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Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition

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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#201 » by wolves_89 » Thu Nov 30, 2023 6:27 pm

shrink wrote:I understand people’s desire to include Shake Milton as matching salary, but I think Tim Connelly will be reluctant and probably use Troy Brown Jr, who has played much better. I think we need Shake to come around, because he could fill the biggest hole on our roster - a backup guard that can pass and shoot a little. I know he hasn’t been able to do either consistently with the Wolves, but we’ve seen him do it in PHI. I think Connelly and Finch probably believe that Philly Milton is still inside him.

However, I could see them trade Wendell Moore Jr to a young team for a vet min back up PG that would be happier on a playoff-bound team. Is Frank Ntilinka or Kris Dunn any better than what we have now?


I don't see much value in Ntilikina, but I could see Dunn getting playing time. Dunn's defense, ball handling, and surprisingly decent 3pt shooting could make him a useful player, especially if the team is trying to keep Conley's minutes under 30 a game. Adding another switchable point-of-attack defender accentuates the team's biggest strength which makes a lot of sense to me.

Basically, I think Dunn would be a better PG option than NAW/Milton and might work better than Kyle with faster pace players like Naz.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#202 » by shangrila » Thu Nov 30, 2023 7:25 pm

It doesn't make sense to move anyone for incremental gains at this point. Everything isn't perfect but it's working, why mess with that?

Shake will round into form. He's currently shooting 3% lower on 2s and 12% (!) lower on 3s compared to his career averages. His minutes are down (usually hovers around 20mpg, currently at 15). His 2PAs are also down per 100, although both his 3PAs and FTAs are up. His rebounds are at career average levels but his AST:TO is down. His fouls are up but so are his steals (currently best of his career).

So combined with the eye test it's clear to me he's struggling to adjust to a different role. And that's fine, we have the luxury of giving him that time to get comfortable.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#203 » by Klomp » Thu Nov 30, 2023 9:13 pm

shangrila wrote:Shake will round into form. He's currently shooting 3% lower on 2s and 12% (!) lower on 3s compared to his career averages. His minutes are down (usually hovers around 20mpg, currently at 15). His 2PAs are also down per 100, although both his 3PAs and FTAs are up. His rebounds are at career average levels but his AST:TO is down. His fouls are up but so are his steals (currently best of his career).

That's interesting. Falls right in line with how it felt like Naz was struggling, but he's basically the same as last year.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#204 » by TimberKat » Thu Nov 30, 2023 9:58 pm

Klomp wrote:
shangrila wrote:Shake will round into form. He's currently shooting 3% lower on 2s and 12% (!) lower on 3s compared to his career averages. His minutes are down (usually hovers around 20mpg, currently at 15). His 2PAs are also down per 100, although both his 3PAs and FTAs are up. His rebounds are at career average levels but his AST:TO is down. His fouls are up but so are his steals (currently best of his career).

That's interesting. Falls right in line with how it felt like Naz was struggling, but he's basically the same as last year.

From the eye test, Naz isn't bad. He is just not great like a stretch last year before he got hurt or shooting lights out earlier this year. His defense drop off more that offense. Shake, on the other hand, looks like 55 years old. Couldn't create any separation driving and had a worst 3pt pct than Novell last year. I was hoping Shake take a step forward in his career, now just hope he regress back to the mean.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#205 » by younggunsmn » Thu Nov 30, 2023 11:13 pm

shangrila wrote:It doesn't make sense to move anyone for incremental gains at this point. Everything isn't perfect but it's working, why mess with that?

Shake will round into form. He's currently shooting 3% lower on 2s and 12% (!) lower on 3s compared to his career averages. His minutes are down (usually hovers around 20mpg, currently at 15). His 2PAs are also down per 100, although both his 3PAs and FTAs are up. His rebounds are at career average levels but his AST:TO is down. His fouls are up but so are his steals (currently best of his career).

So combined with the eye test it's clear to me he's struggling to adjust to a different role. And that's fine, we have the luxury of giving him that time to get comfortable.


What the eye test tells me is I wonder how Shake ever shot a decent percentage with that ugly ass push shot.
But we knew that when we signed him.
He's not getting all those open looks he used to get playing with Embiid.
We don't run as much pick and roll as Philly did, we ask for more corner shooting from our guards.

We really need another ballhandler to go with Ant and Mike, and Shake has been ok taking care of the ball but hasn't really been able to get others going or get them easy looks.
I was hoping Shake and Naz would develop a lethal 2-man game on the 2nd unit, but with Naz playing with another big most of the time that really hasn't happened. Our 2nd unit players are all really kind of struggling to find their niche offensively, not just Shake.

Keeping KAT or Rudy on the floor at all times has helped keep our defense from falling off with the 2nd unit, and playing Naz with a big is the only way you are going to get him 20 minutes or more.

We are really vulnerable to a Conley injury right now if we are looking to shore up something via trade, a really solid backup PG is where I'd look to upgrade.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#206 » by minimus » Fri Dec 1, 2023 6:03 pm

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Someone was very high on IQ as point guard. According to these stat he can be an effective pick-n-roll ballhandler
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#207 » by Neeva » Fri Dec 1, 2023 6:42 pm

Quickley wants a 25 million plus, per year contract, good luck with that Knicks. That could go south very quickly.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#208 » by KGdaBom » Sat Dec 2, 2023 1:54 am

Neeva wrote:Quickley wants a 25 million plus, per year contract, good luck with that Knicks. That could go south very quickly.

I want a $25 Million a year contract. I'm not going to get it and neither is Quickley.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#209 » by Klomp » Sat Dec 2, 2023 4:25 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
Neeva wrote:Quickley wants a 25 million plus, per year contract, good luck with that Knicks. That could go south very quickly.

I want a $25 Million a year contract. I'm not going to get it and neither is Quickley.

People didn't think Jaden would get the contract he got either. Quickley is right in that same range.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#210 » by Klomp » Sat Dec 2, 2023 5:13 pm

An idea for those nervous about trading away the versatility of Kyle Anderson during the season....what about Joe Ingles?

In the same salary range, has a versatile game as a forward, has continuity/history with Gobert, Conley, Alexander-Walker. Being that he's 36, could bring in another asset with him. And a team option allows for salary flexibility this summer, which is very important.

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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#211 » by Mamba4Goat » Sat Dec 2, 2023 5:30 pm

Klomp wrote:An idea for those nervous about trading away the versatility of Kyle Anderson during the season....what about Joe Ingles?

In the same salary range, has a versatile game as a forward, has continuity/history with Gobert, Conley, Alexander-Walker. Being that he's 36, could bring in another asset with him. And a team option allows for salary flexibility this summer, which is very important.

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Ingles was high up on my offseason signings wish list. Thought he may have been available for a vet min too! I don’t think he’d be worth it in a trade though unless Orlando really loves SloMo and wants to offer a 1st.

Next offseason, if Anderson is priced out Ingles and/or Winslow could make sense as potential vet min type targets. You could even land Winslow whenever if they want to fill a roster spot. Similar-ish type player but leaves a training wheels type route to fast track Miller or Minott minutes.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#212 » by KGdaBom » Sat Dec 2, 2023 6:39 pm

Klomp wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
Neeva wrote:Quickley wants a 25 million plus, per year contract, good luck with that Knicks. That could go south very quickly.

I want a $25 Million a year contract. I'm not going to get it and neither is Quickley.

People didn't think Jaden would get the contract he got either. Quickley is right in that same range.

IMO Jaden is not worth the contract he got, but I would consider him worth at least $10 Million a year more than Quickley. Time will tell. I don't think Quickley gets that.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#213 » by winforlose » Sun Dec 3, 2023 2:27 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
Klomp wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:I want a $25 Million a year contract. I'm not going to get it and neither is Quickley.

People didn't think Jaden would get the contract he got either. Quickley is right in that same range.

IMO Jaden is not worth the contract he got, but I would consider him worth at least $10 Million a year more than Quickley. Time will tell. I don't think Quickley gets that.


Teams wanted Jaden badly and were willing to pay him. The issue for the Wolves goes beyond this year. Next year let’s say we resign Mike and he plays well. Then what? We will be salary heavy with no true PG in the pipeline and very limited means of adding one. Getting a guy who can demand a decent size salary slot hurts us in the tax, but helps us if we need to make moves in a later year. I am of course focused 100% on this year. The team is finally starting to look like what I envisioned during the early days of the Gobert trade. But, with a solid young core lead by Ant, Jaden, and Naz, we do need to at least keep in mind the next few years.

Kyle, Shake, and Moore are the guys we can really afford to move, but we also have a trade exemption and room under the cap (not to mention a roster spot.) My question is what vet on a bad team might want out badly enough that we can improve without subtracting?
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#214 » by minimus » Sun Dec 3, 2023 2:51 pm

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Any chance to get him?
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#215 » by winforlose » Sun Dec 3, 2023 2:57 pm

minimus wrote:
Read on Twitter


Any chance to get him?


Do we want him? I thought fell off a cliff last year.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#216 » by wolves_89 » Sun Dec 3, 2023 3:27 pm

minimus wrote:
Read on Twitter


Any chance to get him?


The Wolves spent the offseason replacing guards who were poor defenders and have greatly benefited on that end. I'm not sure we want to add a guy who the Nuggets GM has flat out said was traded because he couldn't defend.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#217 » by Dewey » Sun Dec 3, 2023 3:36 pm

wolves_89 wrote:
minimus wrote:
Read on Twitter


Any chance to get him?


The Wolves spent the offseason replacing guards who were poor defenders and have greatly benefited on that end. I'm not sure we want to add a guy who the Nuggets GM has flat out said was traded because he couldn't defend.

No to Bones and no to big pay for Mike into 2024-2025… maybe a 1-year deal if we draft a PG. I fully assume the organization has a plan for PG of the future. No need for a defensive sieve or over paying a vet in Kay 30’s because we are complacent.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#218 » by twolves31 » Sun Dec 3, 2023 3:46 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
Klomp wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:I want a $25 Million a year contract. I'm not going to get it and neither is Quickley.

People didn't think Jaden would get the contract he got either. Quickley is right in that same range.

IMO Jaden is not worth the contract he got, but I would consider him worth at least $10 Million a year more than Quickley. Time will tell. I don't think Quickley gets that.


I think Jaden was borderline worth what he got, I was hoping for closer to 20 million per year. Lets hope he comes back healthy soon, can stay healthy, and outperforms that 25 million. When you look at what we pay NAW, Jaden is overpaid compared to him.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#219 » by twolves31 » Sun Dec 3, 2023 3:50 pm

winforlose wrote:
minimus wrote:
Read on Twitter


Any chance to get him?


Do we want him? I thought fell off a cliff last year.


I"m not sure if I want Bones when he demanded out of a championship team in Denver and lost his rotation spot on the Clippers. Bones has certainly shown Lavine level confidence and swag at times with his shot. I would rather pay Bones 2.4 million than Moore 2.4 million.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition 

Post#220 » by Mattya » Sun Dec 3, 2023 6:04 pm

I’d definitely trade Moore and the Memphis 2nd rounder for Bones.

Bones
NAW
Brown
Slowmo
Naz

That’s a very well rounded bench with microwave scorers, defenders, ball handlers and spacers.

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