Trade Talk (Part 17): Early Offseason Planning

[Norseman79]

Would you/would they

Morant for McDaniels, Reid (S&T), Dillingham or same offer for Young?

[Wolves21]

Would you/would they

Morant for McDaniels, Reid (S&T), Dillingham or same offer for Young?

As long as Ja can keep his head on straight I'd do either of those deals in a heart beat.If you look at it on paper would be like just giving up McDaniels and Reid.Rob was a non factor this season and who knows what the pick would give us.

Morant/Young
Edwards
Shannon Jr
Randle
Gobert

Bench would still have Conley,DiVincenzo,Clark,Minot and whatever we could get with the 31st pick.

[cmoss84]

Would you/would they

Morant for McDaniels, Reid (S&T), Dillingham or same offer for Young?

Nope.
There are character issues...then there are CHARACTER issues.

[younggunsmn]

I would love to add a Shaun Livingston-type guard to our lineup. Who fits?!

The "so obvious it is boring" answer is Lonzo Ball. A trade framework that I have kicked around for a larger scale Kevin Durant trade is...

CHI: Rudy Gobert
OUT: Nikola Vučević and Lonzo Ball (maybe swap #12 for #17, but keeping picks out for simplicity)

Why for Chicago? Shift team towards a defensive identity and give Josh Giddey a lob threat.

MIN: Kevin Durant and Lonzo Ball
OUT: Rudy Gobert and Julius Randle (likely send draft capital to Phoenix)

Why for Minnesota? Clear long-term salary commitments and get an All-NBA player.

PHX: Julius Randle, Nikola Vučević, and draft compensation
OUT: Kevin Durant

Why for Phoenix? Get two offensive big men and draft compensation for Kevin Durant. This trade is legal despite the Second Apron limitations, unlike a lot of proposals.


Functionally, Lonzo Ball replaces a portion of NAW's minutes, with the idea that Minnesota has enough young depth to survive if he breaks down. Honestly not even sure if this is a good trade for Minnesota (would have to see follow-ups to address the Center problem), but it's a format.

This is really solid from a salary matching and potential value perspective.

I don't think Gobert is right for Chicago's timeline though, and as guard heavy as they are they might draft Derik Queen or another C at 12.

Atlanta, on the other hand, needs to decide if they can win now with Trae Young.
With Jalen Johnson and all-defense Dyson Daniels being their cornerstones Gobert might be a great fit there if they go the route of constructing a dominating defense.

The salary matching they would send back for Gobert, Terence Mann and Onyeka Okongwu, also happen to be pieces that might be very attractive to Phoenix in a Durant trade as an elite defensive guard and a young cost controlled center.

Something Like:
MN In: Durant, player X from 3rd team
MN Out: Randle, Gobert

ATL In: Gobert
ATL Out: Okongwu, Mann, draft comp

PHX In: Randle, Okongwu, draft comp

3rd team In: Mann
3rd team out: player X

We aren't going to be able to do one thing for Phoenix that other teams might be willing to do, and that is eat a bad long term contract like Grayson Allen in an exchange for an expiring.

One thing to keep in mind, until July 1st the Wolves will have to operate as a 2nd apron team, which means no aggregating contracts.
Any Durant trade involving 2025 draft picks would have to be agreed to on draft night and executed in July.
There are also player options for guys like Randle and Naz which won't be decided on draft night

I also look at Miami as maybe a team for extracting more value out of Julius Randle.

MIA In: Randle
MIA Out: Duncan Robinson (19.9 player option), Nikola Jovic, Kevin Love, future draft pick.
Kyle Anderson also has 9.2 mil for salary matching but has 2 years left.
Also Terry Rozier 26 mil for salary matching.

[BlacJacMac]

Would you/would they

Morant for McDaniels, Reid (S&T), Dillingham or same offer for Young?

Nope. I don't trust Morant and I don't like Young.

[Guest84]

Am I missing something? I’ve been seeing a lot about Fox being in trade talks. Didn’t he want to go to the spurs? So why would they consider trading him?

I’ve seen his name linked to the wolves as well…which I would love to pair him with Ant.

[TimberKat]

Could someone explain how both Randle and Naz opt out is impacting any free agent signing or KD trade? According to my calculations, we now have total salary of $140m. We could had kept Towns and be at #
$193m. Our core right now is Ant, Gobert, JMcD, DDV, Conley, Dilly, TSJ, and Clark.

Seems to me trading Towns actually make the cap per talent situation worse. Would had been so much simpler to build around Ant, Towns, Gobert, JMcD, Dilly, TSJ, Clark at around $170m.

[shrink]

Am I missing something? I’ve been seeing a lot about Fox being in trade talks. Didn’t he want to go to the spurs? So why would they consider trading him?.

They won the #2 pick in the lottery, and the best player after Flagg is Dylan Harper, who’s a PG.

[Guest84]

Am I missing something? I’ve been seeing a lot about Fox being in trade talks. Didn’t he want to go to the spurs? So why would they consider trading him?.

They won the #2 pick in the lottery, and the best player after Flagg is Dylan Harper, who’s a PG.

You'd think they would want to leverage the pick to get another vet star in to speed up the winning process. Do you think they'll stick w/ Fox even if they draft Harper? Or might they be thinking build long-term now that Wemby had the clot issue?

[shrink]

Am I missing something? I’ve been seeing a lot about Fox being in trade talks. Didn’t he want to go to the spurs? So why would they consider trading him?.

They won the #2 pick in the lottery, and the best player after Flagg is Dylan Harper, who’s a PG.

You'd think they would want to leverage the pick to get another vet star in to speed up the winning process. Do you think they'll stick w/ Fox even if they draft Harper? Or might they be thinking build long-term now that Wemby had the clot issue?

There is a lot of debate among Spurs fans which direction is best, with Fox, Harper, and ROY Castle - all starting guards.

For us, that means it’s quite possible Fox will become available.

[Norseman79]

Would have no issues if we can move Randle and Reid and land Jabari Smith Jr.

Trade Randle for Mitchell and Jovic plus whatever

Trade Reid to Spurs for the 14 or combined with the 17 and move up for Maluach.

PG Mitchell, Conley, Dilly
SG Edwards, DD, Clark
SF McDaniels, Shannon
PF Smith Jr, Jovic
C. Gobert, Maluach

Flexibility, youth, size, defense and scoring...

[Guest84]

They won the #2 pick in the lottery, and the best player after Flagg is Dylan Harper, who’s a PG.

You'd think they would want to leverage the pick to get another vet star in to speed up the winning process. Do you think they'll stick w/ Fox even if they draft Harper? Or might they be thinking build long-term now that Wemby had the clot issue?

There is a lot of debate among Spurs fans which direction is best, with Fox, Harper, and ROY Castle - all starting guards.

For us, that means it’s quite possible Fox will become available.

What are your thoughts on going after Fox? He's a player that I wouldn't mind pairing with Ant. Although, I just saw that he had surgery on his left hand (pinky) in March.

[minimus]

You'd think they would want to leverage the pick to get another vet star in to speed up the winning process. Do you think they'll stick w/ Fox even if they draft Harper? Or might they be thinking build long-term now that Wemby had the clot issue?

There is a lot of debate among Spurs fans which direction is best, with Fox, Harper, and ROY Castle - all starting guards.

For us, that means it’s quite possible Fox will become available.

What are your thoughts on going after Fox? He's a player that I wouldn't mind pairing with Ant. Although, I just saw that he had surgery on his left hand (pinky) in March.

I wonder if Fox can be unstoppable in similar to SAC environment where he is sharing playmaking duties with another star (Sabonis) and offense has multiple off ball scorers (Monk, Huerter, Murray). And I dont see it in MIN with Gobert, McDaniels and Edwards being completely different archetypes of players.

[moss_is_1]

Another reason Fox could be available is that he only has 1 season left on his current contract and has been looking for an extension.

[shrink]

What are your thoughts on going after Fox? He's a player that I wouldn't mind pairing with Ant. Although, I just saw that he had surgery on his left hand (pinky) in March.

I have a couple questions about Fox.

1. Fox is best when he is using his immense speed in the open court. That’s something we want Ant to do as well, but will he start to run if Fox is running? I could see that encouraging someone like Jaden McDaniels, and we know Finch has wanted to play faster for a long time.

2. Contract. Fox is a $37 mil expiring. Does he want to stay in MIN? We moved Towns for financial freedom - does replacing that salary spot with the lesser Fox still work?

3. Uniqueness. Fox may be a top 50 NBA player, but only a top 15 NBA point guard. The point guard position is loaded with talent right now, and more on the way - the Spurs may have three potential stars at the position. With fewer buyers, and more sellers, economics should mean we shouldn’t pay a ton to get him.

Another way to look at position scarcity .. is Randle a more highly rated PF than Fox is a PG? What percent of nights would the Wolves have an advantage over the other team at each of those positions?

[Guest84]

What are your thoughts on going after Fox? He's a player that I wouldn't mind pairing with Ant. Although, I just saw that he had surgery on his left hand (pinky) in March.

I have a couple questions about Fox.

1. Fox is best when he is using his immense speed in the open court. That’s something we want Ant to do as well, but will he start to run if Fox is running? I could see that encouraging someone like Jaden McDaniels, and we know Finch has wanted to play faster for a long time.

2. Contract. Fox is a $37 mil expiring. Does he want to stay in MIN? We moved Towns for financial freedom - does replacing that salary spot with the lesser Fox still work?

3. Uniqueness. Fox may be a top 50 NBA player, but only a top 15 NBA point guard. The point guard position is loaded with talent right now, and more on the way - the Spurs may have three potential stars at the position. With fewer buyers, and more sellers, economics should mean we shouldn’t pay a ton to get him.

Another way to look at position scarcity .. is Randle a more highly rated PF than Fox is a PG? What percent of nights would the Wolves have an advantage over the other team at each of those positions?

1. If Ant can play the finisher on the break, I think he would run more. Especially if Finch and the team stress it going into next year. Does anyone know how often Ant scored in transition while Rubio, DLo, etc were here before Conley?

2. Can you expand on the bolded part? Is Fox really a lesser player than Towns (not sure if that's what you meant) or is it just more competitive at the guard position? There's a lot of "legacy" guards that ppl wouldn't allow Fox to jump even if he had stats/success to back it.

3. What pg would be ranked ahead of Fox in your opinion? Or even according to the stats/other metrics? His play style seems similar to Shai in that he can get to his spots fairly easy in the midrange, score in bunches, and has at one time been the best clutch player in the league. He's only 27 and could/should replicate those past performances.

I think it's a long shot to get/keep him but I do have that interest when you're talking about guard play.

[cmoss84]

I'd love to get Fox in a deal revolving around Randle. But to me, this depends on Mike. Is he willing to be traded to Spurs?
Randle and Conley for Fox kind of works for both sides.

[BlacJacMac]

What are your thoughts on going after Fox? He's a player that I wouldn't mind pairing with Ant. Although, I just saw that he had surgery on his left hand (pinky) in March.

I have a couple questions about Fox.

1. Fox is best when he is using his immense speed in the open court. That’s something we want Ant to do as well, but will he start to run if Fox is running? I could see that encouraging someone like Jaden McDaniels, and we know Finch has wanted to play faster for a long time.

2. Contract. Fox is a $37 mil expiring. Does he want to stay in MIN? We moved Towns for financial freedom - does replacing that salary spot with the lesser Fox still work?

3. Uniqueness. Fox may be a top 50 NBA player, but only a top 15 NBA point guard. The point guard position is loaded with talent right now, and more on the way - the Spurs may have three potential stars at the position. With fewer buyers, and more sellers, economics should mean we shouldn’t pay a ton to get him.

Another way to look at position scarcity .. is Randle a more highly rated PF than Fox is a PG? What percent of nights would the Wolves have an advantage over the other team at each of those positions?

I'm not sure about Fox. I love parts of his game, but his lack of outside shooting and defense are worrisome - especially for the next contract he's going to get.

[Slim Tubby]

They won the #2 pick in the lottery, and the best player after Flagg is Dylan Harper, who’s a PG.

You'd think they would want to leverage the pick to get another vet star in to speed up the winning process. Do you think they'll stick w/ Fox even if they draft Harper? Or might they be thinking build long-term now that Wemby had the clot issue?

There is a lot of debate among Spurs fans which direction is best, with Fox, Harper, and ROY Castle - all starting guards.

For us, that means it’s quite possible Fox will become available.

I get the sense that the Spurs might be getting cold feet about Fox's next contract and landing #2 only intensifies those doubts with the opportunity to grab another talented PG on a Rookie deal.

Admittedly, I have a tendency to always overvalue the PG position because to me they are crucial to any team with Title aspirations. However, there is NO chance that Fox is worthy of a Max contract so I'd understand if he gets moved.

Even with more tread on his tires, I'd much rather have Derrick White than Fox if we are staying in "win now" mode rather than a minor rebuild and massaging of the current roster.



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[shrink]

What are your thoughts on going after Fox? He's a player that I wouldn't mind pairing with Ant. Although, I just saw that he had surgery on his left hand (pinky) in March.

I have a couple questions about Fox.

1. Fox is best when he is using his immense speed in the open court. That’s something we want Ant to do as well, but will he start to run if Fox is running? I could see that encouraging someone like Jaden McDaniels, and we know Finch has wanted to play faster for a long time.

2. Contract. Fox is a $37 mil expiring. Does he want to stay in MIN? We moved Towns for financial freedom - does replacing that salary spot with the lesser Fox still work?

3. Uniqueness. Fox may be a top 50 NBA player, but only a top 15 NBA point guard. The point guard position is loaded with talent right now, and more on the way - the Spurs may have three potential stars at the position. With fewer buyers, and more sellers, economics should mean we shouldn’t pay a ton to get him.

Another way to look at position scarcity .. is Randle a more highly rated PF than Fox is a PG? What percent of nights would the Wolves have an advantage over the other team at each of those positions?

1. If Ant can play the finisher on the break, I think he would run more. Especially if Finch and the team stress it going into next year. Does anyone know how often Ant scored in transition while Rubio, DLo, etc were here before Conley?

2. Can you expand on the bolded part? Is Fox really a lesser player than Towns (not sure if that's what you meant) or is it just more competitive at the guard position? There's a lot of "legacy" guards that ppl wouldn't allow Fox to jump even if he had stats/success to back it.

3. What pg would be ranked ahead of Fox in your opinion? Or even according to the stats/other metrics? His play style seems similar to Shai in that he can get to his spots fairly easy in the midrange, score in bunches, and has at one time been the best clutch player in the league. He's only 27 and could/should replicate those past performances.

I think it's a long shot to get/keep him but I do have that interest when you're talking about guard play.

1. Maybe. He has always been impressionable. But he doesn’t start breaks now, or run with breaks that others start.

2. I meant lesser in salary, and lesser in NBA player value. He certainly won’t get a supermax, but KAT’s size and skill make him less easy to replace than one of the many guards in the league. In addition, PG value is waning, as more and more teams put playmaking responsibilities in the hands of other positions.

3. Making me work here! Playmaking guards that I think are better than, or equal to Fox

SGA, Luka, Haliburton, Brunson, Curry, Lillard (out), Case, Garland, Kyrie (out), Herro these days, Maxey, Ja, LaMelo, Trae Young, Jamal Murray, Derek White, Jrue? .. that’s 15 active, so half the league has an “equal or sometimes vastly superior” matchup to Fox. And that’s not including players that are better at his function, like a Jokic.