo/Kat are junk. Wolves will probably have to add picks soon at this rate, the way some of you are working on their perceived value.


Now, thats what i call BS.
You trying to put Dlo in the same level of value than KAT when nobody said that.

Keep trying...


Komps Trade outline was Russell/Kat for... That's why he's in the conversation you quoted.

You and a few others trashing Russell/Kat and begging for them to be traded is why...the post.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1776 » by Jedzz » Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:48 pm

If you can't be objective you probably shouldn't bother with trade ideas.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1777 » by Merc_Porto » Wed Jan 27, 2021 7:00 pm

Jedzz wrote:If you can't be objective you probably shouldn't bother with trade ideas.

Objective on what?

Everything you said today i already showed you with the numbers that you are completely wrong in pretty much everything you said about Dlo.

Or you only like the "numbers" when is only to beat the rookie?
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1778 » by Jedzz » Wed Jan 27, 2021 7:34 pm

mercgold3 wrote:
Jedzz wrote:If you can't be objective you probably shouldn't bother with trade ideas.

Objective on what?

Everything you said today i already showed you with the numbers that you are completely wrong in pretty much everything you said about Dlo.

Or you only like the "numbers" when is only to beat the rookie?


You didn't answer to any of it. You are just going off on your own fairytale.

Tell me now if you won't answer the previous ones. What happens if Curry had been in Dlo's place right now here on this team for these first 16 games, getting played off the bench behind Rubio in some games, having Edwards and Culver initiating offense instead of him. Constant changing roster/starters. A 6'4 guard playnig PF at times.

Tell me what you think Curry looks like right now in that situation. You won't. You already avoided it twice.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1779 » by Merc_Porto » Wed Jan 27, 2021 8:42 pm

Jedzz wrote:
mercgold3 wrote:
Jedzz wrote:If you can't be objective you probably shouldn't bother with trade ideas.

Objective on what?

Everything you said today i already showed you with the numbers that you are completely wrong in pretty much everything you said about Dlo.

Or you only like the "numbers" when is only to beat the rookie?


You didn't answer to any of it. You are just going off on your own fairytale.

Tell me now if you won't answer the previous ones. What happens if Curry had been in Dlo's place right now here on this team for these first 16 games, getting played off the bench behind Rubio in some games, having Edwards and Culver initiating offense instead of him. Constant changing roster/starters. A 6'4 guard playnig PF at times.

Tell me what you think Curry looks like right now in that situation. You won't. You already avoided it twice.



Is that a serious question thought?
How would the Timberwolves look in this first 16 games if we had Curry instead of Dlo?

I ask again...
Is that a serious question?

Are you really trying once again to put Dlo close to Curry level?

Under any circumstances the team would always look better with Curry. Like, a lot better.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Five) 

Post#1780 » by Note30 » Wed Jan 27, 2021 8:53 pm

Jedzz wrote:
Note30 wrote:
Klomp wrote:If you really wanted to try and blow things up, here's a crazy idea. Side pieces have to be worked in to make it legal, but this would be the main framework.

MIN: Towns, Russell for Simmons, Ayton
PHI: Simmons for Paul
PHX: Paul, Ayton for Towns, Russell


Lots of picks coming our way tho right?


No. Why would there be? You guys are saying DLo/Kat are junk. Wolves will probably have to add picks soon at this rate, the way some of you are working on their perceived value.


I never said KAT was junk. He's a great 2nd option. He's the closest equivalent to AD in this league. He's AD with a significantly better 3PT shot, but not as good on defense. The problem is that AD and LeBron = championship. We don't have anyone remotely close to a wing or guard like that.

Remember what New Orleans had to do? And their setup wasn't terrible they even reached the playoffs once like us. But they sucked. Our roster now isn't even as useful as theirs. Even later, they had 3 all-stars plus Rondo in their lineup. Still didn't do any damage.

I like KAT, I thought him Zach and Andrew were going to be our future. If we had traded Andrew for Butler, kept Rubio and signed two more shooters, even with Thibs' coaching we would have made the WCF

But we didn't and what we have now is garbage, we are New Orleans the year before Zion.

And in NO AD bailed. KAT will 100 do the same. Get value for him now.

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