Identity crisis?

[TimberKat]

It took a long time for the team to gel after the Rudy trade. I would the same going forward for this team. You just hope it goes quicker than 2-3 seasons.

But finch, staff and the team seem to be slow learners. This is prob due to a lack of “exceptional” ball iq. The players are smarter than your average fan but among their peers…not so much.

I wouldn't compare the Gobert trade and the Randle trade in "time to get to know each other" because KAT was injured most of that season and Gobert wasn't himself at the start of the season. We also had D'lo, who apparently had no interest in learning how to pass to Gobert. Granted, this trade came pretty late in the pre-preseason, but there should be signs of acclimation by now, since nobody has been out for injuries for extended periods. They are definitely missing some chemistry, but I'm beginning to wonder if Randle is interested in being a team player.

Now we have 3 days off, I hope we figure some things out for offense. Also, figure out how to best trap opposing team all stars. I think Randle wants to be a team player. Maybe give them a couple more weeks. As it stand, this is a 43 win team (maybe as low as 37).

[Klomp]

I wish Finch was a little more like Popovitch and a little less like Thibodeau. One guy has made his career adapting to the talent he has in any given year, the other has spent all of his trying to hammer square pegs into round holes.

I don't think I could disagree more.

If this was the case, the three-big lineup would have never seen the light of day. They would have never even traded for Gobert either.

What has happened is that the FANS have not adapted to the talent on the roster. Placing expectations on them of an all-time great defensive team when it's simply not the identity of the players on the roster.

[Klomp]

It took a long time for the team to gel after the Rudy trade. I would the same going forward for this team. You just hope it goes quicker than 2-3 seasons.

But finch, staff and the team seem to be slow learners. This is prob due to a lack of “exceptional” ball iq. The players are smarter than your average fan but among their peers…not so much.

I wouldn't compare the Gobert trade and the Randle trade in "time to get to know each other" because KAT was injured most of that season and Gobert wasn't himself at the start of the season. We also had D'lo, who apparently had no interest in learning how to pass to Gobert. Granted, this trade came pretty late in the pre-preseason, but there should be signs of acclimation by now, since nobody has been out for injuries for extended periods. They are definitely missing some chemistry, but I'm beginning to wonder if Randle is interested in being a team player.

While it's not the exact same scenario, the team was still trying to develop chemistry during that season. Towns didn't get injured until Nov 28 I believe and the team was 10-10 going into that game. 10-11 after. (https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MIN/2023_games.html)

Any time you move/bring in a major piece, there is an adjustment period. Granted Towns' injury made take longer than it might've initially. I think there's been some positives with the team this year but the defense has not been up to par. Even though I believe they were 8th in def rating going into the last game against Phx.

I think the success of last season has us fans hungry for more but because of the slow start, some of the ptsd of prior seasons may be kicking in, myself included. I'm trying to give them time to figure it out. Especially since a lot of other teams are up and down currently too.

There's also a difference in acclimation when the trade happens on July 1 versus when it happens on October 3.

[Klomp]

I think there's been some positives with the team this year but the defense has not been up to par. Even though I believe they were 8th in def rating going into the last game against Phx.

This is another great point that needs to be considered.

They were on an all-time historic track last year. Regression was inevitable. But to be able to counter that defensive regression with offensive improvement is critical. There is also the pace component. Playing a few extra possessions per game will likely skew the defensive numbers even more.

In terms of the NBA landscape as a whole, we are fine.

[FrenchMinnyFan]

I'm not too worry for the moment. Boston, bucks when they win the title were not the best defensive team during the regular season but step up at PO. We are probably able to do the same.
Offense is much better than last year, ball movement too ( despite Randle and sometimes ANT keeping it too long). RD start to get some minutes. We are improving. It's just sometimes very frustrating because we are comparing last year and this year but the roster is different. We have to be patient, their will be some up and down again but i am confident we ended top 4-5 in the regular season and make a run in PO.

[frankenwolf]

I know that we have all complained about our defense this year, but I'm going to throw these two numbers out there and let y'all debate the benefits/drawbacks:

As of 11/17 Minnesota is 9th in Offensive rating and 12th in Defensive rating. Granted, not as good defensively as last year, but better offensively. I thought, at one time, we would be happy with a team that is in the top 10 in both categories. We are almost there.

[winforlose]

I know that we have all complained about our defense this year, but I'm going to throw these two numbers out there and let y'all debate the benefits/drawbacks:

As of 11/17 Minnesota is 9th in Offensive rating and 12th in Defensive rating. Granted, not as good defensively as last year, but better offensively. I thought, at one time, we would be happy with a team that is in the top 10 in both categories. We are almost there.

I hear you. But, we have played Portland 3 times, we have played Toronto, the Heat without Butler, the Suns without KD and Beal, the Nuggets lost Murray halfway through the game, ect… our rating is fudged because our schedule has been weak.

[Sealab2024]

Just stopped by Target downtown to get some things after work. Look up off the escalator and Naz, Julius and Mike Conley are standing there getting ready to take some kids shopping. Always a trip to see the guys out and about. Mike and Julius had huge smiles, Naz (per usual) looked like a tornado would be well advised to steer clear of him.

[Klomp]

Just stopped by Target downtown to get some things after work. Look up off the escalator and Naz, Julius and Mike Conley are standing there getting ready to take some kids shopping. Always a trip to see the guys out and about. Mike and Julius had huge smiles, Naz (per usual) looked like a tornado would be well advised to steer clear of him.

Whole team is there I think

[Sealab2024]

Just stopped by Target downtown to get some things after work. Look up off the escalator and Naz, Julius and Mike Conley are standing there getting ready to take some kids shopping. Always a trip to see the guys out and about. Mike and Julius had huge smiles, Naz (per usual) looked like a tornado would be well advised to steer clear of him.

Whole team is there I think

I'm sure they were. It looked like a charity thing with cameras and all. Just took me by surprise. Stop to get some bread and OJ for tomorrow morning, take the escalator to see if the checkout line is smaller upstairs, look up from being in my own world and there's Naz looking at me with Mike and Julius behind him. Plus I get taken aback with guys like Mike. We get so used to thinking of him as small but in the wild I'm considered a decently tall guy and Mike was barely shorter than me.

Made my evening anyways.

[shrink]

I was surprised to see Jaden McDaniels at the post office two weeks ago. He was leaning against a wall waiting in line, legs out, bent over 45%, and it was still shocking to see how long and tall that human being he was.

Part of me thought, “This can’t be right! You’re Jaden McDaniels - you get paid $20 mil a year and you’re waiting in a line for five minutes to get stamps?!?” Then I remembered he celebrated that multi-million dollar contract by going to Olive Garden. Maybe still a regular guy.

[Sealab2024]

I was surprised to see Jaden McDaniels at the post office two weeks ago. He was leaning against a wall waiting in line, legs out, bent over 45%, and it was still shocking to see how long and tall that human being he was.

Part of me thought, “This can’t be right! You’re Jaden McDaniels - you get paid $20 mil a year and you’re waiting in a line for five minutes to get stamps?!?” Then I remembered he celebrated that multi-million dollar contract by going to Olive Garden. Maybe still a regular guy.

I never heard that about the Olive garden.

[minimus]

Read on Twitter

To me the most glaring issue is rim protection and rebounding when our starters sit:
- our bench ranks 26th in rebounds per game (27th REB%)
- 29th in blocks per game

On bright side our bench is top-3 in EFG% and top-4 in TS%.

Defense of bench unit is a system issue because it is sum of a few factors:
- both Reid and Randle are undersized and bad help defenders
- first McDaniels subs is NAW, it means that MIN replaces 6'9" defender with 6'5" defender, but more importantly replaces full sized wing with guard. It means that with McDaniels on the bench MIN often plays with three guards in lineup

I see two ways to improve bench defense:

- go bigger at wings, by playing Minott more
- improve chemistry between Randle and Reid in defense
- bring here a defensive minded backup big who can provide rim protection and rebounding in 10-15 minutes

[minimus]

Another interesting stat this year is that in clutch situations MIN are in top-4 in TS%, top-5 in ORtg. Last season they were 22nd in ORtg, 17th in TS%. For those who wonder they were not elite in clutch in DRtg: only 24th.

Obviously it is small sample size, with some crazy shooting from Randle and Edwards. But I can also read it this way:

MIN are good at scoring when needed, but they are bad at being consistently defensively and lack attention to details. Small things are lacking such as box out, defensive rotations, 50/50 balls, ATO execution etc. I like Joe Mazzulla mentality: "Win on all the margins".

Watch on YouTube

It drives me crazy how many turnovers MIN have had in last game when players did not know how much time left for attack, or could not inbound the ball correctly, or simply could not decide who is low man in defense and who is going to closeout on perimeter.

Fixing this issues is NOT talent problem. It is about discipline, maturity and accountability.

[Klomp]

Another interesting stat this year is that in clutch situations MIN are in top-4 in TS%, top-5 in ORtg. Last season they were 22nd in ORtg, 17th in TS%. For those who wonder they were not elite in clutch in DRtg: only 24th.

Obviously it is small sample size, with some crazy shooting from Randle and Edwards. But I can also read it this way:

MIN are good at scoring when needed, but they are bad at being consistently defensively and lack attention to details. Small things are lacking such as box out, defensive rotations, 50/50 balls, ATO execution etc. I like Joe Mazzulla mentality: "Win on all the margins".

Watch on YouTube

It drives me crazy how many turnovers MIN have had in last game when players did not know how much time left for attack, or could not inbound the ball correctly, or simply could not decide who is low man in defense and who is going to closeout on perimeter.

Fixing this issues is NOT talent problem. It is about discipline, maturity and accountability.

To that point, I think even as currently constructed, this team will look better in the postseason that it does in the regular season. Games bog down in the playoffs, which is why adding a guy like Randle was so important.

[winforlose]

Another interesting stat this year is that in clutch situations MIN are in top-4 in TS%, top-5 in ORtg. Last season they were 22nd in ORtg, 17th in TS%. For those who wonder they were not elite in clutch in DRtg: only 24th.

Obviously it is small sample size, with some crazy shooting from Randle and Edwards. But I can also read it this way:

MIN are good at scoring when needed, but they are bad at being consistently defensively and lack attention to details. Small things are lacking such as box out, defensive rotations, 50/50 balls, ATO execution etc. I like Joe Mazzulla mentality: "Win on all the margins".

Watch on YouTube

It drives me crazy how many turnovers MIN have had in last game when players did not know how much time left for attack, or could not inbound the ball correctly, or simply could not decide who is low man in defense and who is going to closeout on perimeter.

Fixing this issues is NOT talent problem. It is about discipline, maturity and accountability.

To that point, I think even as currently constructed, this team will look better in the postseason that it does in the regular season. Games bog down in the playoffs, which is why adding a guy like Randle was so important.

I think some of these turnovers are chemistry and by April that will definitely be resolved. So we agree that turnovers should be less of an issue. That said, Randle needs to stop dribbling into a crowd and turning his back to the defender. That is a bad habit with a predictable outcome.

[Danimals]

History shows that Randles game is much less effective in the post season.

[Klomp]

History shows that Randles game is much less effective in the post season.

In the Thibs system, absolutely.

[Loaf_of_bread]

Randle has to be traded at the deadline, then we will find our identity.

[_AIJ_]

I still think that this team is due for a massive winning streak sooner rather than later