Trade Talk (Part 16): Early Season Anxiety Edition

shrink · Post #341 » by **shrink** » Sun Dec 15, 2024 8:59 pm

Just a reminder, but today is the unofficial start of trade season. On December 15, players signed in 2024 free agency will become free agents, making a large number of players and salaries eligible to be included in trades.

But don’t get too excited. Front offices often wait until near the February deadline to make trades, lowering their asking price or raising their offers as the season progresses. We usually see only one decent deal in December, but still, front offices start talking and we start to hear trade rumors, so it’s an exciting couple of months.

Norseman79 · Post #342 » by **Norseman79** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 1:15 am

How about going after Tre Young?

shrink · Post #343 » by **shrink** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 2:25 am

Norseman79 wrote:How about going after Tre Young?

Because of the aprons that restrict MIN from aggregating salary, and not taking back more than we send out, MIN can only trade a player that makes more. The only player we could trade to get Young is Rudy

BlacJacMac · Post #344 » by **BlacJacMac** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 2:27 am

Norseman79 wrote:How about going after Tre Young?

Please no.

He was the #2 guy I really didn’t want to trade for.

(Randle was #1…)

wolves_89 · Post #345 » by **wolves_89** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 4:56 am

Klomp wrote:A name with Minnesota FO connections who would fill a need and should not be overly difficult to acquire:

Mo Bamba

I think Bamba would be an interesting addition in that his length is about as close to Gobert as there is in the league (7'0" with a 7'10" wingspan). Working with Rudy everyday and trying to copy his defensive game could be a great way for Mo to get his career back on track.

shrink · Post #346 » by **shrink** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 5:31 am

NAW is making himself indispensable.

FrenchMinnyFan · Post #347 » by **FrenchMinnyFan** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 6:01 am

[quote="shangrila"]Because I'm bored, here's a 5 teamer based on recent rumours/moves:

MIN out: Julius Randle
MIN in: Tim Hardaway Jr, Kyle Anderson, Kevon Looney
Cap impact: -100K
Reason - Guarantee shedding salary next season, make space for Naz as the starter, bring back fan favourite Kyle Anderson. I should mention this would require waiving Dozier.

Definitely like this one ! Will go for it. We have to find a way to see what NAZ is able to give as a regular starter before we sign him a big contract (or not).

Norseman79 · Post #348 » by **Norseman79** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 12:09 pm

shrink wrote:
Norseman79 wrote:How about going after Tre Young?

Because of the aprons that restrict MIN from aggregating salary, and not taking back more than we send out, MIN can only trade a player that makes more. The only player we could trade to get Young is Rudy

I thought this could be bypassed by involving a 3rd team? It works on fanspo, (which limits trades due to things like the second apron).

Norseman79 · Post #349 » by **Norseman79** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 12:10 pm

BlacJacMac wrote:
Norseman79 wrote:How about going after Tre Young?

Please no.

He was the #2 guy I really didn’t want to trade for.

(Randle was #1…)

Oh I hate him, but his offense would look pretty good right now

Norseman79 · Post #350 » by **Norseman79** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 12:26 pm

Still holding out hope for something. People who mention chemistry should remember we are winning despite Randle and DD right now, not because of them.

frankenwolf · Post #351 » by **frankenwolf** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 2:20 pm

winforlose wrote:True, but that doesn’t preclude getting a positive return. Instead we settled for a negative one. Keeping KAT this year and selling for more even value with one less year on the deal was an option. But TC wanted DDV more than he wanted to win. Just like he wanted Dozier more than a backup C or a PG3. TC is not trustworthy at this point.

IDK, DO you value DDV & Randle less than Dyson & Larry Nance? Sure, the Wolves only got one pick instead of two, but I think it was justifiable based on salary and the return. I still wouldn't have done it, but I don't have to deal with aprons and cash flow.

Thanks W4L, appreciate the input.

winforlose · Post #352 » by **winforlose** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 2:45 pm

frankenwolf wrote:
winforlose wrote:True, but that doesn’t preclude getting a positive return. Instead we settled for a negative one. Keeping KAT this year and selling for more even value with one less year on the deal was an option. But TC wanted DDV more than he wanted to win. Just like he wanted Dozier more than a backup C or a PG3. TC is not trustworthy at this point.

IDK, DO you value DDV & Randle less than Dyson & Larry Nance? Sure, the Wolves only got one pick instead of two, but I think it was justifiable based on salary and the return. I still wouldn't have done it, but I don't have to deal with aprons and cash flow.

Thanks W4L, appreciate the input.

So Karl is injury prone, and that hurts his value. I always say the best ability is availability, and I stick by that. However, true multi-positional versatility on both offense and defense is rare for a big. Karl can play all NBA C, or All Star PF. Karl’s shooting is beyond elite relative to his size. This means he can play with literally any big in the NBA. Moreover, given that KAT gelled as well as he did with Rudy (beyond wins and losses, the defensive and offensive connection was stellar,) that would make other GMs even more confident in any possible fit. Given all that, I think Karl had more value than Murray, despite the difference in salary. I get that holding him an extra year is a risk, but this was too much of a sell low. DDV was never going to be our starting SG, and clearly cannot play starting PG despite his ball skills. Randle is a wash, and the pick is terrible. This wasn’t a bad return for KAT, it was a catastrophic return for KAT.

shrink · Post #353 » by **shrink** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 2:54 pm

Norseman79 wrote:
shrink wrote:
Norseman79 wrote:How about going after Tre Young?

Because of the aprons that restrict MIN from aggregating salary, and not taking back more than we send out, MIN can only trade a player that makes more. The only player we could trade to get Young is Rudy

I thought this could be bypassed by involving a 3rd team? It works on fanspo, (which limits trades due to things like the second apron).

I think Spotrac is the only trade checker that incorporates the apron rules.

The only way to trade for a player that makes more would be for us to do a deal that ends with us dropping $10 mil in payroll, so we finish under the second apron and can aggregate salaries.

Read on Twitter

DaMplsKid · Post #354 » by **DaMplsKid** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 4:17 pm

I still want my Washington and Minnesota trade to go down.

MIn out - Randle (maybe the Pistons first)
Min in- Valanciunas and Brogdon

We get some Vet that help us win now. The back up 5 we need and helps keep Rudy health for a playoff run. Plus he is under a great contract and can become part of our team going forward. We also get a solid 2 way player who can play backup PG to move NAW and Donte off teh ball. Plus he is on an expiring contract.

Washington get Randle who can put up all the numbers he want on a bad team. They could pay him or let him walk after the season. Plus if we have to thrown in the draft pick they get something to build on.

Or if we want to get a #2 guy Ingram is the only one I would want out of teh rumored guys. Not sure how that works and not sure how we would be able to keep him with Reid and maybe NAW.

frankenwolf · Post #355 » by **frankenwolf** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 4:39 pm

winforlose wrote:
frankenwolf wrote:
winforlose wrote:True, but that doesn’t preclude getting a positive return. Instead we settled for a negative one. Keeping KAT this year and selling for more even value with one less year on the deal was an option. But TC wanted DDV more than he wanted to win. Just like he wanted Dozier more than a backup C or a PG3. TC is not trustworthy at this point.

IDK, DO you value DDV & Randle less than Dyson & Larry Nance? Sure, the Wolves only got one pick instead of two, but I think it was justifiable based on salary and the return. I still wouldn't have done it, but I don't have to deal with aprons and cash flow.

Thanks W4L, appreciate the input.

So Karl is injury prone, and that hurts his value. I always say the best ability is availability, and I stick by that. However, true multi-positional versatility on both offense and defense is rare for a big. Karl can play all NBA C, or All Star PF. Karl’s shooting is beyond elite relative to his size. This means he can play with literally any big in the NBA. Moreover, given that KAT gelled as well as he did with Rudy (beyond wins and losses, the defensive and offensive connection was stellar,) that would make other GMs even more confident in any possible fit. Given all that, I think Karl had more value than Murray, despite the difference in salary. I get that holding him an extra year is a risk, but this was too much of a sell low. DDV was never going to be our starting SG, and clearly cannot play starting PG despite his ball skills. Randle is a wash, and the pick is terrible. This wasn’t a bad return for KAT, it was a catastrophic return for KAT.

I cannot argue that. I truly believe that if KAT was still here, this would be a Championship team.

minimus · Post #356 » by **minimus** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 6:23 pm

Interesting thought. If TC somehow gets Lonzo Ball it means that he will be third NOP player in MIN (NAW, Randle, Ball). It means that... Finch and Lloyd have as much power in decision making as TC.

P.S. Lloyd also worked for UTA (Gobert, Conley, NAW, Ingles)

Klomp · Post #357 » by **Klomp** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 6:26 pm

minimus wrote:Interesting thought. If TC somehow gets Lonzo Ball it means that he will be third NOP player in MIN (NAW, Randle, Ball). It means that... Finch and Lloyd have as much power in decision making as TC.

P.S. Lloyd also worked for UTA (Gobert, Conley, NAW, Ingles)

Lloyd never worked in Utah, that's the Dell Demps factor

minimus · Post #358 » by **minimus** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 7:27 pm

Klomp wrote:
minimus wrote:Interesting thought. If TC somehow gets Lonzo Ball it means that he will be third NOP player in MIN (NAW, Randle, Ball). It means that... Finch and Lloyd have as much power in decision making as TC.

P.S. Lloyd also worked for UTA (Gobert, Conley, NAW, Ingles)

Lloyd never worked in Utah, that's the Dell Demps factor

Oh, well. But it makes my point even more accurate:

Demos, Finch and Lloyd have as much power in decision making as TC.

Post #359 » by **Calinks** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 9:37 pm

I'd like to see some kind of move. This team just doesn't seem as fun to watch as we have been the last few years. I watch the games but I don't get as much joy. Last season was peak but even the first mediocre Rudy year seemed more fun to me. For sure the Beverly, Vando, Beasley wolves were more fun for me. This team here is just kind of meh though I do enjoy seeing Dillingham.

shrink · Post #360 » by **shrink** » Mon Dec 16, 2024 9:41 pm

minimus wrote:
Klomp wrote:
minimus wrote:Interesting thought. If TC somehow gets Lonzo Ball it means that he will be third NOP player in MIN (NAW, Randle, Ball). It means that... Finch and Lloyd have as much power in decision making as TC.

P.S. Lloyd also worked for UTA (Gobert, Conley, NAW, Ingles)

Lloyd never worked in Utah, that's the Dell Demps factor

Oh, well. But it makes my point even more accurate:

Demos, Finch and Lloyd have as much power in decision making as TC.

Why do you think that? Sincere question, since I don’t know how their decision-making process works.