Butler has requested a trade, the saga continues

[twix2500]

This team was suppose to be

PG: Dragic
SG: Wade
SF: Durant or Hayward
PF: Bosh
C: Whiteside.

That's a lot of max contracts (or close to max).

Wade wouldnt have been on Max contracts and Dragic is not on a max contract. A lot of unforeseen things happened the past 4 years. One of the reasons the Heat signed Whiteside to that big deal over Horford and Howard is because Whiteside agreed to take less if Durant signed.

[TruthSerum]

This team was suppose to be

PG: Dragic
SG: Wade
SF: Durant or Hayward
PF: Bosh
C: Whiteside.

That's a lot of max contracts (or close to max).

Wade wouldnt have been on Max contracts and Dragic is not on a max contract. A lot of unforeseen things happened the past 4 years. One of the reasons the Heat signed Whiteside to that big deal over Horford and Howard is because Whiteside agreed to take less if Durant signed.

Bosh was done with after that 2nd clot. It wasn't a secret or anything. There was no plan involving him. Far as Durant went, there would've been no real money for Whiteside. Riley only could keep him and TJ with cap space.

[shrink]

This team was suppose to be

PG: Dragic
SG: Wade
SF: Durant or Hayward
PF: Bosh
C: Whiteside.

That's a lot of max contracts (or close to max).

You’re right. When they whiffed on Durant, Riley spent big money on Tyler Johnson, Waiters and Whiteside, and it’s really doomed them until those 2016 contracts run out.

In Riley’s defense, many teams overspent in 2016. However, whether it’s been Bosh, Wade, Durant or Hayward, I really haven’t seen Riley not try for star players, or accept mediocrity.

[Ethomasp31]

I'm beginning to realize that we aren't going to get much for Butler in a trade. No one will want to pay him a max contract with his attitude, age and health (missing as many games a year as he does). I have a feeling the offers have kind of dried out since the beginning of the season when Thibs made it apparent he didn't want to trade him. It seems Thibs messed this up and Glen isn't able to see it or fix the situation.

[TruthSerum]

I'm beginning to realize that we aren't going to get much for Butler in a trade. No one will want to pay him a max contract with his attitude, age and health (missing as many games a year as he does). I have a feeling the offers have kind of dried out since the beginning of the season when Thibs made it apparent he didn't want to trade him. It seems Thibs messed this up and Glen isn't able to see it or fix the situation.

I'm started to wonder about that knee. Guess only the Minny medical staff knows what's going on for sure but could explain a few things going back to contract renegotiations.

[Truebiscuit]

You dont have other ways to explain it. I have. Jimmy is an inmature, egoistic, hypocrite, maniac freak that only like things done his way. Maybe you cant see it because you are a Bulls fan, and lottery is boring, but is very clear to long time fans.

It's not about being a Bulls fan, I promise. We have a sect of our fanbase that is completely blinded by Jimmy Butler love/obsession. Those of us that value the team more than a player know he's a piece of ****.

You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own facts. I've never met this sect, pretty sure it's not a thing in any reality, and certainly wouldn't be one of them.
Go Bears!

That's an interesting way to put it, you consider it a lie because you never met this sect? I have met this sect, I've talked to them on message boards and at the United Center. It's not a lie because you haven't experienced it.

[TruthSerum]

It's not about being a Bulls fan, I promise. We have a sect of our fanbase that is completely blinded by Jimmy Butler love/obsession. Those of us that value the team more than a player know he's a piece of ****.

You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own facts. I've never met this sect, pretty sure it's not a thing in any reality, and certainly wouldn't be one of them.
Go Bears!

That's an interesting way to put it, you consider it a lie because you never met this sect? I have met this sect, I've talked to them on message boards and at the United Center. It's not a lie because you haven't experienced it.

Well, that's your perception of things, anyways. This isn't a Derrick Rose situation where he was the hometown kid and had a huge fan following going back to Simeon. Jimmy came out of nowhere and I've certainly not run into his fanboys.

[shrink]

I'm beginning to realize that we aren't going to get much for Butler in a trade. No one will want to pay him a max contract with his attitude, age and health (missing as many games a year as he does). I have a feeling the offers have kind of dried out since the beginning of the season when Thibs made it apparent he didn't want to trade him. It seems Thibs messed this up and Glen isn't able to see it or fix the situation.

I’m not worried. Since trading started so late in the off-season (you can determine for yourself whether to blame Thibs or Jimmy for that), other teams had already made their plans, and wanted to see how things worked out. Sure, they’d add Jimmy now, but only wanted to make token offers. If MIN was desperate (and they certainly sounded desperate), teams were happy to offer a lowball offer.

Now that the season has started, teams are getting to see how their off-season plans are going, and for many teams, like HOU, MIA, WAS and PHI, they expected to be doing a lot better at this point. Also, the longer the season runs, the more injuries will accrue. We have already seen offers get better and better, and I expect that to continue.

The bottom line is that Jimmy is a top 15 player, playing the position with the least depth, and he is a two-way guy. Stars determines the fate of franchises, and prevent coaches and GM’s from getting fired. Teams historically will put up with a lot from a truly talented player, and Jimmy showed last year he can bring a team wins. In the previous cases of Kyrie, Paul George and Kawhi, we always saw better offers than predicted, and I can’t imagine Jimmy will be any different,

[twix2500]

This team was suppose to be

PG: Dragic
SG: Wade
SF: Durant or Hayward
PF: Bosh
C: Whiteside.

That's a lot of max contracts (or close to max).

You’re right. When they whiffed on Durant, Riley spent big money on Tyler Johnson, Waiters and Whiteside, and it’s really doomed them until those 2016 contracts run out.

In Riley’s defense, many teams overspent in 2016. However, whether it’s been Bosh, Wade, Durant or Hayward, I really haven’t seen Riley not try for star players, or accept mediocrity.

When Riley whiffed on Durant and Hayward they decided to take a new approach and it had alot to do with the new CBA and some to do with Tylers contract. Matching Tyler contract with Brooklyn was not Rileys decision. He was ready to let him walk, but for some reason Heat owner Micky Arison took that offer from Brooklyn personal. Arison ordered Riley to match Brooklyn contract to Tyler. Reasons that have not been explained. This is not a rumor, Riley has publicly stated this. But because of the new CBA, signing a star via free agency concluded to be impossible due to the SuperMax. Riley intention is to try to get a disgruntled star via trade. And DeMarcus Cousins, Leonard, Jimmy Butler is the example he is looking for. Heat lack draft picks due to the trades they made to get Bosh, Lebron and Dragic. Waiters and JJ surprisingly showed promise that they could develop and become trade-able assets. Injuries have hampered that possibility. They knew Tyler back end contract was gonna kick in. And they were gonna be capped strapped if they didnt make signings before hand. So they took their bets on JJ, Waiters and Olynk.

[twix2500]

That's a lot of max contracts (or close to max).

Wade wouldnt have been on Max contracts and Dragic is not on a max contract. A lot of unforeseen things happened the past 4 years. One of the reasons the Heat signed Whiteside to that big deal over Horford and Howard is because Whiteside agreed to take less if Durant signed.

Bosh was done with after that 2nd clot. It wasn't a secret or anything. There was no plan involving him. Far as Durant went, there would've been no real money for Whiteside. Riley only could keep him and TJ with cap space.

A lot of unforeseen events happened. Regardless, the original plan starting in 2015 was to go after Durant or Hayward. That is why they gave Deng a 2 year deal and Joe Johnson for one season. That is why they took one year deals after missing out on Durant. Bosh 2nd clot happened the all star break before going after Durant. But the plan to go after Durant started 2 yrs earlier. They also knew Joe Johnson wanted to come to Miami so they were hoping to add him as well.

The post James era was planned to be

PG: Dragic
SG: Wade
SF: Durant or Hayward
PF: Bosh
C : Whiteside

Bench: Joe Johnson, Josh Richardson, Justise Winslow, Wayne Ellington, Tyler Johnson, Josh McRoberts and what ever they got with the 2017 draft.

Should have the Heat blown it after missing out on Durant and Bosh second clot. Maybe, but people need to understand the Heat were missing 3 draft picks due to trading for Bosh and trading for Dragic. So sucking for a draft pick was not much of an option.

[TruthSerum]

Wade wouldnt have been on Max contracts and Dragic is not on a max contract. A lot of unforeseen things happened the past 4 years. One of the reasons the Heat signed Whiteside to that big deal over Horford and Howard is because Whiteside agreed to take less if Durant signed.

Bosh was done with after that 2nd clot. It wasn't a secret or anything. There was no plan involving him. Far as Durant went, there would've been no real money for Whiteside. Riley only could keep him and TJ with cap space.

A lot of unforeseen events happened. Regardless, the original plan starting in 2015 was to go after Durant or Hayward. That is why they gave Deng a 2 year deal and Joe Johnson for one season. That is why they took one year deals after missing out on Durant. Bosh 2nd clot happened the all star break before going after Durant. But the plan to go after Durant started 2 yrs earlier. They also knew Joe Johnson wanted to come to Miami so they were hoping to add him as well.

The post James era was planned to be

PG: Dragic
SG: Wade
SF: Durant or Hayward
PF: Bosh
C : Whiteside

Bench: Joe Johnson, Josh Richardson, Justise Winslow, Wayne Ellington, Tyler Johnson, Josh McRoberts and what ever they got with the 2017 draft.

Should have the Heat blown it after missing out on Durant and Bosh second clot. Maybe, but people need to understand the Heat were missing 3 draft picks due to trading for Bosh and trading for Dragic. So sucking for a draft pick was not much of an option.

I have no doubt Riley planned on a Durant or Hayward. Lots of teams with money to spend also did. Who wouldn't? But your dream team is not realistic given the development of Whiteside and Tyler Johnson. Sure, maybe Wade takes another $10M paycut like he did for Deng (originally for the bolting Lebron), but who else would be so generous? Whiteside and TJ were gonna get paid. No way around it. And Joe Johnson, Wayne Ellington aren't trying to play for free either. How does $42M in 2016 cap space get you:

Durant or Hayward
Wade
Whiteside
Tyler Johnson
Joe Johnson
Wayne Ellington

It's a pipe dream. Revisionist history at best.

[minimus]

I Just Want to Hoop and Be Out There With My Soldiers

General Soreness

[Dewey]

I Just Want to Hoop and Be Out There With My Soldiers

General Soreness

sad isn't it? This "I'll decide when I play" approach appears to be about Jimmy leveraging the Wolves, and the way I see it, the Wolves must put him on ice and keep him out of the lockeroom and away form the team altogether.

[life_saver]

This needs to end asap...we need a replacement badly for Jimmy if he decides to not play whenever he wants...it's hurting the team badly as we are already short of ball handlers with Teague, Rose injuries.

[minimus]

I have strange feeling that if we get just a role player who fit, i.e. big defensive minded wing who can shoot 3s, for instance Robert Covington, Otto Porter, trade one of bad contracts (Teague, Dieng) AND remove whole unnecessary drama we will have a good team. I really dont understand why Butler does not play with KAT, does want any help from KAT, often refuses even a screen, does not provide any assistance to KAT like an alley oop assist or back screen.

I am just thinking about it. What if we remove all this negative stuff from our team? Maybe this team can autoheal itself? Even without Thibs assistance...

It is clearly the bottom of basketball life now: awful management, awful coaching, no effort from players, no chemistry and self proclamed leader just sabotages games.

It cannot be worse. It cannot be.

[Jedzz]

I have strange feeling that if we get just a role player who fit, i.e. big defensive minded wing who can shoot 3s, for instance Robert Covington, Otto Porter, trade one of bad contracts (Teague, Dieng) AND remove whole unnecessary drama we will have a good team. I really dont understand why Butler does not play with KAT, does want any help from KAT, often refuses even a screen, does not provide any assistance to KAT like an alley oop assist or back screen.

I am just thinking about it. What if we remove all this negative stuff from our team? Maybe this team can autoheal itself? Even without Thibs assistance...

It is clearly the bottom of basketball life now: awful management, awful coaching, no effort from players, no chemistry and self proclamed leader just sabotages games.

It cannot be worse. It cannot be.

Don't tempt them to find worse. I have a feeling they could surprise us with worse. This last game Kat was highly involved. He could tune out like he's done in the past and then we got...nobody. That is if a player like Rose isn't in the game. I didn't see consistent play from Okogie in this last one. That might have been his second not so good rookie game. Hopefully you are right that a single good fit positive player in addition to removing the drama will help them move on. Okogie and Rose have been a good step to moving on. Keep them both playing and add a third positive.

[mplsfonz23]

I Just Want to Hoop and Be Out There With My Soldiers

General Soreness

sad isn't it? This "I'll decide when I play" approach appears to be about Jimmy leveraging the Wolves, and the way I see it, the Wolves must put him on ice and keep him out of the lockeroom and away form the team altogether.

He was being facetious. Get it?

[mplsfonz23]

.

[Jedzz]

.

My sentiments confirmed.

[minimus]

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